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  • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

    I like this trade suggestion but why do they give up Saric even if he is effectively out this year.
    Salary matching reasons.

    Comment


    • LJ2 wrote: View Post

      If they could convince Dragic to go back to Phoenix then it would be great. I'm sure they have some young big that can't get any playtime behind Ayton which we could develop. I just don't see Dragic agreeing to it is all.

      Atlanta could be a team interested in Dragic to give their playoff roster some help. They got a taste of a deep run last season so they might be willing to bite on a trade for Dragic if they think it can help them get there again. Atlanta has a log jam of young wings which Raps might be interested in.
      Reason Dragic left Phoenix was because he didn't trust management at the time. They brought in both Thomas and Bledsoe, and so he wasn't understanding why they needed so many guards.

      It's new management (same owner).. but he's also a vet, and is only on a 1 year deal. He'd be going to a chip contender here. That's a reason to suite up for 2 months and give his all for his next contract.

      Comment


      • Dragic wants to get bought out and sign with Dallas. Everyone around the league knows this by now. He doesn't want to go anywhere else (except maybe Miami and I don't think they can easily sign him back). So unless someone wants him badly and offers Toronto something useful/in line with cap/tax pressures, that's what's most likely to happen. Not the ending fans would prefer, but the options out there in a trade are slim and likely not want Toronto is seeking (young upside SG off the bench, or a needle-moving big under team control for next 2-3 years).

        Boucher might be a more likely candidate. Could bring back any number of 5-10M young SGs that Raps might like (Reddish is one example).

        Comment


        • planetmars wrote: View Post
          Phoenix got to the finals with Payne as a backup PG. Not sure they need another $19M backup.. but if its for a guy they don't see in their future (Smith), a guy that won't play this season (Saric) and some fringe guy that is deep on the bench.. they might.

          Would be absolutely ecstatic if it happened. We'd even save money on the deal further ducking the tax.
          I don't follow the Suns that close, but it looks like Payne is having a really shitty year. (32% 3P%, 97 ORTG, 48% TS). If I'm Phoenix, with championship aspirations, I wouldn't fully trust him as the backup PG going into the playoffs. I mean, the guy was almost out of the league just a few years ago.

          I guess they could stagger Booker at PG a bit. But still.... high IQ playmaking, shot creation and sure-handed ball-handling is always key in the playoffs. Can't have enough of it, even at the backup PG spot. Dragic brings all of that.

          Having said that, I'm pretty sure Payne will make at least 6 threes against our elite defense tonight. lol.

          Comment


          • Limited Upside wrote: View Post
            Dragic wants to get bought out and sign with Dallas. Everyone around the league knows this by now. He doesn't want to go anywhere else (except maybe Miami and I don't think they can easily sign him back). So unless someone wants him badly and offers Toronto something useful/in line with cap/tax pressures, that's what's most likely to happen. Not the ending fans would prefer, but the options out there in a trade are slim and likely not want Toronto is seeking (young upside SG off the bench, or a needle-moving big under team control for next 2-3 years).

            Boucher might be a more likely candidate. Could bring back any number of 5-10M young SGs that Raps might like (Reddish is one example).
            Boucher would be a great trade to a team like Minnesota who got 3 2nd rds, I think Boucher can get 2 2nd picks from them. But if the Raptors are making the playoffs will you trade away Boucher??

            I think the 3 players Raptors might be moving are Dragic, Boucher, and Flynn at the deadline

            Comment


            • I personally lean towards Dragic-Gordon,

              Please face it, Dragic essentially is our "Lowry" for this year, we tried to trade Lowry last year but didn't because not enough assets and his contract were too big to match, now we turned Lowry into Dragic(from a contract standpoint) and again we are in the similar place.

              If we want to get ANYTHING out of Dragic then lose him for nothing, we either get assets or we get a replacement kinda like the Lowry-Dragic situation and hope we can get something better out of the new person, and I think Eric Gordon is the best option that's out there.

              Basically, we are passing the "Torch" from Lowry-Dragic-Gordon, not the greatest solution but wise choice if there are really NO GOOD offers there from Dragic.

              Comment


              • golden wrote: View Post

                I don't follow the Suns that close, but it looks like Payne is having a really shitty year. (32% 3P%, 97 ORTG, 48% TS). If I'm Phoenix, with championship aspirations, I wouldn't fully trust him as the backup PG going into the playoffs. I mean, the guy was almost out of the league just a few years ago.

