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Raptors Offseason 2022

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  • planetmars
    replied
    DanH wrote: View Post

    I never once said I thought a better coach would take that team to the championship. They probably still lose at some point in the playoffs. But they were very good, flawed teams. And underperformed in the playoffs because they were poorly coached, flaming out before their talent ceiling would have stopped them.

    Which is exactly the same as what would have happened if Casey were coaching a team with a much higher talent ceiling - coaching would have caused them to lose before their talent level would have indicated. In other words, no chip for us.
    If a better coach wouldn't take that team to a championship then what is the point in any of this? They would have won two more games or gotten to the finals and still lose? That's still pretty much a failure in the grand scheme of things.

    As for Casey coaching a higher talented team and losing.. there is no basis on it. I can counter by showing examples where coach's as good as Casey have won it all. Case in point Doc Rivers.

    Leave a comment:


  • DanH
    replied
    golden wrote: View Post
    Casey made the ECF with a starting lineup of: Lowry, DD, DeMarre Carroll, Scola and Bismack.

    Let that sink in. Carroll, Scola and Biz.

    And Carroll and Scola were completely washed at that point.

    I am 100% certain that if Nurse coaches that starting lineup over a regular season, we are tanking for a top 5 pick, let alone talking about playoffs,
    To be fair, he made the ECF largely with a lineup that started JV, JV just got hurt mid-playoff-run and Bismack stepped in. Scola barely played much at all in those playoffs in spite of Casey doubling down on starting him all year for absolutely no reason.

    Mind you, that one run was definitely Casey's peak as a coach - he even adjusted a couple of times! Sadly he followed it up with coaching performances more in line with his typical quality in the following years.

    Leave a comment:


  • DanH
    replied
    planetmars wrote: View Post

    You seem to have this strange feeling that the most perfect coach would have lead the Raptors from 2018 or 2017 to a championship. Someone might have been able to squeeze out another win or two but that team was seriously flawed. You need super stars to win in the league.. especially when the championship those 2 years had two top 5 super stars in their prime on it.

    As for not being prepared.. isn't that the same problem that guys like Bud or Rivers or Vogel had?
    I never once said I thought a better coach would take that team to the championship. They probably still lose at some point in the playoffs. But they were very good, flawed teams. And underperformed in the playoffs because they were poorly coached, flaming out before their talent ceiling would have stopped them.

    Which is exactly the same as what would have happened if Casey were coaching a team with a much higher talent ceiling - coaching would have caused them to lose before their talent level would have indicated. In other words, no chip for us.

    Leave a comment:


  • planetmars
    replied
    TrueTorontoFan wrote: View Post

    I am moving on but you also keep misrepresenting my words to an egregious level.

    its not just an exaggeration to say that hardheaded is the equivalent of saying trash. unless it is your position that no one is allowed to point out mistakes. It is actually a complete misrepresentation and mischaracterization of the term. So its either it was misrepresented on purpose or it was mischaracterized because you didn't read it properly. It is beyond softening it by saying its just an exaggeration. I will objectively be fair to DanH. Saying he wasn't prepared.. while may ore may not be true is not the same as being trash. You can come in underprepared but develop on the fly plans and hit back hard and win.

    There are people that celebrate everything. I would say the vast majority felt like it was time to go but gave casey his props as a culture setter and one that was needed when he was hired. I thinking that is the majority of raptors fans positions... particularly those who are not just getting into basketball right now.

    Also just because someone doesn't like casey doesn't mean they think he was trash.. you can not like someone and still respect their ability to do a job. The prevailing narrative is what I just stated in the above few sentences. Again you seem to of the belief that casey can only be one of two things and that there is little to no nuance to discuss regarding Casey.. Even though at bare minimum I have outlined many nuanced points ...that you have misrepresented or just ignored to continue the same charade.

    I only used trash from what I recall in one post. And it was an exaggeration (I already said this). I use trash when people hate on someone or think they suck. There are absolutely levels to that. Of course Casey is an NBA caliber coach.. and a different team gave him a 5 year contract when he was fired here. But when you rank him among his peers he's likely not considered a top tier coach. Among his peers he's likely considered not very good. Now that's subjective but I have been around Raptor forums for some time. Casey is not a coach that fans generally liked. They were happy to see him leave.. and joke around about him all the time.

    I don't know why you are being such a stickler for this term I used maybe one time. And I apologize for obviously offending you. I figured you didn't like Casey just like many don't.. and is a big reason why you thought he couldn't win a championship. If you think he can then this is all pointless. I'm sorry I dragged you into this conversation.

    Leave a comment:


  • TrueTorontoFan
    replied
    planetmars wrote: View Post

    I thought you wanted to move on?

    "Trash" is an exaggeration. I do know many Raptor fans celebrated when Casey was fired. A lot don't like him at all. Like he's one of the worst coach's in the league. I don't just read this forum either.

    This community has like 15-20 posters in it. I bet half of them don't like Casey at all.
    I am moving on but you also keep misrepresenting my words to an egregious level.

    its not just an exaggeration to say that hardheaded is the equivalent of saying trash. unless it is your position that no one is allowed to point out mistakes. It is actually a complete misrepresentation and mischaracterization of the term. So its either it was misrepresented on purpose or it was mischaracterized because you didn't read it properly. It is beyond softening it by saying its just an exaggeration. I will objectively be fair to DanH. Saying he wasn't prepared.. while may ore may not be true is not the same as being trash. You can come in underprepared but develop on the fly plans and hit back hard and win.

    There are people that celebrate everything. I would say the vast majority felt like it was time to go but gave casey his props as a culture setter and one that was needed when he was hired. I thinking that is the majority of raptors fans positions... particularly those who are not just getting into basketball right now.

    Also just because someone doesn't like casey doesn't mean they think he was trash.. you can not like someone and still respect their ability to do a job. The prevailing narrative is what I just stated in the above few sentences. Again you seem to of the belief that casey can only be one of two things and that there is little to no nuance to discuss regarding Casey.. Even though at bare minimum I have outlined many nuanced points ...that you have misrepresented or just ignored to continue the same charade.

    Leave a comment:

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