Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Everything Norman Powell

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • DanH wrote: View Post
    I was as worried as anyone about the all bench unit going into last year, but you'll have to point me to the times the bench would struggle. They were one of the most dominant high minute lineups in the league last year. On balance, it's hard to imagine a more successful unit for the minutes they played.
    They struggled offensively at times a lot, even sometimes where they would "outplay" the other team's bench but would barely score. They had a stretch, I think it was in January, where they struggled in general.

    Their strength was D. That would feed their O when they were at their best. Offensively things would frequently get ugly whenever things had to slow down in the halfcourt.
    Last edited by white men can't jump; Tue Jul 31st, 2018, 04:42 PM.

    Comment


    • DanH wrote: View Post
      I was as worried as anyone about the all bench unit going into last year, but you'll have to point me to the times the bench would struggle. They were one of the most dominant high minute lineups in the league last year. On balance, it's hard to imagine a more successful unit for the minutes they played.

      Comment


      • golden wrote: View Post
        Yeah, they were unreliable during the playoffs if you asked me. I mean, combine that with VanVleet's injury who clearly played at 70% at best, the bench was pretty inconsistent. Poeltl struggled, Siakam was ok, Wright was... alright. Don't even get me started on Miles, lol.
        Twitter: @ReubenJRD NBA, Raptors writer for Daily Hive Vancouver, Toronto.

        Comment


        • golden wrote: View Post
          Well, yeah, FVV got hurt. Though even then it was mostly the DeMar bench unit that fell through the floor, not the all bench unit.
          twitter.com/dhackett1565

          Comment


          • white men can't jump wrote: View Post
            They struggled offensively at times a lot, even sometimes where they would "outplay" the other team's bench but would barely score. They had a stretch, I think it was in January, where they struggled in general.

            Their strength was D. That would feed their O when they were at their best. Offensively things would frequently get ugly whenever things had to slow down in the halfcourt.
            Yes, things got ugly because it was entirely reliant on Miles scoring. And it's a credit to Miles that on the whole, the bench turned in one of the best efficiency differentials in the league last year.
            twitter.com/dhackett1565

            Comment


            • DanH wrote: View Post
              Yes, things got ugly because it was entirely reliant on Miles scoring. And it's a credit to Miles that on the whole, the bench turned in one of the best efficiency differentials in the league last year.
              See, I would say it's more a credit to their D, and to the fact that FVV would lead the unit and not panic a lot when they had some bad offensive stretches (ie not letting himself force the issue and give away turnovers).

              If Nurse will be less hardheaded about rotations, having 1st line players sprinkle in should only help. That way we don't need to force plays for a 1-dimensional shooter, and instead can have more fluid sets. And that way we can play Miles less, and use him more in lineups where he's more likely to get better looks.

              Comment


              • WJF wrote: View Post
                DeMar played 35 minutes a game, Danny Green will play 25 minutes per game, right off the bat there is minutes at the 2 spot to be had. Look for OG to see some time at the 4 this year in small ball lieups and Norm could see regular burn. We don't have great 4/5 depth and will go small to compensate.
                Uhh no, Kawhi is going to take DeMar's minutes, whether that's at the 2 or 3 is irrelevant. The reality is that 25mpg need to be opened up for Danny Green on the wings. That means someone from the rotation last year is taking a hit unless a few guys are going to get bumped up (Ibaka playing like 20mpg at center, Siakam taking Ibaka's minutes at the 4 and OG playing a lot more 4 than he did last year).

                Comment


                • white men can't jump wrote: View Post
                  See, I would say it's more a credit to their D, and to the fact that FVV would lead the unit and not panic a lot when they had some bad offensive stretches (ie not letting himself force the issue and give away turnovers).

                  If Nurse will be less hardheaded about rotations, having 1st line players sprinkle in should only help. That way we don't need to force plays for a 1-dimensional shooter, and instead can have more fluid sets. And that way we can play Miles less, and use him more in lineups where he's more likely to get better looks.
                  I guess you missed this part: "Miles shot 36%. Only 30% of his threes came when wide open."

