Problem w/ the Offence

[raptors999]

It's simple guys.

Teams realized that if you pressure/trap Lowry with a taller guard on the catch you can shut him and the rest of the team down. Lowry has difficulty passing out or into the paint against bigger defenders.

That's why GV is in starting line-up and Derozan and Ross are being pushed to drive and kick more.

The best examples of this were the Nets and Bucks games. Both teams used their length to disrupt Lowry into throwing bad passes and taking bad shots. Three incidents in the Buck games stick out: when Lowry tried to dump a bad pass a couple of times to JV after driving, and his wild desperation lob to JV in transition.

Part of the reason why we won the Clipper game is a) DeRozan handled the ball more and had a great passing game and b) our guards/SF match up well with theirs in terms of size. Chris Paul is one of the few guards Lowry has a weight/size advantage on.

Its because he's playing SG next to GV. PG aren't trapped on catches but bringing the ball up court. If he isn't ball handling in a set he isn't the PG.

[bryan colangelo]

noticing a trend? looks like we've been figured out especially on offence, and we got a hard month ahead so february may end up looking even worse february we've been playing mostly bottom ten offensive teams and look at our defRT for it..

It's simple guys.

Teams realized that if you pressure/trap Lowry with a taller guard on the catch you can shut him and the rest of the team down. Lowry has difficulty passing out or into the paint against bigger defenders.

That's why GV is in starting line-up and Derozan and Ross are being pushed to drive and kick more.

The best examples of this were the Nets and Bucks games. Both teams used their length to disrupt Lowry into throwing bad passes and taking bad shots. Three incidents in the Buck games stick out: when Lowry tried to dump a bad pass a couple of times to JV after driving, and his wild desperation lob to JV in transition.

Part of the reason why we won the Clipper game is a) DeRozan handled the ball more and had a great passing game and b) our guards/SF match up well with theirs in terms of size. Chris Paul is one of the few guards Lowry has a weight/size advantage on.

[stooley]

Yeah it does, and we're barely in the top 10 on offense and hilariously bad defensively.

What?

[Mindlessness]

yeah, it does. but the February part is only two games, and the January part includes our 'slump'

Yeah it does, and we're barely in the top 10 on offense and hilariously bad defensively.

[cinqueda]

yeah, it does. but the February part is only two games, and the January part includes our 'slump'

both true, but february's schedule only get's worse and yeah jan includes the derozan injury and slump, and our defence is climbing back up.

[stooley]

November
110.6 OFFRT(#2) 101.8 DEFRT(#10)

December
112.9 OFFRT(#1) 106.0 DEFRT(#20)

January
105.3 OFFRT(#9) 105.9 DEFRT(#26)

February
94.6 OFFRT(#28) 104.0 DEFRT(#16)

noticing a trend? looks like we've been figured out especially on offence, and we got a hard month ahead so february may end up looking even worse february we've been playing mostly bottom ten offensive teams and look at our defRT for it..

yeah, it does. but the February part is only two games, and the January part includes our 'slump'

[cinqueda]

November
110.6 OFFRT(#2) 101.8 DEFRT(#10)

December
112.9 OFFRT(#1) 106.0 DEFRT(#20)

January
105.3 OFFRT(#9) 105.9 DEFRT(#26)

February
94.6 OFFRT(#28) 104.0 DEFRT(#16)

noticing a trend? looks like we've been figured out especially on offence, and we got a hard month ahead so february may end up looking even worse february we've been playing mostly bottom ten offensive teams and look at our defRT for it..

[stooley]

Why do u keep saying this?

Ok... because it does? It's second best in the league?

I'm talking purely about effectiveness here. I know there's room for improvement, that's not what I'm saying. I'm just saying that from the tone here, it comes off as if our offense isn't working at all, not that it isn't working as well as possible.

Our offence has been exposed. It's EXTREMELY predictable . You are absolutely incorrect and please don't show me a stats from earlier in this season.

Yes this team has GREAT offensive players. And they did devise offensive ISO schemes which gave the players shots where they like it. But it was such a brain dead unadjustable plan that is totally ruined. Our offence does not rock , it socks.

You keep saying this lol. Do you even watch the games - to be specific post Portland?
Because I don't give 2 cents about the blowout 40 point game we had against Milwaukee early this season. I care about the last game we played them in.
Even the forefront of Dwayne Casey's supporters admit the offence looks terrible And plead don't give me that " guys not making shots they usually make"
The real issue is " guys are expected to make extremely tough shots"

It's easy when no one studies your offence but when your rank 1 in the league, your going to raise some eye brows. Raptors don't get easy shots and contested 3's and long twos with no ball movement or complete fail of play calling is not a high percentage look.
If your on a hot streak, which these players are capable of doing (goes to show their skill) . Sure in that case Lou Williams can do some crazy stuff, maybe Lowry and demar making circus shots they don't consistently make.

