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Is masai done "evaluating"

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  • #16
    I really hope that he is. If he wants to continue his evaluation, then he really needs to address the PF and SF situations. You can not go forward with Ross and injured Amir in those positions and expect to really evaluate the true potential of KL,DD and JV as your core going forward.

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    • #17
      planetmars wrote: View Post
      I'm a big Masai fan.. I think he's got some moves up his sleeves that some will be wowed by (even bigger than the Bargnani trade).. but he did not fire Casey. And that's a huge negative in my opinion.
      Yeah, forgot about Casey, but I was mainly referring to player personnel. And I hope you are right.

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      • #18
        raptors999 wrote: View Post
        One of the duties of the GM is to be able to create deals. A GM that says there were no deals means he isn't able to do his job. Morey makes deals even small ones just to gain a reputation for being willing to pull the trigger. MU hasnt been doing anything
        I guess but MU never said there were no deals as far as I know. You don't deal just for the sake of it...there has to be a purpose, and to this point, we know of no deals that should have been made but weren't, even in hindsight.

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        • #19
          JawsGT wrote: View Post
          I guess but MU never said there were no deals as far as I know. You don't deal just for the sake of it...there has to be a purpose, and to this point, we know of no deals that should have been made but weren't, even in hindsight.
          Yeah, it's just not simple to make a deal. And we know Masai basically never advertises anything he does.

          One example of something at least some fans wanted was trying to acquire West. Toronto was linked to him, even if it was just rumours....But Indiana pulled him off the market. Reports stated they were listening to offers and shopping him, but when their season started going better, they decided to keep him and make a playoff push. So any fan getting mad at Masai for this "failure" should actually be mad at Larry Bird. Maybe Masai wasn't offering enough, but what should he offer for an aging PF who could opt out in the summer?

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          • #20
            raptors999 wrote: View Post
            If that's the case, not turning some of the expirings into assest that expire in 2016 was a huge waste. MU hasn't done anything
            People still act like expirings have huge value in this league and increasingly they have less and less, not least because GMs are now extremely wary about long-term contracts. Masai managing to ninja John Salmons' expiring into Lou and Bebe was probably one of the best expiring contract deals we've ever seen and it still cost us a second-rounder for a return that was average at best.

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            • #21
              white men can't jump wrote: View Post
              Yeah, it's just not simple to make a deal. And we know Masai basically never advertises anything he does.

              One example of something at least some fans wanted was trying to acquire West. Toronto was linked to him, even if it was just rumours....But Indiana pulled him off the market. Reports stated they were listening to offers and shopping him, but when their season started going better, they decided to keep him and make a playoff push. So any fan getting mad at Masai for this "failure" should actually be mad at Larry Bird. Maybe Masai wasn't offering enough, but what should he offer for an aging PF who could opt out in the summer?
              Just to add to the David West thing. West has a long-term large contract that would have burdensome come off-season time and would have mitigated the Raptor's financial flexibility. Also, West is an aging star and is on the decline, and to me not a good long-term investment. I'm sure Masai saw this and is the reason why he didn't pull the trigger on this West endeavour.
              #JaysWinningLikeItz93'

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              • #22
                It's so funny how people are all over Masai. He got the raptors out of a disasterous situation under the burden of Bargs and Gays contracts and flipped them into a 1st round draft pick that will likely be a lottery pick, an entire bench and 2 playoff appearances in a row. Sure we had 2 first round exits and the team is flawed but, given the state and direction of the team when Colangelo was in charge compared to now, how can you complain?

                Not to mention to job MLSE did in manufacturing one of the most successful marketing campaigns ever with the "We The North" slogan that propelled basketball into the limelight. Which is something everyone here was craving.

                Fuck sakes man. Chill. It's a process. The team is flawed and I'm not a fan of Casey, but I think Masai deserves the benefit of doubt this far in his tenure.
                Sunny ways my friends, sunny ways
                Because its 2015

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                • #23
                  Uncle_Si wrote: View Post
                  It's so funny how people are all over Masai. He got the raptors out of a disasterous situation under the burden of Bargs and Gays contracts and flipped them into a 1st round draft pick that will likely be a lottery pick, an entire bench and 2 playoff appearances in a row. Sure we had 2 first round exits and the team is flawed but, given the state and direction of the team when Colangelo was in charge compared to now, how can you complain?

                  Not to mention to job MLSE did in manufacturing one of the most successful marketing campaigns ever with the "We The North" slogan that propelled basketball into the limelight. Which is something everyone here was craving.

                  Fuck sakes man. Chill. It's a process. The team is flawed and I'm not a fan of Casey, but I think Masai deserves the benefit of doubt this far in his tenure.
                  Both Gay and Bargs would be expiring now. Novak expires next season. Since he did nothing with the payroll flexibility its a wash. His idiot coach turns everyone into 40% fg shooters with high usage killing any trade value. Take away the NY first and neither team would reverse the trades

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                  • #24
                    raptors999 wrote: View Post
                    One of the duties of the GM is to be able to create deals. A GM that says there were no deals means he isn't able to do his job. Morey makes deals even small ones just to gain a reputation for being willing to pull the trigger. MU hasnt been doing anything
                    Do you really think that's Morey's motivations for making deals? Because that's absurd.

                    I sincerely hope that an owner would never judge his GM's performance by the GM reaching an arbitrary transaction quota. "Make 3 deals or you're fired!" Give me a break.

