2022 PreSeason - 3 Weeks to Camp Opening - Where Do The Raps Stack up in the East ?

[golden]

Now you're arguing about semantics.

So, if you don’t disagree then you are complicity agreeing with my original point that “the Nets weren’t legit”. And, by extension… Nurse hasn’t beaten a non-legit playoff team yet, since Kawhi left. That’s how it all started.

What exactly have you been arguing against all this time?

[A.I]

So, if you don’t disagree then you are complicity agreeing with my original point that “the Nets weren’t legit”. And, by extension… Nurse hasn’t beaten a non-legit playoff team yet, since Kawhi left. That’s how it all started.

What exactly have you been arguing against all this time?

You should try to properly read people's posts.

[DanH]

Raps swept a shell of a team that itself barely made the playoffs, which some could call non-legit. Both things can be true… not my fault if the term “legit” irks everyone, like the word “asterisk”. Sure, it takes some shine away from the “win”… but it is what it is.

Moving on to this year. So from the strong response I’m getting… does that mean that it is a consensus that this is the year Nurse will finally win a playoff series without Kawhi? Asterisk-free.

Or does everybody have pre-packaged excuses ready if that doesn’t happen?

I think you are putting way too much weight on the coach.

Nick is an excellent coach. However, an excellent coach cannot win series by themselves. Ultimately the steps guys like Scottie, OG and Precious make, and what form Siakam and Fred are in at the end of the year, will be dramatically more important to their success than the quality of coaching. Just like the health or lack thereof of their players (or in Siakam's case, being entirely out of practice in the 2020 bubble) was the driving factor for their success and lack thereof over the past few seasons.

But Nurse's effect on the win totals and playoff success has been a significant positive. We've seen what bad coaching is as Raptors fans, hard to understand anyone who experienced the last 25 years of Raptors basketball being so critical of an actually good coach. I know, it's just you overcorrecting to combat some perceived over-rating you see, but please be aware it IS an overcorrection, not a fair critique.

[golden]

You should try to properly read people's posts.

I did. You specifically called out my use of the word “legit” as arbitrary and non-factual.

By the letter of the law, yes, the Raptors played a team that wore New Jersey Nets uniforms. I will give you those semantics. But that team was nothing like the team that actually earned that playoff berth. It wasn’t even close, due to once in a lifetime circumstances that benefited the Raptors and Nurse. That team was cannon fodder. Those are facts.

[golden]

I think you are putting way too much weight on the coach.

Nick is an excellent coach. However, an excellent coach cannot win series by themselves. Ultimately the steps guys like Scottie, OG and Precious make, and what form Siakam and Fred are in at the end of the year, will be dramatically more important to their success than the quality of coaching. Just like the health or lack thereof of their players (or in Siakam's case, being entirely out of practice in the 2020 bubble) was the driving factor for their success and lack thereof over the past few seasons.

But Nurse's effect on the win totals and playoff success has been a significant positive. We've seen what bad coaching is as Raptors fans, hard to understand anyone who experienced the last 25 years of Raptors basketball being so critical of an actually good coach. I know, it's just you overcorrecting to combat some perceived over-rating you see, but please be aware it IS an overcorrection, not a fair critique.

I actually like Nurse a ton, and think he’s a great coach. Yes, I’m having some fun staying on brand… putting on the black hat to poke a bit at those who over-credit Nurse for all things great: past, present and future. You got me on that.

But he’s not perfect either, and the mob push back when even the slightest negative is mentioned, however valid, also needs to be corrected around here.

[LJ2]

What are you referring to when you talk about Nurse being over credited? I don't think I've seen anyone comment about him in any of the threads other than yourself.

[A.I]

I did. You specifically called out my use of the word “legit” as arbitrary and non-factual.

By the letter of the law, yes, the Raptors played a team that wore New Jersey Nets uniforms. I will give you those semantics. But that team was nothing like the team that actually earned that playoff berth. It wasn’t even close, due to once in a lifetime circumstances that benefited the Raptors and Nurse. That team was cannon fodder. Those are facts.

Those once in a lifetime circumstances happen quite often for it to be called "once in a life time".

[DanH]

I actually like Nurse a ton, and think he’s a great coach. Yes, I’m having some fun staying on brand… putting on the black hat to poke a bit at those who over-credit Nurse for all things great: past, present and future. You got me on that.

But he’s not perfect either, and the mob push back when even the slightest negative is mentioned, however valid, also needs to be corrected around here.

I mean that's fine, but let's not pretend that assigning a lack of playoff wins to him as though it's anything meaningful over the sample is something fair or valid.

[The Great One]

Golden's a good poster but he turns into Kyrie Irving everytime he sees the words "Nick Nurse". Lol.

[golden]

Golden's a good poster but he turns into Kyrie Irving everytime he sees the words "Nick Nurse". Lol.

lmao! If I had a sig, I would definitely consider using that.

[LJ2]

10 more sleeps until the first preseason game!

[G__Deane]

10 more sleeps until the first preseason game!

