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  • KeonClark wrote: View Post
    I think Ibaka definitely gets a long starting look. Jv Ibaka Kyle and Kawhi are shoe ins for October imo. Which leads me to believe it could be a Wright or a green in the 2 hole, and Ibaka gets the first hook and nurse starts getting flexible.

    Reason being, nurse will learn just the same way Casey did how much of a coaches job is just playing the politics of these guys egos, and theres a ton of politics in starting In the nba.
    I have no issue with starting the 4 you mention, but starting Green or (much more so) Wright over OG would be a mistake, IMO. For completely different reasons. Green is fine, but OG deserves to start and is a tantalizing fit beside Kawhi, and in a loaded wing rotation, it seems easier to slide Green into transitional lineups than OG and keep the minutes balanced, with OG likely taking some PF minutes. While Wright's playmaking off the bench is exceedingly important for that unit, and moving him into the starting lineup where he'll be off the ball more isn't exactly playing to his strengths.
    twitter.com/dhackett1565

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    • DanH wrote: View Post
      Yeah, that's my favourite look, but I could see the other popular idea that's been floating around of starting OG at the 4, Green at the 2, being what we start with as well.
      Hmm, that would give us really good shooting to get out in front with. Starting Green also normalizes the bench a little (ie doesn't have Green sitting in Delon's spot). Also, it puts Ibaka into the backup C role which sounds about right.

      FVV/Delon/Miles*/Siakam/Ibaka is a nice look off the bench for sure. Everything in its right place.

      *Probably odd man out if/when Kawhi and/or OG see increased minutes.

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      • SkywalkerAC wrote: View Post
        Do you expect OG to be in the starting lineup? Or are you saying there's a queue?
        Everything that Dan said. OG's skills are perfectly suited to the starting lineup. Doesn't need the ball, can't really create yet, but super lengthy, always tenacious and in the right position on D, and draining 3's to give us spacing. Just generally fitting in and making the right play. Also, as it stands now, he's the future of our squad and should be well-utilized. I guess I just liked what I saw with him with the starters so much last year. I have a really heard time imagining going away from that. Ya never know though.

        Green is an interesting piece as we don't know if he'll remain on the downslope or whether he'll return to some semblance of his former self, now that he's had some time off to heal and got an Alex Mckechnie instead of that unspeakably evil Spurs' medical staff. So I can see an outlying situation maybe where Green becomes so valuable that he moves OG from the starting unit.

        I sure share your hopes for Norm though. Would love nothing more than for him to get back to where he was when his play had earned the gamble of his big ol contract. He's still got a lot of time to grow yet. Not giving up.

        In any case, the competition between Norm, Danny Green and CJ Miles for minutes is gonna be pretty nutso.

        My starting line-up remains KL, KL, OG, SI, JV for now though. With the real possibility of subbing Serge out of there if he stinks it up.

        Incidentally, with the ridiculous, double-KL backcourt, maybe they should be known as THE KILLERS?

        (...not to endorse violence or anything)

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        • SkywalkerAC wrote: View Post
          Hmm, that would give us really good shooting to get out in front with. Starting Green also normalizes the bench a little (ie doesn't have Green sitting in Delon's spot). Also, it puts Ibaka into the backup C role which sounds about right.

          FVV/Delon/Miles*/Siakam/Ibaka is a nice look off the bench for sure. Everything in its right place.

          *Probably odd man out if/when Kawhi and/or OG see increased minutes.
          I think whether you start Green or OG at the "2," you'll be seeing much more than the two primary lineups. There is almost certainly an 11 to 12 man rotation here. That could mean a 10 man rotation with various guys getting nights off, but I'd bet on a lot of games seeing all 12 guys used, or at least 11 (I'm not sure how Norm fits in unless guys get a night off). I don't know how much they will really want to use Ibaka against opposing centres, so we might see a fairly steady (if small) diet of Monroe with the bench. Similarly, with OG, Kawhi, Green, Delon and Miles on the wing, they probably have one of those guys come off the bench but also not play with the primary bench unit - my candidate is Green, who could come in for Ibaka (who would in my scenario start, but also play some backup C) midway through the 1st and 3rd and play minutes with the starters and also minutes with an end-of-Q bench unit (while Miles gets those typical early 2nd/4th bench minutes).
          twitter.com/dhackett1565

