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GAME ONE, 2021-22 SEASON: Washington Wizards @ Toronto Raptors - Wed Oct 20th 7:30pmET TSN

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  • slaw wrote: View Post

    The Raptors offense is completely reliant on hitting threes. If they don't make lots of threes there are simply no other ways for them to score other than in transition. I don't know what the magic number is but 20% from beyond the arc in a game isn't good enough even if the other team is worse. When you're shooting 35-40 threes a game you need to make them.

    Now, you might ask, how does that align with creating a roster of 6'7 guys with diverse skillsets who are good passers, movers and potentially playmakers but not great shooters? Don't know. But it is what it is and it isn't changing.
    Thats how this offense is and will be until OG, Pascal, Barnes, Banton or whoever become reliable mid range scorers.

    Fortunately Fred, OG, GTJ and Boucher are all closer to 40% as 3 point shooters and when you are making 3s, the other parts of the floor open up.

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    • Dvdvideo wrote: View Post

      It's agreed that lots of coaches complain, but nick seems to do it more often and take it to another level. I get that he cares if he wins, but screaming at the zebras the entire game isn't the way.
      Maybe it's just as bad at other teams and we don't notice it as much, but it sure doesn't seem like it.
      Besides, if everyone is horrible, is that really the benchmark we want to reach for?
      Can't disagree with you more here. There is no advantage to being polite to the refs and screaming at them all game absolutely moves the calls your way. Coach K made a freaking career out of it in college. The refs aren't going to give us worse calls to stick it to Nurse. They're going to send more calls our way so they don't get yelled at more.

      You see the same thing with the top players too. They are always giving the refs an earful and they get better calls in return. Nurse is a championship coach and he's earned the right to bitch every game.

      Comment


      • slaw wrote: View Post

        The Raptors offense is completely reliant on hitting threes. If they don't make lots of threes there are simply no other ways for them to score other than in transition...
        The Raptors shot 34 threes. They hit 7 of them. They lost by 15 points. They don't need to make a lot of them. In this game they just needed to make 13 out of the 34 to win. And actually, not that many because if they had hit those extra 6 threes, they wouldn't have had the Wizards jamming transition plays down their throats off of rebounds.

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        • My eyeballs feel hungover from last night.

          Nice to see the fans pumped for the game. The opening ceremony was pretty cool. Didn't expect a Kardinal Offishall performance. I believe it was a sell out which is remarkable giving the price for the tickets. I saw that Drake left at half time lol. I was going to as well, but stuck through it.

          As for the game itself, just a complete dog's breakfast. OG was brutal on the offensive end. 3-17! Gross. Fred was all over the place and was 5-20 himself. But made his first 3, so what happened? No answer at all for Harrell. Can we bring Serge back? Serge was the best at handling energy bigs.

          We had some great defensive stops, and then blew it on the next possession with a turnover or an ill timed shot. The same crap happened last year too. We panic when we are on a fast break or something. I mean if we hit on most of those transition opportunities we would have likely won, or at least made it a close game. Banton was the most in control in fast breaks. And he was awesome in his limited minutes. Just brought the right kind of energy. Happy to see him out there over Flynn as well.

          Svi looked invisible. Trent did as well. But he was a +6. I guess he got lucky playing with Scottie and Banton in the 4th quarter. Nice that he got pulled though. Boucher still loves to shoot it. I know we want everyone to push the ball, but can we exclude Birch from that responsibility? That strip and free dunk/layup was so bad.

          Surprised to not see Dekker out there considering he went ham against the same Wizards in the preseason.

          I mean it sucks to be blown out in our first home game after 600 days away. To the Washington Wizards of all teams. But it's only 1 game. Let's use the 8 game rest as rust excuse I guess. Will help us sleep better at night.

          Comment


          • OG looked off even before the game started. He just seemed disinterested... I know that is his usual schtick, but it seemed unusual even for him. Reading his body language in warmups, through the opening ceremonies, and then he just looked defeated in the latter part of the first quarter. I'm hoping we see the regular OG going forward.

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            • OG and Fred seemed like they might have took the brunt of the stress being the only two starters that had played a game at home. I think in doing so they might have focused on preparing their teammates and potentially overlooked that they were not prepared themselves. I think we also have to admit that neither would be your go-to stars to start a team. They might have also stressed too much being the new leaders of the team. Regardless they were a step off.

              Goran and Fred are not the answer. They can't coexist like Lowry and Freddy did. I think Trent needs to start to see how he reacts to that responsibility. I feel like a lot of young players they have been the man their entire lives growing up, and coming off the bench; messes with them more than it should. Give him a chance and see how it goes.

