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Raptors Offseason 2022

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  • DanH wrote: View Post
    I can definitely see why PHX would do a SnT with Indy. Absolutely. Heck, they can probably roll it into a Durant deal.

    But why would Indy do that? They should be trying to trade Turner for value, not just get him out of the way to pay a different guy more money. Why not just make the offer sheet, then see if you can flip Turner for, say, Gary Trent? Or even filler and a pick.
    Wait…so Indy getting Ayton is a negative asset?

    I also dont get it…WHY you saying that they are not trading OG for a Center and yet here you are from the Pacers perspective, you are saying Indiana can flip Turner a CENTER for Gary Trent
    Last edited by The Claw Reborn; Fri Jul 8, 2022, 10:14 AM.
    #TradeVanVleet

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    • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

      Wait…so Indy getting Ayton is a negative asset?

      I also dont get it…WHY you saying that they are not trading OG for a Center and yet here you are from the Pacers perspective, you are saying Indiana can flip Turner a CENTER for Gary Trent
      What?

      Indy can get Ayton by signing him with their cap space. Why would they trade Turner for that privilege when they can just get him by signing him outright? When they can trade Turner for something, anything, of value.

      The Raptors are not going to trade one of their core big wings for a C, they seem to have no interest in adding a C at that cost. Trent, sure, if they think that's a better fit than a guy who ideally would be their 6th man this season. But the Raptors not wanting to trade their top trade assets (and maybe they wouldn't even trade Trent for Turner) doesn't mean Turner has zero value league wide and that Indy should punt on any return.
      twitter.com/dhackett1565

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      • DanH wrote: View Post

        What?

        Indy can get Ayton by signing him with their cap space. Why would they trade Turner for that privilege when they can just get him by signing him outright? When they can trade Turner for something, anything, of value.

        The Raptors are not going to trade one of their core big wings for a C, they seem to have no interest in adding a C at that cost. Trent, sure, if they think that's a better fit than a guy who ideally would be their 6th man this season. But the Raptors not wanting to trade their top trade assets (and maybe they wouldn't even trade Trent for Turner) doesn't mean Turner has zero value league wide and that Indy should punt on any return.
        How much cap space? Ayton and his agent wanting max

        so a S/T with assets going to Phoenix is the best scenario

        lol, your bias towards Trent vs. OG is hilarious but carry on
        #TradeVanVleet

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        • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

          How much cap space? Ayton and his agent wanting max

          so a S/T with assets going to Phoenix is the best scenario

          lol, your bias towards Trent vs. OG is hilarious but carry on
          They have max cap space, as of Saturday when the Brogdon deal goes through. Why again would they send assets to Phoenix?

          I think it's pretty much universally understood that OG is a better and more important piece to keep than Trent, no?
          twitter.com/dhackett1565

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          • DanH wrote: View Post

            They have max cap space, as of Saturday when the Brogdon deal goes through. Why again would they send assets to Phoenix?

            I think it's pretty much universally understood that OG is a better and more important piece to keep than Trent, no?
            Yeah Claw you're missing some key details here. Indy will have max cap space and make the offer sheet to Ayton and dare Phoenix to match it. If Phoenix does then they roll with Turner. If they don't match then they are free to trade Turner anywhere else in the league for a nice return. Giving up Turner for the privilege of signing Ayton would be dumb. They'd want Phoenix to send them some sweetener like a draft pick to make it worth their while since they don't need a S&T to sign Ayton if Phoenix is unwilling to match.

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            • DanH wrote: View Post

              They have max cap space, as of Saturday when the Brogdon deal goes through. Why again would they send assets to Phoenix?
              https://valleyofthesuns.com/2022/06/...-myles-turner/


              Although another team could sign Ayton outright if the Suns neglect to match any offer in play for him, a sign-and-trade deal featuring the prized big remains the most advantageous route for Phoenix to take. Doing so will allow the Suns to net somethingin return for Ayton and consequently maintain their position as a competitive force in the West.
              Phoenix has zero intention of signing Ayton to a max contract, hence, This is more about Phoenix maximizing return for Ayton and at the same time, helping him and his agent find a destination where he can get what he wanted which is a max contract. Indiana has that ability by trading Turner and plus assets to Phoenix.

