Everything WNBA

[Primer]

Is it normal in the WNBA for a PF who takes 86% of their shots within 10 feet to have a 40% FG?

I quickly looked around the league and that seems insanely low for a PF in the WNBA, even in their rookie season.

[DanH]

Is it normal in the WNBA for a PF who takes 86% of their shots within 10 feet to have a 40% FG?

I quickly looked around the league and that seems insanely low for a PF in the WNBA, even in their rookie season.

Of the players who take the highest percentage of their shots within 3 feet of the rim (200 minutes played minimum):
Angel takes 55% of her shots there, 3rd in the league.
Of the top 10 players in quantity of shots there, her 52% at the rim is 9th. Olivia Nelson-Ododa is at 48%. Of those top 10 players, 3 more have a FG% in that range above Reese's 52% but below 60%. So, poor, but in family, not exactly unheard of.

Of the players who take the highest percentage of their shots in the 3-10 foot range:
Angel takes 30% of her shots there, 37th in the league.
Of the top 50 players in quantity of shots there, her 26% is 2nd last. 3 other players have very similar numbers though, Cardoso, Burrell and Sutton.

It's these away from the rim shots that kill her percentages the most. Very limited scorer. But again, not like unheard of inefficiency or anything special. Just the regular amount of real bad efficiency for the league. Good news is she claws a lot of that back with offensive boards. Similar to how Clark has wild turnover numbers (although in her case those truly are unheard of) but provides so much value elsewhere that she more than compensates for it.

[Primer]

Of the players who take the highest percentage of their shots within 3 feet of the rim (200 minutes played minimum):
Angel takes 55% of her shots there, 3rd in the league.
Of the top 10 players in quantity of shots there, her 52% at the rim is 9th. Olivia Nelson-Ododa is at 48%. Of those top 10 players, 3 more have a FG% in that range above Reese's 52% but below 60%. So, poor, but in family, not exactly unheard of.

Of the players who take the highest percentage of their shots in the 3-10 foot range:
Angel takes 30% of her shots there, 37th in the league.
Of the top 50 players in quantity of shots there, her 26% is 2nd last. 3 other players have very similar numbers though, Cardoso, Burrell and Sutton.

It's these away from the rim shots that kill her percentages the most. Very limited scorer. But again, not like unheard of inefficiency or anything special. Just the regular amount of real bad efficiency for the league. Good news is she claws a lot of that back with offensive boards. Similar to how Clark has wild turnover numbers (although in her case those truly are unheard of) but provides so much value elsewhere that she more than compensates for it.

Clarks high turnovers is largely due to her having a ridiculous amount of assists is it not?

If you're dishing out 13 assists then 5 turnovers isn't really a big deal. Assist to turnover ratio is a very important metric for a reason, provides much needed context.

I'd be way more connected about a big who can't score efficiently so close to the basket.

[DanH]

Clarks high turnovers is largely due to her having a ridiculous amount of assists is it not?

If you're dishing out 13 assists then 5 turnovers isn't really a big deal. Assist to turnover ratio is a very important metric for a reason, provides much needed context.

I'd be way more connected about a big who can't score efficiently so close to the basket.

Sure, but same with the offensive rebounding for Reese being tied into her inefficiency at the basket - her misses provide more opportunities for the boards, but her boards limit the damage of her inefficiency. That's what I was saying - both players are providing a big positive that is kind of tied into their biggest drawback at the moment.

That said, if Clark was dishing out 13 assists then 5 turnovers would absolutely not be an issue. She's dishing out 7.8 assists to 5.6 turnovers. That 1.39 AST:TOV is the worst of the top 20 assist generators in the league, and of the 33 players averaging at least 3 assists per game, it is only better than 3, and all those three are basically identical to hers (1.24, 1.38, 1.30), and two of them are forwards. The next 18 assist generators (all the ones at or above 4 assists per game) after Clark have an average AST/TOV of 2.07, which is what you expect from primary creators.

[golden]

Sure, but same with the offensive rebounding for Reese being tied into her inefficiency at the basket - her misses provide more opportunities for the boards, but her boards limit the damage of her inefficiency. That's what I was saying - both players are providing a big positive that is kind of tied into their biggest drawback at the moment.

That said, if Clark was dishing out 13 assists then 5 turnovers would absolutely not be an issue. She's dishing out 7.8 assists to 5.6 turnovers. That 1.39 AST:TOV is the worst of the top 20 assist generators in the league, and of the 33 players averaging at least 3 assists per game, it is only better than 3, and all those three are basically identical to hers (1.24, 1.38, 1.30), and two of them are forwards. The next 18 assist generators (all the ones at or above 4 assists per game) after Clark have an average AST/TOV of 2.07, which is what you expect from primary creators.

I got no horse in this race… but shouldn’t you be looking at potential assists, which would account for teammate suckage.

[Primer]

Sure, but same with the offensive rebounding for Reese being tied into her inefficiency at the basket - her misses provide more opportunities for the boards, but her boards limit the damage of her inefficiency. That's what I was saying - both players are providing a big positive that is kind of tied into their biggest drawback at the moment.

