Game FOUR (Here's looking at you Scottie) Bulls at Raptors Monday October 25th 7:30pm on TSN

[Primer]

I am surprised at so much pessimism with the team.

.... there is an overhaul happening with the team ... at least 3 new recruits on the starting 5... and a bench not yet set
... there is an effort to change to a more exciting/dynamic playing m.o. ... this is difficult ... this is also affecting the half-court offense I think
... we need to give these players more than a week ... more like a month before getting too upset with losses
... there is always effort and more effort
... Siakam and Yuta have yet to play
... Nurse is currently experimenting with his lineups

I am enjoying the ride ... this team will beat the Bulls next time they meet

I'd like to add that we are losing to good teams, playoff teams, teams we were supposed to lose to, not trash teams. That is very important context when deciding how hard to melt over a loss. The Bulls are undefeated still, it's not the end of the world to lose a very close game to them.

[big boi]

Point is, just because Fred isn't Lowry, doesn't mean Fred is bad. Fred is a good nba starting guard. We were just spoiled with a great one for 8 straight years.

Again, I agree. Fred can be a good starting guard in this league. But he needs to understand his limitations and play within them. There are better players on this team than Fred, and this can't be the Fred show if we want to be successful. It wasn't even the Lowry show a lot of the time and as you've already conceded he's a vastly superior player.

[inthepaint]

Fred was not the problem yesterday. In fact, he's the reason we were able to keep it close at the end to begin with. We wanted him to be a better playmaker/distributor rather than just look for his own, he did it, dropped 17 dimes. Yes, there were a lot of turnovers but there are 2 parts to a pass, the receiver is part of it too. If they're out of position and/or butter hands, that will inflate the turnovers.

Turnovers are endemic on this team, as expected because (a) they're very green, (b) want play very fast and push the ball to capitalize in transition and (c) they haven't played together very long. All that will be mitigated with time.

Encouraging that they shot 40% from 3. That is KEY going forward. Dragic was 0-3. Iff he knocks down 1 or 2 that's a completely different game. It'll come.

[saints91]

Again, I agree. Fred can be a good starting guard in this league. But he needs to understand his limitations and play within them. There are better players on this team than Fred, and this can't be the Fred show if we want to be successful. It wasn't even the Lowry show a lot of the time and as you've already conceded he's a vastly superior player.

Listening to Fred's recent interviews I don't think recognizes what his limitations are and IMO he thinks he's less ball dominate than he actually is. He alluded to Scottie having the ball a lot "For better or worse".

[planetmars]

Again, I agree. Fred can be a good starting guard in this league. But he needs to understand his limitations and play within them. There are better players on this team than Fred, and this can't be the Fred show if we want to be successful. It wasn't even the Lowry show a lot of the time and as you've already conceded he's a vastly superior player.

In fairness to Fred, we don't have a lot of guys that can create their own shot. Lowry got to play with DeMar (and then Kawhi, and then Pascal). He could dump it into JV and let him go to work in the post as well. Kyle was/is the better player, but he had the luxury of being the second or third option every time.

Fred has to create more because there is nobody else that can right now. OG tried, but it didn't really work out. He's still best as the catch and shoot guy. Trent is catch and shoot. Khem is a release valve like Serge was. But again can't create his own shot. Precious can do somethings but he's still raw. Scottie is not wired to be a scorer. He's a pass first guy even though he's typically taller/stronger than the guy that's defending him. Dragic is washed. Boucher is in the dog house, yet I don't think anyone wants him to create his own shot either.

[The Great One]

If there is one aspect of the offense they have to clean up is points in transition. I am losing hair watching them fumble up plays when they are on a 2-1 or 3-1 fast break. We got the stop. We got the fast break with a man advantage. Yet we fuck it up, and then now can't get back in time and give the other team a chance to score with a man advantage. And they always do.

It's so annoying to see our points off turnovers so low.

