Everything Trade Deadline 2023

[LJ2]

We were all upset that a big trade didn't happen and we actually added instead of breaking it down a bit... but I think if you look at it from Masai's view, there are at least 4 players that they were receiving good offers on and they saw how teams valued their talent, maybe it's best to not rush to judgement because 3 months of bad play (first month they ended above .500 9-8). So he added a need that was identified last off-season, and they'll evaluate and tweak if needed in the summer. We need a few more shooters, that's for sure.

Masai has always said the trade deadline is not a place to plan for the future. Masai puts a lot of value on personalities, it might be harder to make those decisions with a time crunch.

It's probably part of the frustration that Masai is very careful and takes his time evaluating his teams thoroughly. It feels like he only makes moves when he is forced to like with Melo forcing his way out of Denver and the the final playoff run with DeMar/Casey. He seemed a bit frazzled during parts of the presser yesterday, so we'll see what happens.

Looking forward to see how Jakob can help this team.

[Primer]

100%...
What I am droning on about is that there are only a couple of opptys to address your roster...
One in June/July with the Draft and FA.
The other is the swap meet that is the trade deadline in February.
Net is the planning that goes into the draft and FA are not mutually exclusive. There are a ton of what ifs that get sorted in June/July as they prep for the draft and FA..


Still not moving me off the puck that the GM's missed at the trade deadline... Its like they got halfway done. They picked up the centre we have been clamouring for for about 3 years now but didn't finish the next step in the process which was to replace the draft pick it cost us to get tJak and another younger player who might eventually start but would give the bench a real boost. I would miss OG but Precious is a good succession plan.
Its like they held out for a little bit more on OG and whatever the offer on the phone at that time was, expired as the phone went down.

We have until June 2024 to replace the draft pick we sent out. Why in the hell would we need to address that yesterday?

Returns for OG will be better this offseason than they were now if we decide to deal him. The up and comers with a bazillion draft picks like OKC and Utah will be in the market for an OG this summer. They weren't at the deadline because they're not contending this year. They'll be interested in contending next year and they have everything we'd want in an OG trade. Young players and picks.

[Demographic Shift]

I have seen no one suggest they were offered gold. Every report has been about how the offers fell short or the Raptors prices were considered too pricey for the other teams. The ONLY reports I've seen are that there were multi-pick packages for OG (all of which project to be low on lottery picks) with no established prospects included, and the offers for Fred that have been reported are all awful.

https://youtu.be/Iw7F6OzN7Nw

Its the WOJ debrief on the day.... check out the 17:40 mark.... He elaborates on Memphis big game hunting and what Woj believes they were in the neighborhood of paying for OG at the 18:40 mark...among others.

So Woj or Grange....?

[BrydenB]

We have until June 2024 to replace the draft pick we sent out. Why in the hell would we need to address that yesterday?

Returns for OG will be better this offseason than they were now if we decide to deal him. The up and comers with a bazillion draft picks like OKC and Utah will be in the market for an OG this summer. They weren't at the deadline because they're not contending this year. They'll be interested in contending next year and they have everything we'd want in an OG trade. Young players and picks.

Are you sure? What if he gets hurt again? What if he actually fully asks out? It is not a foregone conclusion that you can even get the same deal that you were offered at the deadline, forget about a better one.

[Primer]

Are you sure? What if he gets hurt again? What if he actually fully asks out? It is not a foregone conclusion that you can even get the same deal that you were offered at the deadline, forget about a better one.

I'm sure that more teams will be interested in the offseason than were at the deadline. I'm also sure more teams with the kind of assets we want will be interested. I listed some of those teams. OG fits perfectly on a young up and coming team. Those teams have tons of picks and young players. The stuff we want back for OG.

I'd rather keep OG than have taken the rumored offers we received. So I'm glad we didn't deal him yet.

