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Game #1 - Atlanta Hawks 102 - Toronto Raptors 109 (F)

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  • In general, we have to get this idea of, "we won, therefore, don't say anything negative" out of our system.

    It makes as little sense as saying, "we lost, therefore, don't say anything positive".

    Like others have said, there will be good and bad things to talk about regardless of the game's outcome. Why try and cork discussion?

    Comment


    • It's not about corking discussion. Discussion is fine. Over reaction needs to be corked. Yes there's some areas to improve on. But it's the first game. Why not give them a chance to improve then criticize.

      They had lapses of bad D. But when the game got close the raps would just buckle down run up the score a bit then resume at a lower effort. This early in the season conditioning is still an issue. There's no way to replicate an nba game through drills. U have to play and build up the stamina.

      Besides, good teams don't go full out all game. It's a long season. Look at how Miami played, they'd let u hang around until they decided enough was enough and they'd pummel you. Not saying the raps are the heat but 48 minutes of full effort doesn't happen in an NBA game
      Sunny ways my friends, sunny ways
      Because its 2015

      Comment


      • NaijaBoy17 wrote: View Post
        Getting to the free throw line might be the single most important thing a team can do on the offensive side of the ball.

        It is literally 90% of the reason that we won the game.
        You know who got to the line 10x and hit 9?

        The guy benched to end the game!!!

        Lol

        Comment


        • Uncle_Si wrote: View Post
          It's not about corking discussion. Discussion is fine. Over reaction needs to be corked. Yes there's some areas to improve on. But it's the first game. Why not give them a chance to improve then criticize.

          They had lapses of bad D. But when the game got close the raps would just buckle down run up the score a bit then resume at a lower effort. This early in the season conditioning is still an issue. There's no way to replicate an nba game through drills. U have to play and build up the stamina.

          Besides, good teams don't go full out all game. It's a long season. Look at how Miami played, they'd let u hang around until they decided enough was enough and they'd pummel you. Not saying the raps are the heat but 48 minutes of full effort doesn't happen in an NBA game
          Over reaction is subjective.

          But whatever. To each his own.

          Comment


          • Nilanka wrote: View Post
            In general, we have to get this idea of, "we won, therefore, don't say anything negative" out of our system.

            It makes as little sense as saying, "we lost, therefore, don't say anything positive".

            Like others have said, there will be good and bad things to talk about regardless of the game's outcome. Why try and cork discussion?
            Just as with an almost identical statement by DanH, that's a preposterous characterization of the discussion that has taken place. Most of these "some people", as DanH has anonymously referred to, have presented valid arguments against the accuracy and/or fairness of specific "negatives" being raised, and at no time did they present some simplistic "we won, so you can't say negatives" crap. Some of the subsequent counterarguments, from the "negative side" aren't holding much water, so now it's resorting to this misrepresentation defense of "we have a right to criticize". Yup, and others have a right to present their opinions of those criticisms. Forums aren't just for a few dominant people to state their case, and everyone else must hold their piece.

            DanH wrote: View Post
            I find it really jarring that anyone would say "we won, so you can't criticize anything."

            Process over results, people. Process is what leads to future wins. Winning this game in spite of bad decisions (and there were plenty of good moves too, but it is valid to point out the bad ones) is not a good ding for the next game.

            This team is no championship contender yet. So yes, there is loads of room for improvement. And a game where the team came perilously close to blowing a 20 point lead is actually a pretty opportune time to point out said room.

            Casey screwed up by underplaying JV. DD screwed up almost every time he touched the ball. They hopefully recognize these issues like some of us do and will seek to improve on them in future, giving us a better chance of being a truly elite team. Hopefully they don't hide behind the win as an excuse not to look to improve, like some posters here.
            "Casey screwed up by underplaying JV."
            You do understand that this is nothing more than opinion, right? That doesn't make it fact. "Some people" have already presented arguments against that opinion, so why not address them, instead of this misrepresented ""we won, so you can't criticize anything." crap?