Agreed, One of the biggest reasons they lost last night was they kept missing layups/bunnies. Precious and FVV continues to miss layups. Dragic missed 2 and Birch missed 1.

[The Great One]

Also want to add, they need to stop isoing OG. They need to stop this experiment. He's not that dude. He's so robotic and awkward with his movement. Most of his points last night once again came from spot up 3 and bully ball. I don't think he scored on an iso. He tried going 1 on 1 against Lonzo and Pat Williams(both elite defenders), it didn't work well for him.

[The Claw Reborn]

we play at home in front of screaming fans

COVID-19 is almost behind us

what other excuse should I throw out to this inquisitive media why we are still losing?

aha…No Siakam, otherwise everything is hunky-dory

right?

[slaw]

In fairness to Fred, we don't have a lot of guys that can create their own shot. Lowry got to play with DeMar (and then Kawhi, and then Pascal). He could dump it into JV and let him go to work in the post as well. Kyle was/is the better player, but he had the luxury of being the second or third option every time.

Fred has to create more because there is nobody else that can right now. OG tried, but it didn't really work out. He's still best as the catch and shoot guy. Trent is catch and shoot. Khem is a release valve like Serge was. But again can't create his own shot. Precious can do somethings but he's still raw. Scottie is not wired to be a scorer. He's a pass first guy even though he's typically taller/stronger than the guy that's defending him. Dragic is washed. Boucher is in the dog house, yet I don't think anyone wants him to create his own shot either.

I think everyone knew the lack of playmakers and shot creators was going to be a big issue. Barnes is the only guy who can do both and he's not ready yet. Pascal can do both, too, so him coming back will help a lot.

[golden]

I think everyone knew the lack of playmakers and shot creators was going to be a big issue. Barnes is the only guy who can do both and he's not ready yet. Pascal can do both, too, so him coming back will help a lot.

Not you, slaw, but a lot of ‘fans’ finally realizing how impactful Pascal is to the team. At this rate, he’ll have his jersey in the rafters and a statue built for him by the time he’s ready to return. Lol.

[KeonClark]

Not you, slaw, but a lot of ‘fans’ finally realizing how impactful Pascal is to the team. At this rate, he’ll have his jersey in the rafters and a statue built for him by the time he’s ready to return. Lol.

Should be a matter of days now

[big boi]

Also want to add, they need to stop isoing OG. They need to stop this experiment. He's not that dude. He's so robotic and awkward with his movement. Most of his points last night once again came from spot up 3 and bully ball. I don't think he scored on an iso. He tried going 1 on 1 against Lonzo and Pat Williams(both elite defenders), it didn't work well for him.

I think it's worth experimenting with. At this stage I think OG has earned the benefit of the doubt regarding his ability to work on his game and evolve as a player

[TrueTorontoFan]

we play at home in front of screaming fans

COVID-19 is almost behind us

what other excuse should I throw out to this inquisitive media why we are still losing?

aha…No Siakam, otherwise everything is hunky-dory

right?

So if boston lost tatum for 10 games it wouldn't matter?


or do you just want to be pessimistic 4 games into a season.

[Dvdvideo]

Point is, just because Fred isn't Lowry, doesn't mean Fred is bad. Fred is a good nba starting guard. We were just spoiled with a great one for 8 straight years.

And it's also important to remember that everything gets easier when your best player is back. Fred doesn't have to create as much, and can shoot more. Also there is how many new players he's getting used to?

[A.I]

People see the 8 turnovers and say he sucks. He had 17 assists, but he'll go through growing pains as he finds out how to be a better floor general. This game was the first big step in the right direction. He set up other players well and he knew when he needed to score for the most part.

He tried to connect with Precious on the pick and roll on many occasions, some of them weren't good passes and some Precious fumbled and I remember one worked out great. A lot of new and young players trying to fit in and build chemistry together and Fred has the toughest job to make it all work.