[Heatdreamer]

I have seen no one suggest they were offered gold. Every report has been about how the offers fell short or the Raptors prices were considered too pricey for the other teams. The ONLY reports I've seen are that there were multi-pick packages for OG (all of which project to be low on lottery picks) with no established prospects included, and the offers for Fred that have been reported are all awful.

For OG to the Warriors, the Warriors have major issues, they are slightly over a .500 team, that is why they traded for Gary Payton 11 to return to manage the four position.

The offer of OG for Donte + Moody Jr + Kuminga may have been Meyers being rattled giving up all his prospects in one day. Wiseman, Moody Jr., Kuminga.

Kuminga was the sticking point , offensively he is awesome, but on a contending team his flaws are all shown.

However, OG is worth that type of return. At years end, the move for Donte, Moody Jr and Kuminga should be revisited for OG. Removing Iggy and jMichael Green opens some monies to make a trade for 7th Starter.

Curry, Klay, Poole, Wiggins, Draymond, Looney, GP2, OG. A very solid rotation, The other 6 players will be veterans and rookie contracts. GS requires a Center.

Raptors should pursue the above trade. If Raps are successful, than Young is released, Flynn is dropped, and OPJ is renewing his return,

If FVV, Trent Jr., and Poetl are all signed.

Than the Raptors can be under the projected luxury tax.

FVV, Trent Jr., Barnes, Siakam, Poetl
Donte, Moody Jr. Kuminga, Boucher, Achuiwa
OPJ, FRP (Point Guard), 2 more players.
Salary Projected total of $152 Million with the Luxury Tax of $160 Million.

[The Great One]

This hand wringing only makes sense if you think Koloko is a total bust.

I think he's a good player (already a great shot blocker) with lots of development potential. I also think he'll be ready to be full time backup C next season, playing around 20 minutes a game.

We made the Thad trade because we were a solid playoff team that needed bench help. Blame the team for overachieving and making that the case. Had we beaten Philly would you guys be OK with the trade?

There is no such thing as a 2nd round bust.

[Demographic Shift]

We have until June 2024 to replace the draft pick we sent out. Why in the hell would we need to address that yesterday?

Returns for OG will be better this offseason than they were now if we decide to deal him. The up and comers with a bazillion draft picks like OKC and Utah will be in the market for an OG this summer. They weren't at the deadline because they're not contending this year. They'll be interested in contending next year and they have everything we'd want in an OG trade. Young players and picks.

The thing about the offseason and FA is that there is no irrevocable best before date and time that you have to act by. .. as the song says...it goes on and on and on. You cant trade Fred or Gary or Jak until you actually get a signature on a contract post the end of the free agent moratorium. That could be on the day the moratorium lifts or well into the new season in July. OG isn't an FA but this years draft will have happened and teams sense of urgency is pretty low after they add an FA or a draft pick. A little more lets see what we got here attitude is evident. Draft night trades featuring established players do happen... but not as many as at the trade deadline.

The february trade deadline is different. You gotta decide on or before 3PM Eastern on a specific date. Urgency is high. The playoffs are in sight. In year draft picks as well as subsequent year are very much in play depending on where you are in the playoff hunt or the tank cycle. And sellers have more leverage. After the trade deadline that leverage has dissipated or just gone. Teams who might take a risk to get that one player that they believe gets them out of the first round or second round or even to the dance is gone.

That.. .and as BrydenB points out we bungled the Poeltl trade. We took on a player that will in all likelihood lower the asset value of this years pick .. instead of potentially picking in the lottery with a chance to move "up" in the draft....we might now be in mid to high teens. Exacerbating that boo-boo is we traded next years FRP to inflict that hurt on ourselves. Thats just a poor decision.

We could have fixed that at the deadline... but it didn't happen.

[The Claw Reborn]

The thing about the offseason and FA is that there is no irrevocable best before date and time that you have to act by. .. as the song says...it goes on and on and on. You cant trade Fred or Gary or Jak until you actually get a signature on a contract post the end of the free agent moratorium. That could be on the day the moratorium lifts or well into the new season in July. OG isn't an FA but this years draft will have happened and teams sense of urgency is pretty low after they add an FA or a draft pick. A little more lets see what we got here attitude is evident. Draft night trades do happen... but not as many as at the trade deadline.