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          • GOLDBLUM wrote: View Post
            Everything that Dan said. OG's skills are perfectly suited to the starting lineup. Doesn't need the ball, can't really create yet, but super lengthy, always tenacious and in the right position on D, and draining 3's to give us spacing. Just generally fitting in and making the right play. Also, as it stands now, he's the future of our squad and should be well-utilized. I guess I just liked what I saw with him with the starters so much last year. I have a really heard time imagining going away from that. Ya never know though.

            Green is an interesting piece as we don't know if he'll remain on the downslope or whether he'll return to some semblance of his former self, now that he's had some time off to heal and got an Alex Mckechnie instead of that unspeakably evil Spurs' medical staff. So I can see an outlying situation maybe where Green becomes so valuable that he moves OG from the starting unit.

            I sure share your hopes for Norm though. Would love nothing more than for him to get back to where he was when his play had earned the gamble of his big ol contract. He's still got a lot of time to grow yet. Not giving up.

            In any case, the competition between Norm, Danny Green and CJ Miles for minutes is gonna be pretty nutso.

            My starting line-up remains KL, KL, OG, SI, JV for now though. With the real possibility of subbing Serge out of there if he stinks it up.

            Incidentally, with the ridiculous, double-KL backcourt, maybe they should be known as THE KILLERS?

            (...not to endorse violence or anything)
            I think it will be the same starting line-up as last year with Leonard replacing DeRozan at SG. I did think when the trade was first made that DG may start at SG with Leonard at SF, but the more I think about it I don't see Nurse messing with a really good offence last season that will be more efficient with Leonard in place of DD and is about to get a whole lot better defensively.

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            • At $23M/yr, Serge is going to be given every possible opportunity to keep his spot in the starting lineup. He's going to have to fall off a cliff to become Serge Ibackup.

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              • golden wrote: View Post
                At $23M/yr, Serge is going to be given every possible opportunity to keep his spot in the starting lineup. He's going to have to fall off a cliff to become Serge Ibackup.
                The last thing he has going for him is hes still probably a much better shooter than Ibaka. The day that pendulum swings it's over for serge
                It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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                • golden wrote: View Post
                  At $23M/yr, Serge is going to be given every possible opportunity to keep his spot in the starting lineup. He's going to have to fall off a cliff to become Serge Ibackup.
                  Haha.. That's a new one. Nice

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                  • golden wrote: View Post
                    At $23M/yr, Serge is going to be given every possible opportunity to keep his spot in the starting lineup. He's going to have to fall off a cliff to become Serge Ibackup.
                    This is a big part of why I've been pitching a quasi-backup usage for him, which caters to a) his likely desire to start, b) his seeming desire to play some minutes at C, c) the team's need for his C minutes to not come against starting quality C's, and d) the team's need to free up minutes at PF to absorb some of OG's minutes to free up time on the wing for their abundance of swingmen.
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                    • Comment


                      • The reason I think Danny might start at the 2 to begin the season is because of his familiarity with Kawhi. You build chemistry with teammates after playing with them for a long time, and I think Nurse may want to use that until Danny/Kawhi get more in sync with their new teammates.
                        It's the Spicy Show! Time to cook.

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                        • DanH wrote: View Post
                          Yeah, that's my favourite look, but I could see the other popular idea that's been floating around of starting OG at the 4, Green at the 2, being what we start with as well.
                          To me, this is the ideal situation.

                          Lowry-Green-Kawhi-OG-JV offers a lot of versatility defensively, and with Nurse talking about creating more turnovers for open-court opportunities, to start, I think this is the lineup that fits that the best.

                          My assumption is, Ibaka takes Poeltl's role, and comes off the bench with VanVleet-Wright-Miles/Powell-Siakam, adding another dynamic as a floor spreader, on top of his capable defensive abilities (if they're still up to par).