                  So out of the five 3pt shooters, only Fred shot significantly better than MIles, Serge and Lowry were 37% and Delon shot the same. And Fred, Delon and Serge got open 3 pt looks more than 60% of the time...twice as often as Miles. If Miles was inconsistent, maybe it was because Casey could not come up with any schemes to free him up. Even Lowry, who everybody knew was the most important Raptor on the floor had 35% of his threes with open looks. Saying Miles is inconsistent in his shooting with the kind of coverage he had to deal with is like saying OG can't jump when his foot is nailed to the floor.

                  Comment


                  • white men can't jump wrote: View Post
                    See, I would say it's more a credit to their D, and to the fact that FVV would lead the unit and not panic a lot when they had some bad offensive stretches (ie not letting himself force the issue and give away turnovers).

                    If Nurse will be less hardheaded about rotations, having 1st line players sprinkle in should only help. That way we don't need to force plays for a 1-dimensional shooter, and instead can have more fluid sets. And that way we can play Miles less, and use him more in lineups where he's more likely to get better looks.
                    Yes, it’s a credit to those things too.

                    Casey used those all bench lineups to get significant rest for his stars. Yes, there are other ways to do that, ways I advocated for, but you can hardly look at the success of those lineups and not say that Miles was absolutely key to that. Yes, FVV was also key. Yes, the defence was key. But so was Miles’ ability to hit at roughly a PPP on contested threes. Good defence and low turnovers doesn’t buy you jack squat if you never score.

                    Certainly, with Poeltl gone, and Ibaka likely playing C in those units, the lineups will have more options offensively. But to expect actual better results than last year is probably hoping for a bit too much - the actual results from last year (+17 net rating on the strength of an offence even better than the defence - 116 ORTG, 99 DRTG, 10 points above average offence and 7 points above average defence) will be incredibly hard to top. Even more impressive considering they played against bench units, who tend to have lower ORTGs, making that DRTG less impressive by a point.
                    twitter.com/dhackett1565

                    Comment


                    • Puffer wrote: View Post
                      I guess you missed this part: "Miles shot 36%. Only 30% of his threes came when wide open."

                      So out of the five 3pt shooters, only Fred shot significantly better than MIles, Serge and Lowry were 37% and Delon shot the same. And Fred, Delon and Serge got open 3 pt looks more than 60% of the time...twice as often as Miles. If Miles was inconsistent, maybe it was because Casey could not come up with any schemes to free him up. Even Lowry, who everybody knew was the most important Raptor on the floor had 35% of his threes with open looks. Saying Miles is inconsistent in his shooting with the kind of coverage he had to deal with is like saying OG can't jump when his foot is nailed to the floor.
                      Umm no...they ran their whole halfcourt offence with the bench unit around running plays to free up Miles. But on those units it was too simple for the D to focus on that.

                      Regardless it was his career %. Again, he has shot over 40% exactly once in his whole career. Raptors fans need to stop pretending/convincing themselves that Miles is an elite shooter. He's a tier below that.

                      Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk

                      Comment


                      • white men can't jump wrote: View Post
                        ...Raptors fans need to stop pretending/convincing themselves that Miles is an elite shooter. He's a tier below that.

                        Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
                        Well it will be interesting to see what happens this year as teams have to focus more on Fred and with OG and Ibaka, an improved Siakim and Delon or maybe Green getting more time off the bench. Miles won't be their only focus if the "whole half court offence" isn't the bench unit running around to free Miles up. CJ might get 40% of his threes as open looks. That could improve his inconsistency.

                        Comment


                        • CJ Miles took the 7th most tightly contested threes in the league at 1.8 per game. This is ignoring that he played so few minutes, pure per-game average. He shot 33% on them. The other shooters who took that many?