But if the offence was good , these would be wide open looks.

Lets see what happens tonight vs the clippers , will the clippers adjust? How much will we score. Will they be contested shots? Are guys expected to make contested shots? Complete free lancing , pick up basketball offence ?

So... let me try and summarize your points here:

Our offense is number 2 in the league by ORTG that's fact - here http://www.basketball-reference.com/...5_ratings.html
and number 4 by OFFRTG - http://stats.nba.com/league/team/#!/...F_RATING&dir=1

We have to start from there. It's our baseline.

1. Our offense has gotten worse since the Portland game.
That's true, our OFFRTG has dropped from 4th to 9th (I cant get ORTG by month, don't know where to find it) from that game through today

2. That drop is caused by teams figuring out how to stop our offense, and will therefore continue throughout the season unless our style of offense changes.

Maybe.
But in the period since we broke our 'slump' from the road trip through the Memphis game, we're back up to fifth in OffRtg (those teams were mostly crappy, but averaged out, we played essentially a league average defense through that stretch).

Philly: 12th best Drtg
Detroit: 18th best Drtg
Indiana: 11th best Drtg
Sacramento: 26th best Drtg
Brooklyn: 17th best Drtg
Washington: 10th best Drtg
Milwaukee: 3rd best Drtg
Brooklyn: 17th best Drtg

For an average of 14.25

On top of that you have issues of small sample sizes which should lead someone looking purely at the stats to not stray too far from the overall number, which includes that stretch of bad games.

And finally, yes, I do watch the games. And I've seen the same thing you have, and it looks ugly. But I'm also aware that my bias as a fan, along with having watched a lot less of other teams, makes it hard for me to objectively compare the EFFECTIVENESS of our offense to other teams, which is why I'm relying so much on stats.

One more thing: what happens tonight vs the clippers isn't going to prove anything. It's one game.

[SamMitchells]

These criticisms are all fair - there is lots of room for improvement.

But it's important to keep perspective. Our offense f*cking rocks this league.

Why do u keep saying this?

Our offence has been exposed. It's EXTREMELY predictable . You are absolutely incorrect and please don't show me a stats from earlier in this season.

Yes this team has GREAT offensive players. And they did devise offensive ISO schemes which gave the players shots where they like it. But it was such a brain dead unadjustable plan that is totally ruined. Our offence does not rock , it socks.

You keep saying this lol. Do you even watch the games - to be specific post Portland?
Because I don't give 2 cents about the blowout 40 point game we had against Milwaukee early this season. I care about the last game we played them in.
Even the forefront of Dwayne Casey's supporters admit the offence looks terrible And plead don't give me that " guys not making shots they usually make"
The real issue is " guys are expected to make extremely tough shots"

It's easy when no one studies your offence but when your rank 1 in the league, your going to raise some eye brows. Raptors don't get easy shots and contested 3's and long twos with no ball movement or complete fail of play calling is not a high percentage look.
If your on a hot streak, which these players are capable of doing (goes to show their skill) . Sure in that case Lou Williams can do some crazy stuff, maybe Lowry and demar making circus shots they don't consistently make.

But if the offence was good , these would be wide open looks.

Lets see what happens tonight vs the clippers , will the clippers adjust? How much will we score. Will they be contested shots? Are guys expected to make contested shots? Complete free lancing , pick up basketball offence ?

[3inthekeon]

NBA.com -> Team Stats -> Raptors -> Tracking (drop down menu) -> Shots

Thank you.

[DanH]

Where do you find these numbers, Dan?

NBA.com -> Team Stats -> Raptors -> Tracking (drop down menu) -> Shots

[stooley]

These criticisms are all fair - there is lots of room for improvement.

But it's important to keep perspective. Our offense f*cking rocks this league.

[golden]

The problem isn't the 3's. The problem is the off-the-dribble 3's.

Catch and shoot threes: 39%
Pull-up threes: 28%

And a full third of all our three point attempts are pull-up threes. Craziness.

And of those catch & shoot three's, how many of them are primary or 2nd option, swinging the ball to the open shooter "in-rhythm" threes vs. bailout, contested or near end-of-clock threes.

[3inthekeon]

The problem isn't the 3's. The problem is the off-the-dribble 3's.

Catch and shoot threes: 39%
Pull-up threes: 28%

And a full third of all our three point attempts are pull-up threes. Craziness.

Where do you find these numbers, Dan?

[godkingleonidas]

Another problem with the offense is the same problem found on defense. On defense, we can't keep opposing wings/guards from driving to the rim. Conversely, our wings/guards can't get to the rim so, they turn the ball over or jack up low percentage shots.