              Banton was amazing. If he develops like he should in this system, looking back to his first ever basket will always be amazing. What a shot. He looked poised and confident, which I didn't really get during preseason. Him and Barnes as the backcourt is a scary, scary thought. They were awesome together. The potential there is sky high!

              On that note if Goran and Fred can't really coexist on the floor together, and Banton and Barnes are the future backcourt, Malachi and Goran are dispensable. Both could be valuable trade assets. I still think we need a big centre to bang around with the big guys in the league, maybe they, (with a couple other pieces) could get us a decent one.

              All in all it was one of the more enjoyable losses I've watched in awhile. The youth are going to have growing pains but the potential is obvious.


              Comment


              • Shredder wrote: View Post
                OG and Fred seemed like they might have took the brunt of the stress being the only two starters that had played a game at home. I think in doing so they might have focused on preparing their teammates and potentially overlooked that they were not prepared themselves. I think we also have to admit that neither would be your go-to stars to start a team. They might have also stressed too much being the new leaders of the team. Regardless they were a step off.

                Goran and Fred are not the answer. They can't coexist like Lowry and Freddy did. I think Trent needs to start to see how he reacts to that responsibility. I feel like a lot of young players they have been the man their entire lives growing up, and coming off the bench; messes with them more than it should. Give him a chance and see how it goes.

                Banton was amazing. If he develops like he should in this system, looking back to his first ever basket will always be amazing. What a shot. He looked poised and confident, which I didn't really get during preseason. Him and Barnes as the backcourt is a scary, scary thought. They were awesome together. The potential there is sky high!

                On that note if Goran and Fred can't really coexist on the floor together, and Banton and Barnes are the future backcourt, Malachi and Goran are dispensable. Both could be valuable trade assets. I still think we need a big centre to bang around with the big guys in the league, maybe they, (with a couple other pieces) could get us a decent one.

                All in all it was one of the more enjoyable losses I've watched in awhile. The youth are going to have growing pains but the potential is obvious.

                I think we need to take a look at Fred more so than Goran vs Trent. Fred is just not starting level point guard. Replace Fred with Lowry and all of the sudden Lowry & Goran works and Lowry & Trent works.

                Fred can't have so much ball handling duty. But we don't have a point guard really. so there's no solution. You can replace Goran with Trent and problem will be the same.

                I mean as long as Fred is still on roster and starting we will have problems in backcourt. That's just roster construction.
                Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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                • MixxAOR wrote: View Post

                  I think we need to take a look at Fred more so than Goran vs Trent. Fred is just not starting level point guard. Replace Fred with Lowry and all of the sudden Lowry & Goran works and Lowry & Trent works.

                  Fred can't have so much ball handling duty. But we don't have a point guard really. so there's no solution. You can replace Goran with Trent and problem will be the same.

                  I mean as long as Fred is still on roster and starting we will have problems in backcourt. That's just roster construction.
                  Fred not being Lowry doesn't mean he's not a starting quality guard. It means he's not Kyle Lowry.

                  Fred was downright functional as a PG last season with Pascal there to soak up primary offence (and playing a lot of games sans Kyle). Right now we have no one. I do think we should be pumping Barnes with as much primary creation as possible while Pascal is out, see what ceiling he runs into in the short term, and maybe that helps Fred and OG with their offensive roles a bit.

                  I don't think the problem stays the same if Trent is out there instead of Goran. Trent sliding into an off ball role should move the ball into the frontcourt more often and let Fred at least run actions with the bigger guys instead of handing the ball back and forth between the guards. Another thing that worked with Lowry because of Lowry, but they will need to try to get away from.
                  twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                  • MixxAOR wrote: View Post

                    I think we need to take a look at Fred more so than Goran vs Trent. Fred is just not starting level point guard. Replace Fred with Lowry and all of the sudden Lowry & Goran works and Lowry & Trent works.

                    Fred can't have so much ball handling duty. But we don't have a point guard really. so there's no solution. You can replace Goran with Trent and problem will be the same.

                    I mean as long as Fred is still on roster and starting we will have problems in backcourt. That's just roster construction.
                    FVV had lots of great games as a primary ballhandler 2 seasons ago and again last season. He gets in trouble when he tries to do too much and sometimes he get selfish but it also seems as though a lot of that is you've got 5 guys standing around doing nothing and the ball lands back with him and, then, what do you want him to do?