                    If only the Masai had made moves like Morey, holding on to the Raptors expiring contracts (Gay & Barngani) longer and then turning them into valuable assets (not the garbage Masai got like a 1st round pick and valuable bench players). You know, just like Morey did with Jeremy Lin - trading him and his expiring contract along with a 1st round pick & a 2nd round pick to the Lakers for Sergei Lishchuk. Just some great GM-ing there.

                    I guess I'm not smart enough to realize that it's every GM's duty to make a James Harden-like trade and whoever doesn't is a failure.
                    Last edited by Mess; Mon Jun 15, 2015, 01:16 AM.
                    Two beer away from being two beers away.

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                    • #25
                      Mess wrote: View Post
                      Do you really think that's Morey's motivations for making deals? Because that's absurd.

                      I sincerely hope that an owner would never judge his GM's performance by the GM reaching an arbitrary transaction quota. "Make 3 deals or you're fired!" Give me a break.

                      If only the Masai had made moves like Morey, holding on to the Raptors expiring contracts (Gay & Barngani) longer and then turning them into valuable assets (not the garbage Masai got like a 1st round pick and valuable bench players). You know, just like Morey did with Jeremy Lin - trading him and his expiring contract along with a 1st round pick & a 2nd round pick for Sergei Lishchuk. Just some great GM-ing there.
                      It's not a quota but a GM that can't make deals isn't a GM. Saying there are no offers isn't good enough. Also, allowing the media to promote how he screwed NY as a deal maker makes future deals harder. Morley is one extreme but Masai might be the other. If no one want to deal with him he is reduced to trying to be a scout. No other GM gets lauded for getting great deals and that's a problem

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                      • #26
                        Ah I see. From now on he should negotiate less profitable deals for the Raptors so they have more potential trade partners in the future. And also muzzle the media. Or at least spin the media's view into thinking that he's really not that good at his job. Gotcha.

                        I mean, I do get that he might be a little too measured and risk-averse for some people's liking. I just think people underestimate how risky it is to tear it all down by swinging for the fences and then trying to rebuild from there. Just getting back to 48-49 wins would be far from a guarantee.
                        Two beer away from being two beers away.

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                        • #27
                          Mess wrote: View Post
                          Ah I see. From now on he should negotiate less profitable deals for the Raptors so they have more potential trade partners in the future. And also muzzle the media. Or at least spin the media's view into thinking that he's really not that good at his job. Gotcha.

                          I mean, I do get that he might be a little too measured and risk-averse for some people's liking. I just think people underestimate how risky it is to tear it all down by swinging for the fences and then trying to rebuild from there. Just getting back to 48-49 wins would be far from a guarantee.
                          Not less profitable, but Novak + 2nd to the Jazz was probably his best deal. Small deals that tweak is a better measure of a GM then either the Bargs or Gay trade. Hawks looking like they lost the Lou William trade helps them on a second deal while Toronto "winning" that trade might have killed future deals. MU hasn't really done anything. Bucks and Dudley was better than the Lou deal but nobody says the Clippers were taken by the Bucks GM

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                          • #28
                            I know why Masai cant make deals, Everyone says there busy

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                            • #29
                              raptors999 wrote: View Post
                              Not less profitable, but Novak + 2nd to the Jazz was probably his best deal. Small deals that tweak is a better measure of a GM then either the Bargs or Gay trade. Hawks looking like they lost the Lou William trade helps them on a second deal while Toronto "winning" that trade might have killed future deals. MU hasn't really done anything. Bucks and Dudley was better than the Lou deal but nobody says the Clippers were taken by the Bucks GM
                              True, everyone says it was a terrible move by the Clippers. Just like what they say about NY and Bargnani.

                              Anyway, I think it's obvious we both just have different standards of judging trades. It sounds like you'd prefer if Masai had tweaked a roster that had won 23 and 34 games. And also, one of us prefers to base his performance on theoretical moves instead of a trade that got them the 6th man of the year who won them a lot of games.

                              I admit there were arguably better and more impactful moves made but that doesn't mean Masai "hasn't really done anything."
                              Two beer away from being two beers away.

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                              • #30
                                raptors999 wrote: View Post
                                Not less profitable, but Novak + 2nd to the Jazz was probably his best deal. Small deals that tweak is a better measure of a GM then either the Bargs or Gay trade. Hawks looking like they lost the Lou William trade helps them on a second deal while Toronto "winning" that trade might have killed future deals. MU hasn't really done anything. Bucks and Dudley was better than the Lou deal but nobody says the Clippers were taken by the Bucks GM
                                It takes time to understand what you've got out the trade and how the newly acquired player fits into your squad. Developing chemistry with the other players on the squad and to get a real basketball connection takes a while. There is a observation and reflection period has to be done. Not all players click immediately.

                                Look at the GSW, they've struck gold with how their team has developed such great chemistry overtime. Imagine if they traded Klay Thompson last year to get K. Love? Or if they traded Steph Curry to the Celtics for Rajon Rondo in 2012? Would they have been as good as they are now or better? Most unlikely.

                                This is Masai's time to look upon the roster and see what he needs to improve and get rid of on our team. The only knock against him is bringing back the same coach for next year so far. Otherwise, the moves he's made have been beneficial ones for the Raptors long term goals and perhaps overall perception of the team.
                                #JaysWinningLikeItz93'

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