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Raptors Offseason 2022

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  • Primer wrote: View Post

    If Suns wanna take his leverage they match and deal him wherever they want once they're allowed to, a few months later right? They're not going to give him a no trade clause and he would be just as easily moved after signed to the max as he would in a sign and trade for the max.
    the issue with that is doesn't that mean you can't trade him until the trade moratorium is lifted ... I am sure Dan knows the date but its usually in December.

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    • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

      the issue with that is doesn't that mean you can't trade him until the trade moratorium is lifted ... I am sure Dan knows the date but its usually in December.
      Yeah, so what?

      If they deal him then they still fix any cap issues they have and can bring back a monster return. Players are paid per game so Ayton would have only made a fraction of his contracts first year.

      That's a minor inconvenience to ensure you get maximum return for a star player. Phoenix knows that and did it in the past with Joe Johnson. The team that wants Ayton will cave and give them what they want.

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      • Primer wrote: View Post

        Yeah, so what?

        If they deal him then they still fix any cap issues they have and can bring back a monster return. Players are paid per game so Ayton would have only made a fraction of his contracts first year.

        That's a minor inconvenience to ensure you get maximum return for a star player. Phoenix knows that and did it in the past with Joe Johnson. The team that wants Ayton will cave and give them what they want.
        fair point

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        • Primer wrote: View Post

          Based on latest rumors no team with the requisite cap space is gonna offer Ayton the max. So he will agree to go wherever the Suns make a deal to get him the max. I don't think Ayton really gives a shit where he ends up beyond being a max salary guy. I also think more desirable destinations than Toronto would be willing to offer a better sign and trade package than Trent plus trash.
          Any likely trade will require a 3rd team so its a bit complicated. He's a BYC player.. meaning the team that trades for him his accepting his full max value in the trade, but the Suns will take back 50% of the contract as an outgoing part of the trade.

          So assuming Ayton gets the max, that's about $30.25M. The Raptors (or Hawks) would have to send back $15.13M in contracts, but take back $30.25M. That's hard to pull off, especially if a team is over the cap.

          I think its easiest for Ayton to find a team with cap space. Maybe the Spurs could be a dark horse team. Especially if they don't think Poeltl is their future.

          Comment


          • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post
            TrueTorontoFanI can find additional things by going through the additional 70 pages of this thread but yeah I have been .
            I was replying to one thing in one post. You literally said “They obviously had a conversation with him and expressed hey we believe in you and you are important to this team but watching the tape we think you can be more successful and that the team can be more successful as well. I think they looked around and phoned to see if they could get guys like Mitchell or who ever else they have targeted to see if it was potentially worth it. Obviously not making an offer but asking hey... what would it take what would you hypothetically be interested. Just doing due diligence.”

            I don’t generally go back and read all of someone’s posts to figure out their mindset when I’m replying to one post that is crystal clear.

            I know you think FVV is a SG playing PG right now, and that you’d prefer Scottie in the PG role. I’m not trying to convince you differently. I was solely replying to the idea that the Raptors were on the phone gauging interest around the league in Fred, and that extending him was the last resort if they couldn’t trade him. That’s literally what you wrote.

            You then made a whole lot out of nothing. As I said earlier, carry on, not worth further discussion.

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            • This finals once again highlighted our most pressing need - SHOOTERS!
              We are the Celtics-lite who got outshot by a team that almost always has at least 3 knockdown shooters on the floor, at all times.

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              • Kagemusha wrote: View Post
                This finals once again highlighted our most pressing need - SHOOTERS!
                We are the Celtics-lite who got outshot by a team that almost always has at least 3 knockdown shooters on the floor, at all times.
                to me it highlights the need for real depth

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                • Limited Upside wrote: View Post

                  You then made a whole lot out of nothing. As I said earlier, carry on, not worth further discussion.
                  Voting this as the footnote of the offseason LOL
                  #TradeVanVleet

                  Comment


                  • planetmars wrote: View Post

                    Any likely trade will require a 3rd team so its a bit complicated. He's a BYC player.. meaning the team that trades for him his accepting his full max value in the trade, but the Suns will take back 50% of the contract as an outgoing part of the trade.

                    So assuming Ayton gets the max, that's about $30.25M. The Raptors (or Hawks) would have to send back $15.13M in contracts, but take back $30.25M. That's hard to pull off, especially if a team is over the cap.

                    I think its easiest for Ayton to find a team with cap space. Maybe the Spurs could be a dark horse team. Especially if they don't think Poeltl is their future.
                    To be clear, Phoenix can only use the 50% of his outgoing salary as matching salary. That matching salary still lets them take back 125% of it.

                    You can deal with that by finding a third team. But you can also add more pieces to a deal so the salary matching rules are satisfied.
                    twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                    • DanH wrote: View Post

                      To be clear, Phoenix can only use the 50% of his outgoing salary as matching salary. That matching salary still lets them take back 125% of it.

                      You can deal with that by finding a third team. But you can also add more pieces to a deal so the salary matching rules are satisfied.
                      so realistically who has the most leverage then.... to me it seems like the Sun's still have a lot of leverage by comparison ... no?

                      Comment


                      • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

                        so realistically who has the most leverage then.... to me it seems like the Sun's still have a lot of leverage by comparison ... no?
                        If they are willing to match and have his salary on the books for at least this next season, yes. You can't trade a player without their consent (that consent driving the same reduced return as a SnT would) for a full year after matching an offer sheet (and not to the team that made the offer sheet at all for that year).

                        By all accounts, that's a big if.

                        Then again, that also only applies if he really wants out of Phoenix. I don't think those have been the rumours, I thought it was mostly he wants the max and they don't want to give it to him. So he's probably perfectly fine with them matching and him staying there.
                        twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                        • DanH wrote: View Post

                          If they are willing to match and have his salary on the books for at least this next season, yes. You can't trade a player without their consent (that consent driving the same reduced return as a SnT would) for a full year after matching an offer sheet (and not to the team that made the offer sheet at all for that year).

                          By all accounts, that's a big if.

                          Then again, that also only applies if he really wants out of Phoenix. I don't think those have been the rumours, I thought it was mostly he wants the max and they don't want to give it to him. So he's probably perfectly fine with them matching and him staying there.
                          I thought you could hypothetically trade a player without consent if they are on your books and don't have a no trade clause.

                          Comment


                          • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

                            I thought you could hypothetically trade a player without consent if they are on your books and don't have a no trade clause.
                            It's in the CBA faq.. for RFA's who's contracts were matched, they cannot be traded for a year without their consent, or to the team that sent him an offer sheet even with their consent.

                            So an RFA basically gets a no-trade clause built in, but expires in a year.
                            http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q42

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                            • planetmars wrote: View Post

                              It's in the CBA faq.. for RFA's who's contracts were matched, they cannot be traded for a year without their consent, or to the team that sent him an offer sheet even with their consent.

                              So an RFA basically gets a no-trade clause built in, but expires in a year.
                              http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q42
                              Then doesn't that put the leverage back in ayton's hands then? because them matching he can still say no I wanna go x y z place or no.

                              Comment


                              • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

                                Then doesn't that put the leverage back in ayton's hands then? because them matching he can still say no I wanna go x y z place or no.
                                Except if he signs an offer sheet with team x, then he can't be traded to team x for a year - so by signing the offer sheet, he runs the risk of Phoenix matching the offer, and therefore not being able to be traded to the team that wanted him.

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