                    Fred has his flaws but he gets way too much heat for the offense when there are much bigger problems on that end of the floor.

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                    • DanH wrote: View Post

                      Fred not being Lowry doesn't mean he's not a starting quality guard. It means he's not Kyle Lowry.

                      Fred was downright functional as a PG last season with Pascal there to soak up primary offence (and playing a lot of games sans Kyle). Right now we have no one. I do think we should be pumping Barnes with as much primary creation as possible while Pascal is out, see what ceiling he runs into in the short term, and maybe that helps Fred and OG with their offensive roles a bit.

                      I don't think the problem stays the same if Trent is out there instead of Goran. Trent sliding into an off ball role should move the ball into the frontcourt more often and let Fred at least run actions with the bigger guys instead of handing the ball back and forth between the guards. Another thing that worked with Lowry because of Lowry, but they will need to try to get away from.
                      I hope to see that next game, let Barnes be the primary creator with FVV and Trent off ball to spread the floor. If Barnes gets stuck he has FVV as an outlet.

                      They've got to do a better job spreading out the defense if the emphasis this season is to have guys cutting and diving to the basket for easy buckets.

                      Comment


                      • slaw wrote: View Post

                        FVV had lots of great games as a primary ballhandler 2 seasons ago and again last season. He gets in trouble when he tries to do too much and sometimes he get selfish but it also seems as though a lot of that is you've got 5 guys standing around doing nothing and the ball lands back with him and, then, what do you want him to do?

                        Fred has his flaws but he gets way too much heat for the offense when there are much bigger problems on that end of the floor.
                        Nothing he can do. I just think we really need an upgrade at that position.
                        Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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                        • LJ2 wrote: View Post

                          I hope to see that next game, let Barnes be the primary creator with FVV and Trent off ball to spread the floor. If Barnes gets stuck he has FVV as an outlet.

                          They've got to do a better job spreading out the defense if the emphasis this season is to have guys cutting and diving to the basket for easy buckets.
                          Ya, I agree with this. Barnes playing the point, FVV SG, and Gary Trent SF. Put Scottie into the fire, let him get involved, it's a waste of his talents and spacing letting him hover around the 3pt line.

                          When Pascal comes back, I think Gary should come off the bench.

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                          • Nick Nurse has to accept the fact that the future is Scottie Barnes so it has to come from him to taper down the usage and role of Van Vleet.

                            The 5 for 20 field goals with (25%), 1 for 9 from the 3 point line (11%), 1 fo1 free throw, 4 assists in 35 minutes of playing time is NOT the way to go.

                            Defenses would zero in on him and OG while Siakam is still out. WHY he has to trust his teammates.

                            p.s. To help the cause, as I said, this ain’t the playoffs. Nick Nurse should play all his guys. 35 minutes for Fred Van Vleet is fucking ridiculous
                            You cannot cancel me out dumb dumb, I will always be in that little nugget of yours camping like a mosquito https://forums.raptorsrepublic.com/c...ilies/wink.png

                            When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers


                            Comment


                            • Fred has a tough job running point with these new faces on the team. We saw it last game, I believe it was Scottie who threw a no look pass to Precious on the break, Precious thought it was gonna be a lob and jumped, ball sailed out of bounds. Chemistry will be an issue.

                              Fred, just like Pascal after Kawhi left, will need time to adjust and develop as the primary guard. Before this season he was the 3rd option, Kyle was the main ball handler and Pascal was the main scorer who handled the ball as well.

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                              • saints91 wrote: View Post

                                Ya, I agree with this. Barnes playing the point, FVV SG, and Gary Trent SF. Put Scottie into the fire, let him get involved, it's a waste of his talents and spacing letting him hover around the 3pt line.

                                When Pascal comes back, I think Gary should come off the bench.
                                Honestly, they wasted a full season by tanking just to get the best available talent from the draft, hoping that he turns out to be the Alpha.

                                Now that they have Scottie Barnes…you maximize all your resources for this guy to properly develop by allowing him to make mistakes, have him initiate the offense, grant him the minutes that his body would allow and have your complementary guy most especially Mr. Van Vleet to defer to him.

                                So stupid to keep forcing the issue, because the Master Splinter is gone…you grant everything to Van Vleet. This narrative is so Stupid. Leadership does not equate possessions and usage.

                                They tank because none of the current guys are capable to be the IT guy.
                                You cannot cancel me out dumb dumb, I will always be in that little nugget of yours camping like a mosquito https://forums.raptorsrepublic.com/c...ilies/wink.png

                                When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers


                                Comment

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