            "DD screwed up almost every time he touched the ball."
            Seriously, where to begin? Yeah, he really screwed up touching the ball on those 11 rebounds and 6 steals and 3 assists, which could have easily been a few more. Did you see that nice shovel pass to JV under the basket, that doesn't show up on the boxscore because JV was fouled? He also created offense for others by breaking down the defense on other occasions, that also don't show up on the stat sheet. "almost every time..." is certainly no way toward a sensible discussion, and the kind of over-the-top negativity that some are responding to. Geeez.

            DanH wrote: View Post
            Thanks, yeah, I do actually read the thread before posting.

            He also played 6 out of 12 minutes in the third after barely playing in the first half. He should have played more in the first half - the idea of benching players with three fouls is actually really stupid - all it does is ensure they end up with 20 minutes or less even though they might not pick up another foul - and he should have played more in the third, and should have seen more time in the 4th, instead of Casey playing into the Hawks' game plan by going small. Even with foul trouble in the first Q, he should have seen at least 26 or 28 minutes. And he should be seeing 30-32 minutes regularly. Especially on nights where he is dominating like that.
            "yeah, I do actually read the thread before posting."
            Then why not respond to the counterarguments to your opinions, that have already been presented? Instead, you present a very inaccurate characterization of the discussion, and basically bring it all back to the beginning, as if no discussion has taken place.

            The rest of this is a bunch of "should haves" that paint you as some brilliant coaching mind, and Casey as stupid. Are you serious? You need to take a humble pill, then accept that there can be much at play in these decisions that you know nothing about. To say nothing of you're ripping Casey for things that every professional coach in the NBA does at given times. You really think you know better than the entire league of coaches?

            I've no time to go over each of the items, but how about this oft repeated "RR cliche" of "not playing into the opposition's hand". What you call that, some would call it adjusting to the changing circumstances of the game. As in the game is coming down to crunch time, the opponent is loaded with good 3 pt shooters, and are filling the floor with them. A defense first coach, with only a couple of minutes left in the game, and knowing the opponent needs to get 3 pointers, is going to put out his best 3 pt defensive unit he's got,,,, every time, every coach. He'd be "stupid" not to. Casey actually played JV a lot in the fourth. In fact, up until the last 2:27, whenever Horford was on the floor. He played 8 of 12 minutes. But you say he shouldn't have adjusted to the Hawks' hand, and should have kept JV out there for the last 2:27. So,,, in light of you're "it's stupid to play into their hand" stance, how exactly did that play into their hand? Did they start pounding the rock inside because JV wasn't in? No, they kept hoisting up 3s. How did Casey play into their hand by having a more appropriate defensive unit out there? To say they still got 3s, as you later state, is irrelevant to whether Casey made the right sub or not. He played into their hand is absurd. It's like saying if the Hawks put out a big unit, with the intent to pound it inside, Casey should have pulled JV and put in a small unit to counter them. Yeah, that's it, don't adjust to what those guys do, but screw up their plans by putting out a less appropriate defensive unit. That'll get them alright.

            Comment


            • why you guys make me read so much?
              For still frame photograph of me reading the DeRozan thread please refer to my avatar

              Comment


              • PS. In his first game of the season, Lebron went 5/15, and compered to DD, had 6 fewer RBs, 1 more AST, 6 fewer STLs, and 3 more TOs. I wonder if Cavs fans are pissing all over Lebron as having "screwed up every time he touched the ball", as "constructive criticism" in a LOSS to the effing Knicks! Blatt must be stupid for playing him 43 minutes, as that must have cost them the game against a bad team.

                Comment


                • chico wrote: View Post
                  PS. In his first game of the season, Lebron went 5/15, and compered to DD, had 6 fewer RBs, 1 more AST, 6 fewer STLs, and 3 more TOs. I wonder if Cavs fans are pissing all over Lebron as having "screwed up every time he touched the ball", as "constructive criticism" in a LOSS to the effing Knicks! Blatt must be stupid for playing him 43 minutes, as that must have cost them the game against a bad team.
                  You really comparing LeBron and DeMar ?

                  LMFAO
                  you've really lost it Chico
                  "Both teams played hard my man" - Sheed

                  Comment


                  • MACK11 wrote: View Post
                    You really comparing LeBron and DeMar ?

                    LMFAO
                    you've really lost it Chico
                    I compared two stat lines.

