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  • chris wrote: View Post

    i'm not sure where you got this but it matches what i'm watching. pascal iso's the shit out of the ball.

    he's very good at it obviously and has become effective creating for others when he's doubled, but it keeps the ball out of everyone else's hands similar to other super ball-dominant players, which is a play style i absolutely hate and have been railing against for most of my years posting here.

    i love pascal, but i think the rest of this roster falls into place without him and he's the only player i'd be looking to move at this point. i understand everyone's hesitancy because he's our best player, but watching scottie's growth this month i think moving him would fast-track scottie's development and put him on a path to superstardom (his ORTG in january is 129 (!)).
    Even if Scotty fast tracks into a superstar, you'd need a Pascal with him to win anything....
    How long til we develop another Pascal?
    How long til we develop another OG?

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    • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post

      It would be hilarious after all these drama that Masai and Bobby stands pat


      golden wrote: View Post

      Worse… this team has a nice run of games before the trade deadline and they fork over another FRP for a win-now player. That’s probably plan A. They truly want to believe in this core and Nurse.
      This ^^^

      but I have much nauseating leading to projectile vomiting kind of prediction….

      Masai and Bobby not only forked another FRP for a win now player…but they will essentially pay Mr.VanVleet a massive contract around 130 million in the offseason because they are totally sane individuals and they rely on the horde rationale that …” freds been playing a LOT better this past stretch even when he isn't scoring, the reality is fred is being paid like the 2nd best player on the team, and with the caveat of the usual ups and downs a player goes through, so far he's lived up to those expectations.”

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      • Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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        • MixxAOR wrote: View Post
          That's definitely not shooting down any of the rumors.

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          • Limited Upside wrote: View Post

            He’s averaging the same number of shots per game as he has for basically the last 4 seasons. And averaging over 6 assists.
            that is true, with the obvious differences being that we were winning games (except for the tampa season) and didn't have a potential superstar on the roster who also needs the ball but currently doesn't touch it much when sharing the floor with pascal.

            the assists look good but are inflated because he has the ball so much and they also come in the manner that i hate*, similar to doncic/cavs lebron/houston harden/OKC westbrook

            * i.e. an iso possession in which he either looks to get his own shot or makes the pass (as a last resort) that leads directly to the shot. it's a bullshit style of basketball that does not empower or engage the other players on the floor and leads to a lot of standing around and watching. he doesn't use nearly as many possessions as those guys do/did but the one's he is using in the halfcourt look very much the same, and i hate it (and always have).

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            • JawsGT wrote: View Post
              I have no issues trading pascal, but I dont think his tendency to iso should be the reason. It's by design, Pascal isn't hijacking the offence. At the beginning of the season Pascal was brilliant, patient with the ball, worked the D, and found guys all over the court for easy looks. The team was hitting shots and guys were moving. Then the shots stopped falling, defences eased off our shooters and pascal had less space to operate. Still pascal continued to produce, despite having a much more difficult time getting into the paint and to the basket due to the packed paint. The team still hunts mismatches with Fred, pascal and og, iso is still a big part of the approach. I hate it too but I don't think it's pascal "fault" and not justification for moving him imo.
              i don't disagree that it's by design but feel like the frequency of isolations is up significantly this year from previous ones. probably there's a way to look that up but i don't know where

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              • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                Even if Scotty fast tracks into a superstar, you'd need a Pascal with him to win anything....
                How long til we develop another Pascal?
                How long til we develop another OG?
                Sigh. This again?

                Scottie is not going to develop into a star/superstar overnight. If he ever becomes one we're probably talking 2-3 years from now. Siakam is already 29 years old. Is he going to be the same player 3 years from now? no. Athletes reach a certain age when their abilities begin to decline, for most, this usually occurs around the age of 33. Your favorite player LeBron James is an outlier.
                Mamba Mentality

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                • i will say this nurse is not going anywhere

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                  • G__Deane wrote: View Post

                    Even if Scotty fast tracks into a superstar, you'd need a Pascal with him to win anything....
                    How long til we develop another Pascal?
                    How long til we develop another OG?
                    agreed that scottie would need more to win at a high level even if he ascends to superstar. i just disagree that that player archetype is pascal.

                    and i'm not advocating an OG trade. i'm not really advocating a trade of anyone other than pascal, who i just don't think is a good fit with scottie for all the reason's i've mentioned in numerous posts over the last couple days.

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                    • golden wrote: View Post

                      That's definitely not shooting down any of the rumors.
                      I dunno, he makes it seem like it's all a bunch of BS that he's not going to get into. Like he's annoyed that a story like that even exists.

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                      • Dvdvideo wrote: View Post

                        I dunno, he makes it seem like it's all a bunch of BS that he's not going to get into. Like he's annoyed that a story like that even exists.
                        It's probably more annoying if it's true and you don't want to lie when you answer the questions.

                        OG could have easily said: "I'm happy with my role and I want to be in Toronto for the rest of my career." Done and done.

                        For a man of few words, that would have been the appropriate response to shoot down the rumors for the rest of this season. He dodged the issues, rather than shooting it down directly.

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                        • The Great One wrote: View Post

                          Sigh. This again?

                          Scottie is not going to develop into a star/superstar overnight. If he ever becomes one we're probably talking 2-3 years from now. Siakam is already 29 years old. Is he going to be the same player 3 years from now? no. Athletes reach a certain age when their abilities begin to decline, for most, this usually occurs around the age of 33. Your favorite player LeBron James is an outlier.
                          How about this again.

                          Siakam is only 28, started BB late and has been improving every year.
                          A ton of the best players in the NBA are in their 30's.

                          When was the last NBA team to win a Chip without a player in their 30's?

                          If Scotty is out best player at 25, we'd be looking for a Pascal to be the 1B we already had him
                          And we can ever seem to get the 1A type here but you'd want to sell on the 1B?

                          Move Fred first and let's see what Pascal, freed up Scotty, OG, Achiuwa, Koloko and the (hopefully significant) return for Fred can do.

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                          • OG's value is high because of his contract situation. Woj says teams are reluctant to give up picks for potentially rental players.
                            Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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                            • golden wrote: View Post

                              That's definitely not shooting down any of the rumors.
                              No, it's not. Those were pretty slippery answers! Again, though, easy to read too much into stuff.

                              Comment


                              • MixxAOR wrote: View Post


                                OG's value is high because of his contract situation. Woj says teams are reluctant to give up picks for potentially rental players.
                                Yup. That's why I said the time to trade Fred (among many other times) was last year. The receiving team gets 2 playoff runs, plus an off-season to fix any chemistry issues. Trade value drops considerably in the last year of the contract, entering UFA.

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