                I guess they could stagger Booker at PG a bit. But still.... high IQ playmaking, shot creation and sure-handed ball-handling is always key in the playoffs. Can't have enough of it, even at the backup PG spot. Dragic brings all of that.

                Having said that, I'm pretty sure Payne will make at least 6 threes against our elite defense tonight. lol.
                So what you're saying is...he's having a bad CamPayne?
                9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum

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                • KeonClark wrote: View Post

                  So what you're saying is...he's having a bad CamPayne?
                  Hall of Fame Bad Dad Joke.
                  And with the 4th overall pick the Toronto Raptors select..... Scottie Barnes.

                  Comment


                  • KeonClark wrote: View Post

                    So what you're saying is...he's having a bad CamPayne?


                    Comment


                    • LJ2 wrote: View Post

                      Ideal how? Raps are aggressively trying to develop their young core. Playing Gordon takes away from that.
                      Are they really?
                      Scottie barely initiates the offense and is the 4th option on offense.

                      Comment


                      • Kagemusha wrote: View Post

                        Are they really?
                        Scottie barely initiates the offense and is the 4th option on offense.
                        I reposted an article by 538... and this is seemingly incorrect. He actually initiates and runs the offence at a rate that has him second behind only FVV.

                        https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-its-paid-off/
                        Last edited by TrueTorontoFan; Tue Jan 11, 2022, 07:24 PM.

                        Comment


                        • Kagemusha wrote: View Post

                          Are they really?
                          Scottie barely initiates the offense and is the 4th option on offense.
                          The franchise has 2 priorities this season:

                          1a) Evaluate the playoff ceiling of the Siakam/FVV/OG core
                          1b) Develop young players

                          Ideally they want to do both.

                          But, if this core stays in solid playoff position heading into the all-star break, then they almost owe it them to give them the resources (i.e. decent bench players) that previous Raptors teams have had. Otherwise, it's not a fair evaluation of what this core can actually do.

                          Having said that, Nurse manages his bench guys with a harsh hand, making it difficult for them to find a rhythm. So, we might end up bringing in an established veteran bench guy like Gordon and he could suck with the Raptors because of how Nurse handles his non-starters and our system/fit.

                          Comment


                          • https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-its-paid-off/

                            Some quick quotes from the article:


                            After the Raptors selected Barnes, there were questions about how he would fit on offense alongside two forwards, Pascal Siakam and OG Anunoby, who are nearly identical to the rookie in size and who entered the season penciled into the starting lineup. But Barnes has had no problems producing next to Siakam and Anunoby; in fact, the team has played better when both are on the floor with him. Barnes’s plus/minus is -0.2 without Siakam and Anunoby on the floor, but that rises +2.8 when all three share the court.





                            Barnes has initiated the offense on 439 possessions this season, according to Second Spectrum, which ranks second on the team behind Fred VanVleet and is ahead of the team’s backup point guards. His rebounding prowess and open-court ball-handling have also created quick and easy shots for himself and his teammates in transition.

                            I think this should put to rest the notion that Barnes is seen as a 4th option. Nurse has said he needs to be more aggressive several times as well. He has the ability but that doesn't mean his mind works that way right now. The hints were all there from the people that have been high on him. Mike S from ESPN outlined it. Thorpe said the same thing. He is a we guy not a me guy sometimes to a fault. It is something that can change over time. Right now he is developing and developing well.


                            Comment


                            • DanH wrote: View Post
                              Issue with a Rubio deal is they already traded for Rondo to fill in those minutes. Not sure they'll be looking to acquire Dragic.
                              Yeah it was more likely pre Rondo but I'm assuming Rondo won't work out.

                              Comment


                              • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post
                                https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-its-paid-off/

                                Some quick quotes from the article:












                                I think this should put to rest the notion that Barnes is seen as a 4th option. Nurse has said he needs to be more aggressive several times as well. He has the ability but that doesn't mean his mind works that way right now. The hints were all there from the people that have been high on him. Mike S from ESPN outlined it. Thorpe said the same thing. He is a we guy not a me guy sometimes to a fault. It is something that can change over time. Right now he is developing and developing well.

                                I think some people just look at box scores and see his numbers are low and assume he isn't being used.

                                He actually brings the ball up or gets it at the top of the key to initiate a play quite a bit even with Fred, OG and Pascal there. He has had 10 and 14 shot attempts the last 2 games which is good, just missed a lot. The 3 games before that, he had 6, 7 and 9 shot attempts, which will occasionally happen with Fred and Pascal playing at an All NBA level. He had 8 assists in one of those games and 4 assists in another.

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