Game 16: Mountain Edition. Toronto Raptors @ Utah Jazz. November 18, 2021. SN. 9:00pm EST 7pm Mountain.

[KeonClark]

Question is what changed with the defense? We started out pretty well defensively and it fell off significantly the last few games so the ability to defend is still there. It started when Pascal came back but I doubt he is the problem.

Pascal, schedule (lots of b2bs and 3 in 4s), random variance.

It's really only been the last 3 games with really bad defense, and 2 of them were on the road against some lights out offensive players.

[LJ2]

In one of the scrums I saw Boucher and FVV barking at each other, as Boucher walked away FVV made the "all talk" motion with his hands.

I wonder if there is some frustration in the locker room.

A bunch of young guys that are doing better than predicted. Injuries to some key players. A guy like Boucher, that has grown up in our system, may have reached his ceiling and is coming to that realization. A guy like Dragic is just siting on the bench. Other than FVV, OG and Pascal no one hade homes in Toronto prior to this season(who knows if those guys stayed in their old homes). A tough start to the season schedule. Kyle leaving. There is a bunch against the team, hopefully the can put it all together.

That's interesting. I didn't see that happen, but I did catch Boucher turning to Scottie and once to either Flynn or Trent with his hands up in the air motioning like "why didn't you rotate" after the Jazz had an easy bucket at the rim on a blown coverage. Not sure who blew the coverage in each instance, but Boucher seems to be at the center of it all.

[planetmars]

Very Bargnani like. Gross

[bertarapsfan]

In one of the scrums I saw Boucher and FVV barking at each other, as Boucher walked away FVV made the "all talk" motion with his hands.

I wonder if there is some frustration in the locker room.

I saw that too. I read it differently tho. I think they were talking about rotations on defensive and the hand signal was telling Chris to talk on defense.

[GOLDBLUM]

Very Bargnani like. Gross

Yeah, was about to share this. Pretty damning considering how our D has dropped off since he returned.

[Kagemusha]

Barnes has exceeded all expectations. He been great.

As for passivity, I don't know. Maybe. When I watch I see a guy with the ball wanting his teammates to 'read and react' and they mostly just stand around and stare at him from the three point line waiting for him to go one-on-one cause that's what they all do. That's not his game. If you're cutting, moving, setting screens off ball, etc. he will find you but the Raps don't do much of that. Barnes will attack when the situation presents itself but he won't force things, which may look passive in an offense where almost everything is guys forcing up shots.

This.

[slaw]

Very Bargnani like. Gross

I don't like this kind of stuff cause you can cherry pick any guy apart. Having said that, Siakam has not recreated the defensive Tasmanian devil he was in the championship year....

[GOLDBLUM]

I don't like this kind of stuff cause you can cherry pick any guy apart.

I hear that. I'd say that's a few too many plays off for one game, though.

[The Great One]

Very Bargnani like. Gross

That's what I said back when they were in the bubble. He's very Bargnani like. He doesn't play hard/or with any energy at all. Glad people are finally catching up.

[bertarapsfan]

Where da Kangs thread?

[LJ2]

Very Bargnani like. Gross

He looks lost out there.

[The Claw Reborn]

Reading the last two pages of this thread is the classic polarization of opinions

The worship on Van Vleet

and the scapegoat on Siakam

it is quiet funny

[Demographic Shift]

that's not true. he played with cade cunningham and day'ron sharpe in high school, with cade, mobley, and the jalen's on junior national teams, and came off the bench his lone year in college. he's never been a guy to try to do it all himself.

one of the things he's going to have to overcome if he's going to be the player everyone here eventually wants him to be is his natural inclination to defer so often. yes there are times he's not getting the ball in transition or in the halfcourt where he has an apparent advantage. but as others have noted he's also been pretty passive at times, content to just move the ball along when he has an opportunity to attack. i definitely don't see it as him just being "frozen out of the offence."

there was a great anecdote by mike schmitz on zach lowe's podcast a few weeks ago talking about some camp or basketball academy or something scottie was attending where the players were asked to visualize themselves scroing 25 points in a game and how they would go about doing so, and scottie couldn't handle it. it broke his brain. he asked if he could include assists.

he's made great strides towards upping his aggression already this season. but people need to slow down on wanting to just completely hand him the reigns and trade everyone older than gary trent. he's developing just fine as noted by others.

All good points.. but consider that his last full season played was at Florida State with a lot of kids one year removed from the high school caf lunch table. He was their best player non high school level.
He is now in the NBA.
With the men.
Its a completely different game with completely different personnel.
Everybody is big. Everybody is as fast. Everyone is strong.
Its hard to get down the lane. Its hard to get shots off. It should be. He is competing with the best in his chosen profession in the best league.
Still sticking with the notion that learning to make use of (aka trust) the other guys to create some doubt on what you might do opens up some room on the floor for Scottie. He is going through that now. No more Boston Colleges. No more Eastern Baptist Cupcake States. Instead its back to back with Denver and Utah.
And he is not yet the best player on the floor.

[Puffer]

I hear that. I'd say that's a few too many plays off for one game, though.

Wait till next game. I am one hundred percent sure he bounces back. :-)