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Raptors Offseason 2022

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  • golden wrote: View Post

    Isolating Lillard is simply a counter to the strange narrative of Dame now being isolated and put on the pedestal as "refreshing that he's so loyal" like a Giannis or Duncan. I guess the standard is so low now that taking max money and then playing out your contract is refreshing, so I guess I can understand why people would think like that these days.
    By definition, that which is refreshing is subjective in nature. You might also think it's strange to enjoy pineapple on pizza and maybe we should direct the conversation there next.

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    • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

      yeah so that was my point. It depends on what he is prioritizing. I think you might be thinking that I am suggesting that he is dumb for taking the money. I don't care what he prioritizes but it isn't untrue that it makes it harder for his team to maneuver I don't blame him but also understand that the two things are not mutually exclusive.
      Of course they have less flexibility when he makes more, I'm not arguing that. However, him taking the money won't influence his chances at the hall of fame. What it will influence is Skip Bayless, Stephen A Smith and other guys like them when they're screaming at each on on TV about who's the best of all time and where the rest fall in line. I am speculating but I think Dame doesn't give a shit what they think. If he did he would have demanded a trade to LA years ago.

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      • Apollo wrote: View Post

        By definition, that which is refreshing is subjective in nature. You might also think it's strange to enjoy pineapple on pizza and maybe we should direct the conversation there next.
        Vintage

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        • Turner

          • Myles Turner Indiana Pacers Position: F-C Born: 03/24/96 Height: 6-11 / 2.11 Weight:239 lbs. / 108.4 kg. Salary: $18,000,000
          Myles Turner NBA Salary | NBA player | HoopsHype
          #TradeVanVleet

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          • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post


            Turner
            Uh, yeah, that's why he chose 18M.

            With Ayton likely getting the max, he can be traded for any player making up to 20.5M.
            twitter.com/dhackett1565

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            • DanH wrote: View Post

              Uh, yeah, that's why he chose 18M.

              With Ayton likely getting the max, he can be traded for any player making up to 20.5M.
              Indiana no.1 as the Likely Destination lol
              #TradeVanVleet

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              • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

                Indiana no.1 as the Likely Destination lol
                Ayton is basically definitely going to Indy. Question is the method.
                twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                • Apollo wrote: View Post

                  Of course they have less flexibility when he makes more, I'm not arguing that. However, him taking the money won't influence his chances at the hall of fame. What it will influence is Skip Bayless, Stephen A Smith and other guys like them when they're screaming at each on on TV about who's the best of all time and where the rest fall in line. I am speculating but I think Dame doesn't give a shit what they think. If he did he would have demanded a trade to LA years ago.
                  Right but I never said anything contrary. Heck Demar will make the HOF TBH. I do not think he should be demanding a trade and I am not someone who pays a ton of attention to the talking heads anymore especially those in the US. I don't even care about who is best or that sort of thing.. .Figure that out when a guy retires. I don't even look at durant within a historical context because he isnt done playing yet.

                  In terms of portland and him winning it doesn't help. So yes we both agree he doesn't care. Nor does he have to care but that doesn't mean the franchise and him came together (I assume they have a sort of partnership in portland because its dame) and made the best decision for the success of the overall franchise and his ability to win. He may not care about piecing together the best pieces to win. He may even think that they can win with what they have. Time will tell.

                  I don't think it takes away anything from you as a fan enjoying him as a player but I view things both on a micro scale and on a macro scale looking at both the player and organization. I think for them to now make a step towards home court advantage in the west ... Sharpe needs to come up big for them.

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                  • DanH wrote: View Post

                    Ayton is basically definitely going to Indy. Question is the method.
                    do they have a prime membership.. they could get same day shipping for free

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                    • golden wrote: View Post

                      Yep. Agree to disagree and call it a day. The disconnect is probably because my definition of loyalty means some form of sacrifice, but I don't see where Dame has sacrificed anything to benefit the Blazers. Obviously he hasn't sacrificed a penny of money. I guess the modern definition of sacrifice is "honoring your contract", so I guess I understand where you're coming from.

                      What about something practical... like playing defense and setting the tone for his teammates? Nope.

                      On top of that, we've seen that it's really hard to build a legit contender with smallish, 1-way guards as your alpha, so I don't get all the praise. He's basically a rich man's Beal, or poor man's Steph. He's a flawed piece to build around to begin with, so he's actually part of the problem in roster construction. And Portland isn't exactly a place that signs the type of alpha superstar FAs that Lillard would need to be successful at the highest level.