                          To me, it makes sense. OG-Green will be used more as floor spreaders, which favours JV who will have more space to operate inside -- who Nurse also said will be a focus this season. You've got four perimeter threads and an efficient low-post scorer -- analytically, Ibaka loves the mid-ranged jumper, and can't keep up with today's fours. This is my favourite look by far.
                          Twitter: @ReubenJRD NBA, Raptors writer for Daily Hive Vancouver, Toronto.

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                          • I feel like the starting line up will change much more than in year's past.(especially if someone is hurt, I don't think Nurse will pull the 3rd stringer off the bench into the starting lineup) I think it will depend on the team. If we are playing the Pistons, or Boston when Baynes starts, I think serge will start. When we are playing a smaller team I think he comes in as backup C.

                            I personally can't wait to see a Point, 3 wings and a big lineup of KL, Kawhi, OG, Siam and JV. I just feel like that line up by year end might see more time than not.

                            Is it the season yet? It feels like this summer is just dragging on. (I guess that's what happens when you have arguably the best lineup in team history, and you haven't seen them together yet)

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                            • ReubenJRD wrote: View Post
                              To me, this is the ideal situation.

                              Lowry-Green-Kawhi-OG-JV offers a lot of versatility defensively, and with Nurse talking about creating more turnovers for open-court opportunities, to start, I think this is the lineup that fits that the best.

                              My assumption is, Ibaka takes Poeltl's role, and comes off the bench with VanVleet-Wright-Miles/Powell-Siakam, adding another dynamic as a floor spreader, on top of his capable defensive abilities (if they're still up to par).

                              To me, it makes sense. OG-Green will be used more as floor spreaders, which favours JV who will have more space to operate inside -- who Nurse also said will be a focus this season. You've got four perimeter threads and an efficient low-post scorer -- analytically, Ibaka loves the mid-ranged jumper, and can't keep up with today's fours. This is my favourite look by far.
                              I like it (and I like it for a decent minutes lineup regardless) as a starting lineup except for two things.

                              One, Serge Ibaka. If he's playing exclusively as a bench C, he's either getting 20 MPG at most or JV is playing way too little (even before any Siakam at C craziness or Monroe minutes enter the equation). One seems unlikely to sit well with him, the other seems a real bad idea.

                              Two, OG Anunoby. He's coming off his rookie year, and as strong as he is, I'd like to shield him from starting PFs a good bit if possible. So I'd still play him in those transitional lineups as a 4, but I'd like to see a good number of his minutes come on the wing, where he's leveraging his quickness to keep up with a wing rather than his strength to keep up with a big. Just seems like less wear and tear over the course of the season. Same reason why I want to almost exclusively use Kawhi as a wing, not a forward, because we have options there that prevent him from having to take on that physical load over a long season.
                              twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                              • ReubenJRD wrote: View Post
                                To me, this is the ideal situation.

                                Lowry-Green-Kawhi-OG-JV offers a lot of versatility defensively, and with Nurse talking about creating more turnovers for open-court opportunities, to start, I think this is the lineup that fits that the best.

                                My assumption is, Ibaka takes Poeltl's role, and comes off the bench with VanVleet-Wright-Miles/Powell-Siakam, adding another dynamic as a floor spreader, on top of his capable defensive abilities (if they're still up to par).

                                To me, it makes sense. OG-Green will be used more as floor spreaders, which favours JV who will have more space to operate inside -- who Nurse also said will be a focus this season. You've got four perimeter threads and an efficient low-post scorer -- analytically, Ibaka loves the mid-ranged jumper, and can't keep up with today's fours. This is my favourite look by far.
                                You can put me down on record as saying starting OG at PF is an awful idea. Could not think of a worse way to ruin his career than by routinely making him defend bigger, stronger, starting calibre players. I know the position is moving towards longer and more perimeter oriented guys, but you still have the likes of Griffin, Morris, Horford, Love etc...and that's just in the East. Imo, OG at PF should only be used in specific situations. His strength is in guarding the perimeter, not the post. His health should be of high importance to the Raptors current and future.

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