Game 22 Memphis at Raptors Tuesday November 30th 7:30pm on SN

[MixxAOR]

Raptors are dead last in defensive rebounding, which results in 3rd highest opponent's 2nd chance points. We are giving opponents 15 points off of it. And we are playing at 3rd slowest pace.

[golden]

I dunno, when Lowry was Freddy and Siakam's age, he and DeMar were surrounded by vets like Hayes, Salmons, Amir, Fields, Vasquez, Lou Williams etc. Not a stacked team by any means, but those were all solid players that were good in their roles. To the point Mixx was making you need vets to win in this league. We started Precious and Svi last night for crying out loud and had a bunch of rookies and sophomore's coming off the bench. I doubt DD and Lowry would win in the range of 50 games with these guys either.

BBIQ comes with experience so yeah, Nurse has got a lot of work ahead of him to get these guys up to speed on a pretty difficult system. We can agree that not all these guys are going to be here as part of the finished product just like how Stanley, RHJ, Bembry, Baynes are now gone.

Lastly, I'm never reminded more of Lowry than when Fred, Siakam or OG play what people call "selfish basketball". Lowry knew what it took to win games and he never slowed down to accommodate teammates. It was get up to speed or get out of the way and it was his way of mentoring the young guys he played with. Leading by his example.

It's gonna be a frustrating season for sure.

Yeah, but Casey literally handed out "role cards". lmao. Casey's system was rigid and simplistic. Stay in your lane. No dribbling. Pass it to Will (i.e. Lowry and DeMar). That made it easier to plug and play new faces into the system instantly, but also limited the playoff ceiling of the team. I get that Nurse is focused on building the right habits for an adaptable playoff team. But you have to walk before you can run.

Nurse's "All Aggressive, All The Time" philosophy is pretty much the equivalent of trying to run before you learn to walk. Especially for young players and new players. I mean, Baynes looked like complete dog-sh*t when he was here... coming off one of his best seasons. All the new guys talk about how different/difficult it is to learn the system. It's clearly a factor. Vets come here and play worse than in previous stints. Whereas with Casey... Hayes, Salmons, Amir, Fields... most of those guys were out of the league after Raptors, but not because of Raptors.

[MixxAOR]

Clean up defensive rebounding and we are winning these games.

[golden]

Raptors are dead last in defensive rebounding. And we are playing at 3rd slowest pace.

We're sending too much help to the perimeter to contain dribble penetration and/or force turnovers with excessive ball pressure. That's leaving the middle vulnerable.

[MixxAOR]

We're sending too much help to the perimeter to contain dribble penetration and/or force turnovers with excessive ball pressure. That's leaving the middle vulnerable.

They don't box out. They are ball watching


You cant say they are playing protect paint first in one thread and then start saying they are sending too much help to perimeter.

[golden]

They don't box out. They are ball watching

Sure, because they are overly focused on helping or ball pressure... they forget their own man. They're trying to focus on being in 2 places at the same time.... and they do neither.

[MixxAOR]

Sure, because they are overly focused on helping or ball pressure... they forget their own man. They're trying to focus on being in 2 places at the same time.... and they do neither.

Too bad that's basketball. Maybe the game is too fast because they are too young. But it's not because of system.

You see shot go up you box out. It's elementary.

[golden]

Too bad that's basketball. Maybe the game is too fast because they are too young. But it's not because of system.

The system was a nice gimmick in the 2019-20, when it felt like we had a constant double-team on the ball at all times. Teams weren't ready for it. And it still works great in spurts. But opposing coaches have had 2+ years to figure it out and use that aggression against us. We're using a lot of college pack-line defense concepts, and it has known strategies to break it.

[golden]

Too bad that's basketball. Maybe the game is too fast because they are too young. But it's not because of system.

You see shot go up you box out. It's elementary.

We gave up the 3rd most OREBs per 100 possessions in the league in 2019-20, when the system was at it's peak. We were also bottom 10 in DRB% (21st). We pine for the days of Ibaka and Gasol, but they were never great rebounders.

[MixxAOR]

The system was a nice gimmick in the 2019-20, when it felt like we had a constant double-team on the ball at all times. Teams weren't ready for it. And it still works great in spurts. But opposing coaches have had 2+ years to figure it out and use that aggression against us. We're using a lot of college pack-line defense concepts, and it has known strategies to break it.

Every defense concept has a strategy to break it. Doesn't mean anything.

[golden]

Every defense concept has a strategy to break it. Doesn't mean anything.

Some are easier to break than others, especially if it’s pushing extremes, like zones or what we’re trying to accomplish. That could mean everything.

[MixxAOR]

We gave up the 3rd most OREBs per 100 possessions in the league in 2019-20, when the system was at it's peak. We were also bottom 10 in DRB% (21st). We pine for the days of Ibaka and Gasol, but they were never great rebounders.

We were 7th in defensive rebounds per game. So we weren't grabbing everything we could have but we grabbed enough where it didn't hurt us.

[MixxAOR]

Some are easier to break than others, especially if it’s pushing extremes, like zones or what we’re trying to accomplish. That could mean everything.

And what is this concept that you suggest they employ?

[golden]

And what is this concept that you suggest they employ?

Less aggression. Let our elite defenders do what they do best ... defend more 1-on-1. And completely ditch the double-team ball pressure to try and force turnovers. That is backfiring badly.

[MixxAOR]

Less aggression. Let our elite defenders do what they do best ... defend more 1-on-1. And completely ditch the double-team ball pressure to try and force turnovers. That is backfiring badly.

Yeah they will get lit up. I hope you know that. They are not that elite. And how do you suggest they cover the ball screens?