              DanH wrote: View Post

              I think it's pretty much universally understood that OG is a better and more important piece to keep than Trent, no?
              as far as OG is concerned, Indiana if they decide to trade Turner to Toronto, they are not trading him for GTJ over OG lol

              #TradeVanVleet

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              • Primer wrote: View Post

                Yeah Claw you're missing some key details here. Indy will have max cap space and make the offer sheet to Ayton and dare Phoenix to match it. If Phoenix does then they roll with Turner. If they don't match then they are free to trade Turner anywhere else in the league for a nice return. Giving up Turner for the privilege of signing Ayton would be dumb. They'd want Phoenix to send them some sweetener like a draft pick to make it worth their while since they don't need a S&T to sign Ayton if Phoenix is unwilling to match.
                It serves a double purpose for Phoenix so by getting Turner and just doing good with Ayton and his agent, that would be the best route.
                #TradeVanVleet

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                • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

                  It serves a double purpose for Phoenix so by getting Turner and just doing good with Ayton and his agent, that would be the best route.
                  It's a great deal for Phoenix, but a bad deal for Indiana. Indiana is much better off playing hardball and giving Ayton the max offer sheet and daring Phoenix to match.

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                  • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post
                    as far as OG is concerned, Indiana if they decide to trade Turner to Toronto, they are not trading him for GTJ over OG lol
                    OG played college ball in Indiana so there is definitely a big preference over him there.

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                    • Hotshot wrote: View Post

                      OG played college ball in Indiana so there is definitely a big preference over him there.
                      Do you really think that though? I don't think NBA teams give a flying shit where the players played college ball. I can't see that moving the needle on attendance numbers. Maybe if they were a local legend but OG is not that for Indiana.

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                      • Primer wrote: View Post

                        It's a great deal for Phoenix, but a bad deal for Indiana. Indiana is much better off playing hardball and giving Ayton the max offer sheet and daring Phoenix to match.
                        I think they'll regret giving Ayton max money. Personally, I think he's overrated.

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                        • Apollo wrote: View Post

                          I think they'll regret giving Ayton max money. Personally, I think he's overrated.
                          Yeah that's an overpay, but he's still one of the best C in the league and only 23. He fits their timeline perfectly as he's over 3 years younger than Turner. They've got lots of guys on rookie deals so plenty of room to overpay Ayton a bit. If they jettison Turner the next highest paid player after Ayton would be Hield at $19M and then a huge drop to McConnell at $8.7M.

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                          • You don't max very good C's like Ayton. You max C's like Shaq, Hakeem, Duncan, Kareem, Ewing etc. You know.....all time great.
                            Mamba Mentality

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                            • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

                              Phoenix has zero intention of signing Ayton to a max contract, hence, This is more about Phoenix maximizing return for Ayton and at the same time, helping him and his agent find a destination where he can get what he wanted which is a max contract. Indiana has that ability by trading Turner and plus assets to Phoenix.
                              What are you even on about? Of course the Suns would want some return for Ayton. Why are Indy playing ball and not just signing him? How is Phoenix helping Ayton when Indy doesn't need PHX at all to make a max offer to Ayton? Indy can offer him a max contract while keeping Turner (or trading Turner elsewhere for, you know, an actual return).
                              twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                              • DanH wrote: View Post

                                What are you even on about? Of course the Suns would want some return for Ayton. Why are Indy playing ball and not just signing him? How is Phoenix helping Ayton when Indy doesn't need PHX at all to make a max offer to Ayton? Indy can offer him a max contract while keeping Turner (or trading Turner elsewhere for, you know, an actual return).
                                He's a restricted free agent so we'll see how this process unfolds." CBS Sports' Sam Quinn says a max contract from the Suns would be worth a projected $176.9 million over five years for Ayton. If he signed a max contract elsewhere, it would reach an estimated $131.15 million over four season
                                So you think, Indiana will sign Ayton the max and have two options after that:

                                1. Keep Turner’s salary ($18M per) and Ayton’s possible max of ($33M per) = $50M for two centers who will fight for the starter role

                                or

                                2. Keep Ayton but Trade Turner for an Actual Return ($18 million worth of salary)

                                that is fine

                                but do you think those two options is a wise move financially?
                                Last edited by The Claw Reborn; Fri Jul 8, 2022, 01:46 PM.
                                #TradeVanVleet

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