                      I guess if you could fault the Blazers front office for anything.. it was not moving on from CJ early enough and keeping that backcourt pairing together way too long.
                      They were loyal to him by not trading him. He was loyal to them by not leaving. He could have held out and demanded a trade. The definition of loyalty doesn't mention sacrafice at all. However, one could argue he sacraficed a legitimate shot at a title by staying in Portland instead of asking for a trade to LA or Boston or any number of teams who are far more competent than the Blazers. Talk about a brand boost by going from Portland to LA. The least they could do is make him highest paid in the league seeing as they could never give him the kind of teams LeBron or Steph had.

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                      • TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

                        Right but I never said anything contrary. Heck Demar will make the HOF TBH. I do not think he should be demanding a trade and I am not someone who pays a ton of attention to the talking heads anymore especially those in the US. I don't even care about who is best or that sort of thing.. .Figure that out when a guy retires. I don't even look at durant within a historical context because he isnt done playing yet.

                        In terms of portland and him winning it doesn't help. So yes we both agree he doesn't care. Nor does he have to care but that doesn't mean the franchise and him came together (I assume they have a sort of partnership in portland because its dame) and made the best decision for the success of the overall franchise and his ability to win. He may not care about piecing together the best pieces to win. He may even think that they can win with what they have. Time will tell.

                        I don't think it takes away anything from you as a fan enjoying him as a player but I view things both on a micro scale and on a macro scale looking at both the player and organization. I think for them to now make a step towards home court advantage in the west ... Sharpe needs to come up big for them.
                        If he's going to give a discount he would be smart to leave there and go to a team with a proven track record.

                        The best decision for the franchise is to keep him as part of the franchise. They're Portland, what else can they offer over a teams like the Lakers, Clippers, Celtics, ect than money? No offense to Portland but they're not a major market and players have never been dying to get to Portland for reason other than money as far as I understand it. They kept their superstar with the advantage the CBA provided them. He's an incredible player and they'll stay relevant as long as he's there. Both sides win from this contract as far as I can tell and the CBA assisted the Blazers in this scenario.

                        Comment


                        • Apollo wrote: View Post

                          If he's going to give a discount he would be smart to leave there and go to a team with a proven track record.

                          The best decision for the franchise is to keep him as part of the franchise. They're Portland, what else can they offer over a teams like the Lakers, Clippers, Celtics, ect than money? No offense to Portland but they're not a major market and players have never been dying to get to Portland for reason other than money as far as I understand it. They kept their superstar with the advantage the CBA provided them. He's an incredible player and they'll stay relevant as long as he's there. Both sides win from this contract as far as I can tell and the CBA assisted the Blazers in this scenario.

                          I want to see franchise tagged contracts come up next time negotiations come where if a team keeps a start they get tax breaks and the money onnly counts for x amount of the cap % until the player is traded.

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                          • It's not Dame's fault they couldn't build a contender around him, management botched it.

                            That said, they should be better next season with the addition of Grant and their rookies + internal development of guys like Simons.

                            Seems like a fringe playoff team to me, and I think that's all Portland wants at the moment.

                            Comment


                            • Primer wrote: View Post
                              It's not Dame's fault they couldn't build a contender around him, management botched it.

                              That said, they should be better next season with the addition of Grant and their rookies + internal development of guys like Simons.

                              Seems like a fringe playoff team to me, and I think that's all Portland wants at the moment.
                              definitely not dames fault no. I hope they are better I didn't like their draft pick but I understood why they did that. Like you said they are currently a fringe playoff team. I have them pegged as 8th.

                              Comment


                              • Apollo wrote: View Post

                                Of course they have less flexibility when he makes more, I'm not arguing that. However, him taking the money won't influence his chances at the hall of fame. What it will influence is Skip Bayless, Stephen A Smith and other guys like them when they're screaming at each on on TV about who's the best of all time and where the rest fall in line. I am speculating but I think Dame doesn't give a shit what they think. If he did he would have demanded a trade to LA years ago.
                                But they will be talking about him, that alone is worth a lot to Portland.

                                Portland is one of my favourite cities in the US, that is all because it has a feel of belonging that comes with being a smaller city. So many different ways to look at the return on investment that Dame is but as a general rule of business those small market teams are more financially driven/rewarding to remaining consistently competitive as opposed to the peaks and troughs logic of rebuilding and title runs. Dame may hamstring a full title run in earnest however financially Portland are hardly on the end of a bad business transaction.

                                I'm not knocking either approach, I love the excitement of a rebuild and watching youth develop but just highlighting that perhaps the guys in suits are making decisions based on pure financials.

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