I can't sleep!

[Mapko]

10 more sleeps until the first preseason game!

Can we get back to pre season predictions?
In view of Boston situation: Does that change anything?
Williams to miss several weeks -no big deal right?
How about coach situation? I'm reading he might be suspended by Bos as much as whole season?
That leaves Bucks as lone Tier 1 team? Can our Raps be there too? I don't sea a reason why not (maybe I'm too optimistic.
Nets can certainly leapfrog to the top provided Nets shit show is under control.
Personally I don't see it (even Vegas has them in mid 40s win).

We keep hearing how East is MUCH better. Lets see:
-Boston added much injured Brogdon & potentially looses coach; Brown cant be happy about being in trade news all summer;
-Atl finished way out of playoffs Added 1 very good player, lost 2 decent. Maybe enough to fight for 7-8. I don't see much more;
-Miami: Lost PJ & got older. Where is improvement? Dipo finally healthy?
-Cavs lost Markanen, got Mitchel; Awful D at 1-2; Certainly a playoff team, but beyond?
-76ers: Embiid cant play (or stay healthy more) much better; Is Hardens age catching up? Lets face it: he never won much for team. Why start at nearly 34? Rivers has not done anything since 2009 (got his team out of 1st round ONCE). Maxey might be their only secret improvement;
-Chicago if finally healthy can fight for top 4. Def not stronger than last year.
-Knicks? Give a break please;

With all this Raps No 2 or 3 in East!

[LJ2]

Can we get back to pre season predictions?
In view of Boston situation: Does that change anything?
Williams to miss several weeks -no big deal right?
How about coach situation? I'm reading he might be suspended by Bos as much as whole season?
That leaves Bucks as lone Tier 1 team? Can our Raps be there too? I don't sea a reason why not (maybe I'm too optimistic.
Nets can certainly leapfrog to the top provided Nets shit show is under control.
Personally I don't see it (even Vegas has them in mid 40s win).

We keep hearing how East is MUCH better. Lets see:
-Boston added much injured Brogdon & potentially looses coach; Brown cant be happy about being in trade news all summer;
-Atl finished way out of playoffs Added 1 very good player, lost 2 decent. Maybe enough to fight for 7-8. I don't see much more;
-Miami: Lost PJ & got older. Where is improvement? Dipo finally healthy?
-Cavs lost Markanen, got Mitchel; Awful D at 1-2; Certainly a playoff team, but beyond?
-76ers: Embiid cant play (or stay healthy more) much better; Is Hardens age catching up? Lets face it: he never won much for team. Why start at nearly 34? Rivers has not done anything since 2009 (got his team out of 1st round ONCE). Maxey might be their only secret improvement;
-Chicago if finally healthy can fight for top 4. Def not stronger than last year.
-Knicks? Give a break please;

With all this Raps No 2 or 3 in East!

This is definitely the time of the year for optimism, but this year there is good reason.

Do you ever remember a time when the entire roster was together playing 5 on 5 basketball and building chemistry during the summer? Even if the lack of a superstar catches up with them at some point in the playoffs this bodes well for the regular season. These guys clearly want to prove something this year.

All this stuff going on with the Celtics can either ruin them or bring them closer together, but losing Udoka to suspension and their lead assistant to another team has to hurt. I can see them being the same team that went 27-9 to close the season last year.

ATL has a pretty well rounded team now and Trae is one of those guys that can go off at any time and carry a team to a win. Not particularly deep though.

CAVS are the team with all the hype behind them after the Mitchel trade. Could be regular season beasts if everything clicks.

76ers and Miami are in the same category and need to keep their key players healthy.

Chicago is going to start the season with Lonzo rehabbing from surgery so expecting a slow start which will evolve into low seeded playoff team.

Bucks are going to be interesting. Still the powerhouse in the East until Giannis slows down. A few key guys are injury prone though so we'll see how much work Giannis has to do to keep his team at the top.

[G__Deane]

Can we get back to pre season predictions?

Nothing has really changed for me. Raps are a good, solid winning team in the East that ultimately lacks the superstar(s) that are generally needed to win it all.

For any team, saying "if they stay healthy" is kind of a given, none of the top teams can lose a super star for any length of time and continue at thetop of their game. If all teams were to stay healthy, I have
1/ Bucks
2/ Celtics
3/ Nets
4/ Sixers
5/ Raps
6/ Heat
7/Cavs
8/Hawks

I could flip Sixers and Raps (I hope Scotty takes a huge leap so you never know what the team ceiling is) and also Heat (just not high on them) and Cavs.
Celtics are already injured, Nets could implode, Sixers are always at risk of Embiid's leg falling off, Cavs could surprise imo .... you can't have a dozen caveats.

Raps could conceivably beat any team on the list in a given series but I doubt they do the Bucks or Celtics. Bucks have Giannis who's only getting better somehow and the Celtics just have that elusive "it" factor and I still think the Raps are just too nice and lack a bit of the killer instinct. jmo