The february trade deadline is different. You gotta decide on or before 3PM Eastern on a specific date. Urgency is high. The playoffs are in sight. In year draft picks as well as subsequent year are very much in play depending on where you are in the playoff hunt or the tank cycle. And sellers have more leverage. After the trade deadline that leverage has dissipated or just gone. Teams who might take a risk to get that one player that they believe gets them out of the first round or second round or even to the dance is gone.

That.. .and as BrydenB points out we bungled the Poeltl trade. We took on a player that will in all likelihood lower the asset value of this years pick .. instead of potentially picking in the lottery with a chance to move "up" in the draft....we might now be in mid to high teens. Exacerbating that boo-boo is we traded next years FRP to inflict that hurt on ourselves. Thats just a poor decision.

We could have fixed that at the deadline... but it didn't happen.

Well said sir…glad you are back and active….so you were not the collateral damage

[Yuri Gagarin]

Theres mention we may need to shed someone like boucher to sign the rest. Why not do that already? Bouch for an expiring, trade thad for like what we got a pick flip or a second then just sign poetl outright and save the picks. This wudda also helped get a higher pick this summer

[saints91]

We have until the end of the season next year to figure out how to get under the tax.

[Demographic Shift]

I have seen no one suggest they were offered gold. Every report has been about how the offers fell short or the Raptors prices were considered too pricey for the other teams. The ONLY reports I've seen are that there were multi-pick packages for OG (all of which project to be low on lottery picks) with no established prospects included, and the offers for Fred that have been reported are all awful.

Another recap outside of the Toronto bubble from the ringer on the pratfall the Raps took on deadline day.
2023 NBA Trade Deadline Winners and Losers - The Ringer

Losers: Chicago Bulls and Toronto Raptors


These are not good teams! And even with the Nets no longer being a looming bogeyman in the East, neither one is going to do anything in this year’s playoffs anyway. The Raptors step out of the deadline as buyers, which is odd because they walked in looking to sell. They clearly think Jakob Poeltl can be their long-term difference maker at center, and that belief may not be wrong. They need an interior presence on both ends, even if he isn’t the best fit next to Scottie Barnes.

But to apparently believe they can re-sign Fred VanVleet and Gary Trent Jr. this summer is a different matter. (Both can be unrestricted free agents in a few months, and since Toronto is not good with them, an expensive reinvestment doesn’t make the most sense.) Were the offers for OG Anunoby really that far below what Masai Ujiri wanted right now? Did they cool after Kevin Durant went to the Suns? Curious stuff!

[Primer]

The thing about the offseason and FA is that there is no irrevocable best before date and time that you have to act by. .. as the song says...it goes on and on and on. You cant trade Fred or Gary or Jak until you actually get a signature on a contract post the end of the free agent moratorium. That could be on the day the moratorium lifts or well into the new season in July. OG isn't an FA but this years draft will have happened and teams sense of urgency is pretty low after they add an FA or a draft pick. A little more lets see what we got here attitude is evident. Draft night trades featuring established players do happen... but not as many as at the trade deadline.

The february trade deadline is different. You gotta decide on or before 3PM Eastern on a specific date. Urgency is high. The playoffs are in sight. In year draft picks as well as subsequent year are very much in play depending on where you are in the playoff hunt or the tank cycle. And sellers have more leverage. After the trade deadline that leverage has dissipated or just gone. Teams who might take a risk to get that one player that they believe gets them out of the first round or second round or even to the dance is gone.

That.. .and as BrydenB points out we bungled the Poeltl trade. We took on a player that will in all likelihood lower the asset value of this years pick .. instead of potentially picking in the lottery with a chance to move "up" in the draft....we might now be in mid to high teens. Exacerbating that boo-boo is we traded next years FRP to inflict that hurt on ourselves. Thats just a poor decision.

