Game #56 - Toronto Raptors at New Orleans Pelicans; Feb 14th, 2022 on SN1

[slaw]

Everyone kept saying the Raps need a legit C just for Embiid and Jokic. Then you watch them get owned by the likes of Steven Adams. Raptors had a good team rebounding stretch not long ago where Siakam was more than holding his own. But earlier this year and now again, the Raps are getting killed on the boards and it's cost them games. Achiuwa is not a starter and Birch is just a guy. Centre-less teams might do OK over 40 games but in the post season against only the better teams, it's not a winning formula imo

It was a blowout loss where the team didn't show up. You can't read a lot into what happened against the Pels. They lost a tough one to the Nuggets which they probably should have won but for a couple guys being cold from three. And prior they had won 8 in a row.

None of this team's issues are going to be solved by throwing a new center into the mix unless he can play in Nurse's system on both ends cause for every rebound he grabs the team will be giving up an open three and getting bogged down on offense.

[Dr Hannibal Lecter]

2 Games after the trade deadline day, both losses. Would the players be disappointed that Masai didn't get them help. Could be there thinking about the break..
I've said it from the start, u can't play guys 40mins plus, with no bench, no center, need veteran players, not one, but 2 or 3...
I realize there not championship team, but the east is not scary..and u got guys who have won and playing at high level.
Freddy and Siakim are in the prime, not sure what the plan is.
Also I read some comments that ppl are s^$# on Barnes, come on, use your brain..kid/rook playing 35 min or more against world class talent big man, against centers..that is taxing....could be good in long run, give him break..definitely hit a wall. Similar with OG..he looks exhausted, he doesn't have the legs..they are definitely playing tired.

[LJ2]

This center-less scheme will get DESTROYED in the playoffs.
We will be lucky if we win one game.

What makes you say that? We've beat some really good playoff teams including the Bucks and Heat twice each. It was a bad loss against the Pelicans yes, but after a stretch of games at home the guys probably just got a bit too carried away in New Orleans with the weather, the Super Bowl, lack of restrictions and all the distractions in NO.

[slaw]

What makes you say that? We've beat some really good playoff teams including the Bucks and Heat twice each. It was a bad loss against the Pelicans yes, but after a stretch of games at home the guys probably just got a bit too carried away in New Orleans with the weather, the Super Bowl, lack of restrictions and all the distractions in NO.

That 8-game winning streak both outsized expectations while being conveniently ignored when a loss happens. The team is a work in progress with some serious roster imbalance issues, along with a lack of firepower, that were never going to be addressed in-season. This group is ahead of schedule and has a shot of making the playoffs outright and, at the least, will get into the play-in round. It's all pretty much good news.

[planetmars]

They lottery protected their pick. So if they fall back into the lottery (ie, lose in the play-in), they get two picks this year. It's not really the end of the world. I'm hoping for a playoff round or two though. I think these guys are good enough to win a round. They just can't play like they did yesterday where 3 out of the 5 starters completely shat the bed.

[golden]

It was a blowout loss where the team didn't show up. You can't read a lot into what happened against the Pels. They lost a tough one to the Nuggets which they probably should have won but for a couple guys being cold from three. And prior they had won 8 in a row.

None of this team's issues are going to be solved by throwing a new center into the mix unless he can play in Nurse's system on both ends cause for every rebound he grabs the team will be giving up an open three and getting bogged down on offense.

Nurse loathes playing drop coverage, which you'd have to do with a bulky center like JV. That's the opposite of the aggressive ball pressure at all times style he wants to play. They want to see if they can make it work, but this is an experiment.... sometimes experiments fail.

[LJ2]

That 8-game winning streak both outsized expectations while being conveniently ignored when a loss happens. The team is a work in progress with some serious roster imbalance issues, along with a lack of firepower, that were never going to be addressed in-season. This group is ahead of schedule and has a shot of making the playoffs outright and, at the least, will get into the play-in round. It's all pretty much good news.

Agreed, the win streak clouded the focus for this season (among fans) which was always about development. We aren't serious contenders with half the starting unit and all of the bench being this young and unseasoned.

Trading for a vet in Thad is a bit confusing though. Was it because they thought it would give them a shot at making some noise in the playoffs, or because that's just the best offer they could get for Dragic with so little leverage? I might be pessimistic but I feel like it's the latter and that they may not actually have any intention of resigning him after the season. Just and end to the Lowry trade saga.

[A.I]

Agreed, the win streak clouded the focus for this season (among fans) which was always about development. We aren't serious contenders with half the starting unit and all of the bench being this young and unseasoned.

Trading for a vet in Thad is a bit confusing though. Was it because they thought it would give them a shot at making some noise in the playoffs, or because that's just the best offer they could get for Dragic with so little leverage? I might be pessimistic but I feel like it's the latter and that they may not actually have any intention of resigning him after the season. Just and end to the Lowry trade saga.

I think its more than that. It may be Thad was the best offer for Dragic, but Bobby said Thad is someone they wanted for a while, so they went with it.

I think the plan is to keep Thad around past this season, he is going to be a FA, so they will attempt re-sign him.

[slaw]

Nurse loathes playing drop coverage, which you'd have to do with a bulky center like JV. That's the opposite of the aggressive ball pressure at all times style he wants to play. They want to see if they can make it work, but this is an experiment.... sometimes experiments fail.