                          Harden 35%
                          Durant 38%
                          Ellington 37%
                          Lillard 34%
                          Irving 37%
                          G. Green 29%
                          Miles 33%
                          Curry 31%

                          CJ Miles took the 124th most wide open threes in the league at 1.9 per game. He shot 42% on them. The above shooters on wide open threes:

                          Harden 41%
                          Durant 57% (holy crap)
                          Ellington 44%
                          Lillard 40%
                          Irving 39%
                          G. Green 45%
                          Miles 42%
                          Curry 47%

                          So, he posted pretty typical conversion rates compared to the league's elite three point shooters. Now, Durant and Curry he is not, but in terms of elite high volume gunners across the league, he is right at home with those guys that tend to get covered very tightly by opposing defences.
                          twitter.com/dhackett1565

                          Comment


                          • DanH wrote: View Post
                            CJ Miles took the 7th most tightly contested threes in the league at 1.8 per game. This is ignoring that he played so few minutes, pure per-game average. He shot 33% on them. The other shooters who took that many?

                            Harden 35%
                            Durant 38%
                            Ellington 37%
                            Lillard 34%
                            Irving 37%
                            G. Green 29%
                            Miles 33%
                            Curry 31%

                            CJ Miles took the 124th most wide open threes in the league at 1.9 per game. He shot 42% on them. The above shooters on wide open threes:

                            Harden 41%
                            Durant 57% (holy crap)
                            Ellington 44%
                            Lillard 40%
                            Irving 39%
                            G. Green 45%
                            Miles 42%
                            Curry 47%

                            So, he posted pretty typical conversion rates compared to the league's elite three point shooters. Now, Durant and Curry he is not, but in terms of elite high volume gunners across the league, he is right at home with those guys that tend to get covered very tightly by opposing defences.
                            This is an interesting post because it speaks to the amount of energy and defensive manpower other teams have to put on these guys, because the difference between their contested and non-contested rates is so significant.

                            What gets lost sometimes in the numbers, is the actual positive impact the extra space/freedom has on the rest of the team because of that. For example, if Delon (a slow release shooter from deep) is sharing the court with Miles, he will get a lot more time and less contesting on his looks (he doesn't gather nearly as much "gravity" on the perimeter as Miles does). For a slow release shooter like him, the presence of Miles on the court might often be the difference between him being able to get up shot or not. And yet ironically, his 3P% last year was higher than Miles' himself (36.6%).

                            It kinda reminds me of rebounding stats. Like, some guys don't have high individual rebound numbers, but for some reason when they're on the court, the team as whole grabs a lot more boards. The reason: proper boxing-out, making it easier for other people to clean up the glass.
                            2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

                            Comment


                            • DanH wrote: View Post
                              CJ Miles took the 7th most tightly contested threes in the league at 1.8 per game. This is ignoring that he played so few minutes, pure per-game average. He shot 33% on them. The other shooters who took that many?

                              Harden 35%
                              Durant 38%
                              Ellington 37%
                              Lillard 34%
                              Irving 37%
                              G. Green 29%
                              Miles 33%
                              Curry 31%

                              CJ Miles took the 124th most wide open threes in the league at 1.9 per game. He shot 42% on them. The above shooters on wide open threes:

                              Harden 41%
                              Durant 57% (holy crap)
                              Ellington 44%
                              Lillard 40%
                              Irving 39%
                              G. Green 45%
                              Miles 42%
                              Curry 47%

                              So, he posted pretty typical conversion rates compared to the league's elite three point shooters. Now, Durant and Curry he is not, but in terms of elite high volume gunners across the league, he is right at home with those guys that tend to get covered very tightly by opposing defences.
                              Durant's drop off from uncontested to contested is pretty interesting, considering his release point must be 9 feet in the air or whatever. Kyrie's one of the smallest guys on the list and his numbers hardly change. Wonder if the two categories can be broken down further to catch and shoot 3's vs off the dribble 3's?
                              "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

                              Comment


                              • S.R. wrote: View Post
                                Durant's drop off from uncontested to contested is pretty interesting, considering his release point must be 9 feet in the air or whatever. Kyrie's one of the smallest guys on the list and his numbers hardly change. Wonder if the two categories can be broken down further to catch and shoot 3's vs off the dribble 3's?
                                I can do catch and shoot versus off the dribble, and contested versus uncontested, but the publicly available data doesn't allow for filtering by both criteria at once, sadly.
                                twitter.com/dhackett1565

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X