We could have fixed that at the deadline... but it didn't happen.

We can still trade OG for picks in this draft, nothing lost there, no urgency to move OG.

Would have loved to trade Fred and Gary for picks but none were offered. So what is there to cry about?

Poeltl is a long term piece that we had to trade for, we don't have cap space. He's worth more than a mid to late 1st in a poor 2024 draft.

We're too good to tank this year, and other teams are too bad to catch. This draft is top heavy, so unless we secured a top 3 pick we weren't getting a game changer. I think we'll be able to get just as good a player at 15 as we would have at 9.

I think most of your animosity here boils down to you believing in fantasy trade offers that didn't exist, and continuing the fantasy by thinking we turned down those offers.

[Primer]

Another recap outside of the Toronto bubble from the ringer on the pratfall the Raps took on deadline day.
2023 NBA Trade Deadline Winners and Losers - The Ringer

Losers: Chicago Bulls and Toronto Raptors


These are not good teams! And even with the Nets no longer being a looming bogeyman in the East, neither one is going to do anything in this year’s playoffs anyway. The Raptors step out of the deadline as buyers, which is odd because they walked in looking to sell. They clearly think Jakob Poeltl can be their long-term difference maker at center, and that belief may not be wrong. They need an interior presence on both ends, even if he isn’t the best fit next to Scottie Barnes.

But to apparently believe they can re-sign Fred VanVleet and Gary Trent Jr. this summer is a different matter. (Both can be unrestricted free agents in a few months, and since Toronto is not good with them, an expensive reinvestment doesn’t make the most sense.) Were the offers for OG Anunoby really that far below what Masai Ujiri wanted right now? Did they cool after Kevin Durant went to the Suns? Curious stuff!

This is a reasonable take that doesn't sound bad.

Raptors solved their center problem. That's good.

Raptors believe they can resign Fred and Gary. Good again.

Raptors didn't get good enough offers for OG so they didn't take them. Also good.

[Demographic Shift]

We can still trade OG for picks in this draft, nothing lost there, no urgency to move OG.

Would have loved to trade Fred and Gary for picks but none were offered. So what is there to cry about?

Poeltl is a long term piece that we had to trade for, we don't have cap space. He's worth more than a mid to late 1st in a poor 2024 draft.

We're too good to tank this year, and other teams are too bad to catch. This draft is top heavy, so unless we secured a top 3 pick we weren't getting a game changer. I think we'll be able to get just as good a player at 15 as we would have at 9.

I think most of your animosity here boils down to you believing in fantasy trade offers that didn't exist, and continuing the fantasy by thinking we turned down those offers.

We can still trade OG for picks in this draft, nothing lost there, no urgency to move OG.
No.. no urgency to move him... Just a boatload of lost opportunity cost.

Would have loved to trade Fred and Gary for picks but none were offered. So what is there to cry about?
Agree.. never thought we would get much for Fred and Gary.
For OG yes.

Poeltl is a long term piece that we had to trade for, we don't have cap space. He's worth more than a mid to late 1st in a poor 2024 draft.
The Walker Kessler for Thad trade somewhat debunks that. Could Kessler shit the bed going forward. He could. But it appears unlikely.

We're too good to tank this year, and other teams are too bad to catch. This draft is top heavy, so unless we secured a top 3 pick we weren't getting a game changer. I think we'll be able to get just as good a player at 15 as we would have at 9.
Landing in the 6th or 7th or 8th draft slot was very doable before we traded for Poeltl. If getting a player at 15 is as desirable as getting one at 9 or 7 why don't GMs ask for lower value draft picks instead of higher ones ?

I think most of your animosity here boils down to you believing in fantasy trade offers that didn't exist, and continuing the fantasy by thinking we turned down those offers.
The preponderance of evidence on trade interest for OG or Fred says there was more than tepid interest. I think a sense of disappointment over lost opportunity to improve the team better describes my position rather than animosity.