That said, if Clark was dishing out 13 assists then 5 turnovers would absolutely not be an issue. She's dishing out 7.8 assists to 5.6 turnovers. That 1.39 AST:TOV is the worst of the top 20 assist generators in the league, and of the 33 players averaging at least 3 assists per game, it is only better than 3, and all those three are basically identical to hers (1.24, 1.38, 1.30), and two of them are forwards. The next 18 assist generators (all the ones at or above 4 assists per game) after Clark have an average AST/TOV of 2.07, which is what you expect from primary creators.

Have you looked at her more recent games? She's dishing out a ton more assists now than the start of the season.

Past 8 games Clark is averaging 11 assists and 5.5 TO for 2:1 Assist to Turnover Ratio.

Same turnovers, way more assists, seems like her teammates are finally making their buckets.

Reese on the other hand is moving in the opposite direction. Probably because she is forcing up a ton of bad shots desperately trying to hit 10 points so she could get a double double. But still insane how inefficient she is for someone who exclusively operates under the basket.

I also can't wrap my head around praising someone for grabbing a bunch of their own misses. Seems like setting the bar embarrassingly low for the WNBA. No one would be praising something like that in the NBA.

[A.I]

A lot of y'all had Chet winning the award lol just stop.

I say this about Chet, unlike Reese, Chet is actually a good player. This race between Clark and Reese is not close. It's no different than Wemby/Chet.

Right... or is that your narrative to make yourself look right?

Good thing awards are voted at the end of the season and not in November. If anyone did have Chet winning, they all switched to Wemby by the end.

Can't speak for anyone, but my thought was always along the lines of its Wemby's award to win, but don't forget about Chet.

[The Great One]

Right... or is that your narrative to make yourself look right?

Good thing awards are voted at the end of the season and not in November. If anyone did have Chet winning, they all switched to Wemby by the end.

Can't speak for anyone, but my thought was always along the lines of its Wemby's award to win, but don't forget about Chet.

I don't create narratives. My take during the Wemby/Chet days was no different than my Clark/Reese take. I said earlier in the season, when he was on a mins restriction that there was no race, Wemby's the ROY. The media created a lot of arguments for Chet, some people here bought it, it was all bullshit.

Clark is the ROY. Reese no disrespect is not in her level. She's a good energy player. That's it. This whole thing is silly. There is no race. If the season ended today, Clark's the ROY and it shouldn't even be close.

[DanH]

I got no horse in this race… but shouldn’t you be looking at potential assists, which would account for teammate suckage.

You are welcome to pull up those numbers if you can find them!

[DanH]

Have you looked at her more recent games? She's dishing out a ton more assists now than the start of the season.

Past 8 games Clark is averaging 11 assists and 5.5 TO for 2:1 Assist to Turnover Ratio.

Same turnovers, way more assists, seems like her teammates are finally making their buckets.

Reese on the other hand is moving in the opposite direction. Probably because she is forcing up a ton of bad shots desperately trying to hit 10 points so she could get a double double. But still insane how inefficient she is for someone who exclusively operates under the basket.

I also can't wrap my head around praising someone for grabbing a bunch of their own misses. Seems like setting the bar embarrassingly low for the WNBA. No one would be praising something like that in the NBA.

I've been saying in this very thread that of late Clark has been playing better and if she keeps it up she should win ROY. She hasn't been doing it long enough to change that the whole season to date is very comparable between the two yet, is all.

She doesn't just grab her own misses. Someone smart in WNBA media just wrote a piece looking at removing every players offensive rebounds after their own misses - and she still led the league. It's a very silly narrative.

As I showed, it's not insane inefficiency, it's just poor, very much in the normal range of outcomes for WNBA players who mostly operate inside, just on the low end.

[The Great One]

Clark tonight:

24pts 6rbs 19 assists(WNBA record).

Are we sure the "race" is still close?

[DanH]

Clark tonight:

24pts 6rbs 19 assists(WNBA record).

Are we sure the "race" is still close?

As mentioned a half dozen times by now, if Clark keeps doing stuff like this, instead of what she'd been doing for most of the season to date, there won't be much of a race for long.

[The Great One]

As mentioned a half dozen times by now, if Clark keeps doing stuff like this, instead of what she'd been doing for most of the season to date, there won't be much of a race for long.

What stuff? and what's the difference with the way she's playing now and early in the season? she's the same exact player. As I mentioned a half dozen times, there is no race. There was never a race. The whole Angel Reese thing was all clickbait and a lot of you fell for it.

[The Great One]

But she's not one of the best players in the WNBA right? that's why she wasn't selected to play for Team USA.

[Primer]

What stuff? and what's the difference with the way she's playing now and early in the season? she's the same exact player. As I mentioned a half dozen times, there is no race. There was never a race. The whole Angel Reese thing was all clickbait and a lot of you fell for it.

Yep. They are using her high turnovers like it's this awful thing but all the other highest TO in a season are the best WNBA players ever who had amazing seasons. It's the same in the NBA.