Rumour: Raptors Still Looking For A Big Man

[breakin_ankles]

I just really think Amir leaving will damage team morale and chemistry... He has been here the longest, it's very different if we loose him in free agency than using him as a trade chip.

[blackjitsu]

I think he fits great. His probably one of the fastest and quickest 4s in the league. Casey defensive is all about his bigs being able to hedge and recover fast to the paint. Also his a plus rebounder. Something we need more of.

But he's not the best defender, only has 2 moves in the block, and can't stretch out defenses. Faried is built for teams playing at a high pace. He crushes guys by getting back faster than any other big, allowing to post deep in the block, and then beating his man back on defense, disrupting where they set up. Scraptor is right -- pace is THE most important factor when considering Faried. He just doesn't fit the Raps system (or lack there of depending on your thoughts on Casey).

The Raps need either a stretch 4 with decent defense to start (say move PatPat to the starters giving Amir minutes as the first big off the bench), or a defense first, long PF, who can guard out to the perimeter, who gets junk buckets (doesn't need plays run for them) those are the 2 PF archetypes they should be looking at first.

Obviously, for the right price they shouldn't say no to David West, I just think a lot of the names being mentioned don't work-- because of how their games would fit with the Rap starters.

[big boi]

I just really think Amir leaving will damage team morale and chemistry... He has been here the longest, it's very different if we loose him in free agency than using him as a trade chip.

its a cliche - but it's a business. The players would understand. They're professionals, or should be. Amir has been a good pro in TO, but he is not at his best. Despite shortcomings I have pointed out with Amir, I really like the guy. I like his team play on offence, I like his toughness, I like his basketball IQ. And I'd be happy if we made a trade for a PF and Amir was a back up 4/5. But I do not believe he is a good enough starter if this team wants to get to the next level. And you have to give up something of value to get something of value. But I suspect 2pat has more value these days with the popularity of the stretch 4.

[big boi]

But he's not the best defender, only has 2 moves in the block, and can't stretch out defenses. Faried is built for teams playing at a high pace. He crushes guys by getting back faster than any other big, allowing to post deep in the block, and then beating his man back on defense, disrupting where they set up. Scraptor is right -- pace is THE most important factor when considering Faried. He just doesn't fit the Raps system (or lack there of depending on your thoughts on Casey).

The Raps need either a stretch 4 with decent defense to start (say move PatPat to the starters giving Amir minutes as the first big off the bench), or a defense first, long PF, who can guard out to the perimeter, who gets junk buckets (doesn't need plays run for them) those are the 2 PF archetypes they should be looking at first.

Obviously, for the right price they shouldn't say no to David West, I just think a lot of the names being mentioned don't work-- because of how their games would fit with the Rap starters.

It's true we do, and should, play at a relatively slow tempo. But we do break, and he would enable us to be better on the break. Do think Faried isn't bad at setting screens, helping ball movement in a half court offence, he's also an excellent offensive rebounder, providing more shot attempts in a half court offence. Plus he can drive and get to the hole and hit foul shots. That helps open up the floor, breaks down defences. I don't think Faried is the be all and end all, at all, but I do think he might be the best player available to us for a price we might be prepared to pay.

[breakin_ankles]

its a cliche - but it's a business. The players would understand. They're professionals, or should be. Amir has been a good pro in TO, but he is not at his best. Despite shortcomings I have pointed out with Amir, I really like the guy. I like his team play on offence, I like his toughness, I like his basketball IQ. And I'd be happy if we made a trade for a PF and Amir was a back up 4/5. But I do not believe he is a good enough starter if this team wants to get to the next level. And you have to give up something of value to get something of value. But I suspect 2pat has more value these days with the popularity of the stretch 4.

This is why a line up shake up would be better for us than a mid season trade, if we make an adjustment to say, start JJ & 2pat with Amir being a backup 4/5 now. Just play out the year and try to get Amir back on a fair contract, knowing that health is a factor.

KLow / GV
DD / Lou
JJ / Ross
2pat / Hands
JV / Amir

These line up moves give us a good balance of spacing / offense / defence for both the starters and bench. I would be completely confident in our teams ability for not only the rest of the season but also this year's playoff to atleast get out of the first round.. Then in the offseason, make out moves.