                    LMFAO
                    you haven't found anything to lose yet, mack

                    Comment


                    • MACK11 wrote: View Post
                      You really comparing LeBron and DeMar ?

                      LMFAO
                      you've really lost it Chico
                      Considering the stat lines, I don't know why its so crazy to compare them?

                      Comment


                      • Joey wrote: View Post
                        Considering the stat lines, I don't know why its so crazy to compare them?
                        It is crazy because

                        1) I must have missed the part where people are saying DD screwed up every time he touched the ball, and

                        2) Have you seen lebrons previous 842 games, 158 playoff games, 10 all-stars, 10 all nba, and 4 league MVP?


                        Comparisons without context is the talk of craziness.

                        Comment


                        • mcHAPPY wrote: View Post
                          It is crazy because

                          1) I must have missed the part where people are saying DD screwed up every time he touched the ball, and

                          2) Have you seen lebrons previous 842 games, 158 playoff games, 10 all-stars, 10 all nba, and 4 league MVP?


                          Comparisons without context is the talk of craziness.
                          1. yeah, I guess you missed it, but it doesn't mean DanH didn't say it. It's there.
                          2. the discussion is all about the reactions to the first game, which I compared 2 players' first games. the discussion isn't about careers

                          Comment


                          • no it isnt, he was illustrating a point, not comparing players.

                            If you wanna fuck with perception it goes both ways.

                            You guys all need to read most of this... A GAME THREAD and give your heads a shake.

                            It was one game of 82, not a bad game, a win and overall pretty cool. Why on EARTH there are arguments and ridiculous, and I mean RIDICULOUS arguments afterward is beyond me. I will chalk it up to residual offseason hangover syndrome...but fuck, get it together boys, its just basketball.

                            Comment


                            • mcHAPPY wrote: View Post
                              It is crazy because

                              1) I must have missed the part where people are saying DD screwed up every time he touched the ball, and

                              2) Have you seen lebrons previous 842 games, 158 playoff games, 10 all-stars, 10 all nba, and 4 league MVP?


                              Comparisons without context is the talk of craziness.
                              1)
                              DanH wrote: View Post
                              DD screwed up almost every time he touched the ball.
                              2) I have seen Lebrons past games, yes. Perhaps not all 842 of them ... Not sure why that makes it so we can't compare their opening game stat lines? They're both basketball players who put up similar stat lines... Fair game if you ask me.

                              I would never make the comparison myself, but I don't think its fair to call someone "Crazy" when they do.

                              Comment


                              • chico wrote: View Post
                                PS. In his first game of the season, Lebron went 5/15, and compered to DD, had 6 fewer RBs, 1 more AST, 6 fewer STLs, and 3 more TOs. I wonder if Cavs fans are pissing all over Lebron as having "screwed up every time he touched the ball", as "constructive criticism" in a LOSS to the effing Knicks! Blatt must be stupid for playing him 43 minutes, as that must have cost them the game against a bad team.
                                I think it's absolutely fair to criticize the game performance, or even certain aspects of his performance in that game. Pointing out rightful criticisms of particular aspects of a player's performance within a single game is exactly what a post-game analysis is meant to be, and doing so doesn't mean you're criticizing the player in general, or in overall/absolute terms.

                                That's why I don't understand the backlash against anybody pointing out negatives in the game, especially when it comes to DeRozan. Hell, I even lead off my criticism with 2 compliments - I said that his overall effort and rebounding impressed me, and said that I was even willing to overlook his dreadfully inefficient scoring night. My only criticism of him was to say that in a game when his shot wasn't falling (and he wasn't getting the calls), his reversion to hero-ball in the 4th quarter (basically poor decision-making to force his own offensive game via ISO-plays) helped fuel Atlanta's run, which almost resulted in a huge blown lead.

                                You've yet to come back against me with anything to dispute my criticism. You kept telling me to stop bringing up negatives and that "I just don't get it". I think my assessment of DeRozan's game - both the positive and negative aspects - was quite fair. I also think he should easily be able to improve in future games, so it's not like I was criticizing him in general terms; my criticism was limited to the 4th quarter of game 1.

                                Comment

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