A big part of it is going to be whether Barnes and OG can play teams out of using any traditional centers cause they can't guard Siakam. If Barnes finds a consistent three point shot and gets a little more in rhythm offensively, then you've suddenly got guys like JV man to man against a giant guard 30 feet from the basket. Maybe you can hide them on OG but that will take every team out of its usual defensive plans.

I'm not currently sold on this group but too soon for me to conclude it can't work, especially since Barnes could take giant leaps the next 2 seasons.

[slaw]

I think its more than that. It may be Thad was the best offer for Dragic, but Bobby said Thad is someone they wanted for a while, so they went with it.

I think the plan is to keep Thad around past this season, he is going to be a FA, so they will attempt re-sign him.

I would add that the starting 5, plus Boucher, has played their asses off and management likely felt some obligation to get some help.

[golden]

A big part of it is going to be whether Barnes and OG can play teams out of using any traditional centers cause they can't guard Siakam. If Barnes finds a consistent three point shot and gets a little more in rhythm offensively, then you've suddenly got guys like JV man to man against a giant guard 30 feet from the basket. Maybe you can hide them on OG but that will take every team out of its usual defensive plans.

I'm not currently sold on this group but too soon for me to conclude it can't work, especially since Barnes could take giant leaps the next 2 seasons.

If Siakam gets switched onto Scottie's man (assume that's a center), that guy can just drop back and stay under the screen. We create no advantage there, but rather get a double team on Siakam.

OG, in theory, can pop open for a 3, but his 3-pt shooting hasn't been consistent this year. Scottie not being able to space the floor is one reason why we can't unlock any big advantage with this lineup, when Siakam has the ball.

The other option would be to put the ball in Scottie's hands and have him drive it and force them to stop the ball. Problem there, again, is that Scottie has no range and he'll take it to the front of the rim which puts the center in the place he wants to be anyway.

Bottom-line is that Scottie isn't really working as a small-ball center, and I also worry that it's going to mess up his long-term development if he continues to bulk up and lose foot speed, just so he can survive against behemoths. He looks a lot heavier and slower out there than he did at the beginning of the year.

[inthepaint]

It was a blowout loss where the team didn't show up. You can't read a lot into what happened against the Pels. They lost a tough one to the Nuggets which they probably should have won but for a couple guys being cold from three. And prior they had won 8 in a row.

None of this team's issues are going to be solved by throwing a new center into the mix unless he can play in Nurse's system on both ends cause for every rebound he grabs the team will be giving up an open three and getting bogged down on offense.

Yeah i'm not worried about it. They're coming out of hot league-longest 8-game winning streak beating excellent teams (and a 1-pt loss to a very good team), have a cold shooting night and out of a sudden the sky is falling? They shot 23.5% from 3, and allowed the opponent to shoot 45%. That's the game. A nominal centre or lack thereof is not going to affect that much. They laid an egg, weren't there mentally, lots of distraction over the weekend like others said. We've seen this before on games leading up to the ASB. They'll bounce back, on to the next one.

[slaw]

If Siakam gets switched onto Scottie's man (assume that's a center), that guy can just drop back and stay under the screen. We create no advantage there, but rather get a double team on Siakam.

OG, in theory, can pop open for a 3, but his 3-pt shooting hasn't been consistent this year. Scottie not being able to space the floor is one reason why we can't unlock any big advantage with this lineup, when Siakam has the ball.

The other option would be to put the ball in Scottie's hands and have him drive it and force them to stop the ball. Problem there, again, is that Scottie has no range and he'll take it to the front of the rim which puts the center in the place he wants to be anyway.

Bottom-line is that Scottie isn't really working as a small-ball center, and I also worry that it's going to mess up his long-term development if he continues to bulk up and lose foot speed, just so he can survive against behemoths. He looks a lot heavier and slower out there than he did at the beginning of the year.

Right, but that's Barnes this season. I'm talking about what happens when he dribbles down and shoots threes in transition or can blow by the opposing 5 every time down the floor. That's when this works.

[G__Deane]

Agreed, the win streak clouded the focus for this season (among fans) which was always about development. We aren't serious contenders with half the starting unit and all of the bench being this young and unseasoned.

Trading for a vet in Thad is a bit confusing though. Was it because they thought it would give them a shot at making some noise in the playoffs, or because that's just the best offer they could get for Dragic with so little leverage? I might be pessimistic but I feel like it's the latter and that they may not actually have any intention of resigning him after the season. Just and end to the Lowry trade saga.

If they end up trading the GROAT for un-Precious and a player that didn't want to play for them and they didn't plan to play and who then walked and turned him into "the best offer they could get" who they also don't plan to sign again....that's a sad "end to the Lowry trade saga"

Should have just let Kyle walk in that case and see what Dragic' 19M would play in the open market. + Achiuwa's ~$3M instead of paying Dragic to sit at home and hang out with the Miami Heat.

[The Great One]

Shooting is the biggest problem with this team. They have 3 true shooters on the team - FVV, Trent and OG. The only consistent one is FVV. Trent, as i've been saying the whole season is a hot and cold player. He was red hot the last few weeks now he's cold as ice. As for OG, OG is only shooting 34% from 3 this year. That's below average.

I'm still not really sure why the front office didn't address that area last week. Maybe because Trent was red hot? everyone know the way he was shooting the ball was not sustainable.