[3inthekeon]

Just looking at RPM WAR numbers.

Overall NBA rank

Amir #65
Faried #68
Taj #86
West #149

Four other Raptors in the top 90:

Lowry #6
Lou #44
JJ #83
PPat #84

[RepTdot]

I don't disagree with your points. But we'd need to give up more than that of course. Something we don't want to lose. Like 2016 pick, Ross, 2pat would have to be included.

landing Faired & Chandler is worth Ross...i'd say the NYK 2016 pick should be untouchable but Ross, 1 of the 2015-2017 1st rd picks and any expiring contracts (except Lou)- Amir, Fields, Hayes, Hansborugh, Steamer can be in play.

[RepTdot]

I think he fits great. His probably one of the fastest and quickest 4s in the league. Casey defensive is all about his bigs being able to hedge and recover fast to the paint. Also his a plus rebounder. Something we need more of.

couldn't agree more, his offence isn't what we're getting here, Faried's real value is that relentless motor of his that makes him one of the NBA's elite rebounders (reminds me of Rodman in his glory days) and the energy he brings on the defensive end, his offensive game is cuts to the basket, post situations, and open transition...all things that fit into our system(or can be improved in our system)

[MACK11]

Faried is terrible

-No defense
-No range
-Overpaid

The only things he's good at is offensive rebounding and we're already good at that.

[MACK11]

couldn't agree more, his offence isn't what we're getting here, Faried's real value is that relentless motor of his that makes him one of the NBA's elite rebounders (reminds me of Rodman in his glory days) and the energy he brings on the defensive end, his offensive game is cuts to the basket, post situations, and open transition...all things that fit into our system(or can be improved in our system)

He can bring all the energy he wants on defense but it's not changing the fact that he's 6'7" and will get abused in the post

[MACK11]

I really don't think Amir is an above average defender. In fact it is his offence I like the most. If we could get a guy that could rebound, defend well and block shots that would be great. Offence is gravy.

Amir is an above average defender , I have no idea why you think not?

[caccia]

KLow / GV
DD / Lou
JJ / Ross
2pat / Hands
JV / Amir

These line up moves give us a good balance of spacing / offense / defence for both the starters and bench. I would be completely confident in our teams ability for not only the rest of the season but also this year's playoff to atleast get out of the first round.. Then in the offseason, make our moves.

I completely agree. Patrick Patterson addressed this issue last week, saying essentially that several front offices in the past have tried to improve on what was already a very good team, and only succeeded in wrecking what they already had:

“You look at history where teams have been in a positive situation, they’ve been winning or maybe they’ve lost but they’re in a great situation as far as standings go, but then they make a trade and the next thing you know that trade messes up the chemistry,” said Patterson after a short practice with Ujiri looking on from the sidelines.

In short, Patterson said, trying to fix things via the trade route can backfire. Without good chemistry — something the Raptors have touted as a strength this season — a little slump can rapidly become an ugly downwards spiral, he warned.

“It causes them to play horribly, to have problems in the locker room, resulting in a horrible season after that and losing in the playoffs too early. You look in the past, that’s happened a number of times,” said Patterson.

I would add that you need look no further than last years Indiana Pacers, who were absolutely dominant until two mid-season trades, one of which shipped out Pacers leader Danny Granger, who was recovering from injury.

[big boi]

Amir is an above average defender , I have no idea why you think not?

From watching evey game for years. From knowing what good defence is. Now why do you think Faried is "terrible"? Pretty sure I've seen more of Amir than you've seen of Faried.

[planetmars]

Interesting to see David West as the guy the Raptors would be the most interested in considering he has a player option for next year which would make things difficult for Masai when it comes to planning. I don't think West moves the dial much for the Raptors.. ie, I don't think it would instantly turn them into contenders this year.

Personally I think what the Raptors should do is look for a combo guard that can defend PG's.. and to get rid of GV in the process.

[RepTdot]

He can bring all the energy he wants on defense but it's not changing the fact that he's 6'7" and will get abused in the post

Faried is 6'8 but hold his own in the paint...and just for arguments sake...Rodman- one of the greatest rebounders, defenders & energy players of all time was 6'7 at PF. Basketball IQ is worth much more than size.