Is big men dead in the NBA?

[3inthekeon]

Here's the question - where are you getting 60% FG% in the post from? It's not an achievable number.

From here:

I don't get it either. Nobody is running sets for their low post bigs it's not just toronto. A 2 pointer at 60% efficiency is still the most effective play...It's almost like the nba has mandated a guard league cause it's more exciting that's the best I can come up with lol

Someone provide me a list of low post bigs that are still a big part of the offense? Ad and towns don count cause they're mobile.

My thoughts:

Most of the effective post play now is on switches.

The death of traditional post play started with the changes in the illegal defense rule. Much easier to send a double.

The best post-up bigs are often really good passers - they make you pick your poison. Send a double and risk giving up a quick pass for a wide open shot.

[Barolt]

Did KAT not win ROY?

Did DeAndre not make 1st Team All-NBA?

Big men are still alive and well.

[KeonClark]

Did KAT not win ROY?

Did DeAndre not make 1st Team All-NBA?

Big men are still alive and well.

To be fair, one big man has to be named first team all nba. He certainly wasn't one of the nba 5 best players

[TrueTorontoFan]

But how do you beat the Cavs?

Cavs are also weak at the center spot. Bizmack is great but we really need size and the ability to punish them down low. You also have big guys that you run pick and roll with and bang them up and wear them down athletically. Realistically who do they have that can stop a healthy JV? 2pat is what we need defensively at the 4. Kyrie still can't play defence so if Lowry can play him to a stand still and show up... then yeah. When the raptors showed up we beat them.

[TrueTorontoFan]

There has been a shortage of truly skilled back to the basket big men coming out of the draft in recent years...
BUT !!
Now.. there is
Karl Anthony Towns. I am so glad he is in the west.
Boogie Cousins who has had his career wasted in the gong show that is Excremento is a supremely talented Big Man.
The promise of Joel Embiid and his side kick Jahil Okafor in Philly who are in the East and will make their marks.
Marc Gasol in Memphis.
Hassan Whiteside for his defense in Miami.

GSW signing KD has the NBA cognoscenti in full regale.. but ....KD is a tall guy on a smallish frame. Don't be completely surprised if GSW gets out physicalled next year when it matters yet again.

right ...again a jumpshooting team is just that. They will have a cold streak. When that comes... can you outrebound them and play good enough D...

[Sinbad]

From here:



My thoughts:

Most of the effective post play now is on switches.

The death of traditional post play started with the changes in the illegal defense rule. Much easier to send a double.

The best post-up bigs are often really good passers - they make you pick your poison. Send a double and risk giving up a quick pass for a wide open shot.

The handcheck rule-change didn't help them either. It handed a huge advantage to perimeter players, and offenses gradually became more pick and roll/high-screen oriented to exploit that.

[KeonClark]

Cavs are also weak at the center spot. Bizmack is great but we really need size and the ability to punish them down low. You also have big guys that you run pick and roll with and bang them up and wear them down athletically. Realistically who do they have that can stop a healthy JV? 2pat is what we need defensively at the 4. Kyrie still can't play defence so if Lowry can play him to a stand still and show up... then yeah. When the raptors showed up we beat them.

Sure we keep saying that "we need jv to punish teams that play small" but casey will turn around and say jv can't defend switches.

[grindhouse]

Based on the NBA's synergy stats, there are a lot of players who still carry 25%+ post usage (more than a quarter of their own offensive plays) and finish more than 4 plays a game from the post.

Brook Lopez, Aldridge, Monroe, Drummond, Randolph, Dirk, Marc Gasol, Vucevic, Okafor, Dwight...

JV is close, as he finishes 3.3 post-ups per game, 27% of his finishes.

Most guys above are between 4-6 post-ups per game. Gasol is a standout at 7.2.

3 post up per game is terrible when a team has what 50-60-70 possessions a game. The best shoots shot what around 35% from 3 while most bigs shot 50% plus. I really don't understand the math analytics of this whole thing


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[TrueTorontoFan]

Sure we keep saying that "we need jv to punish teams that play small" but casey will turn around and say jv can't defend switches.

The defence should really funnel the man towards help D... thats why JV did better last year. I think if we continue that trend. ... JV obviously needs the ball more. I don't know if its on Casey or on Kyle and Demar. Either way If you take 3 shots from both Kyle and Demar... or 5 shots from demar and give it to Carroll and JV you will yield very positive results.

[3inthekeon]

JV had a 47.7% eFG% on post-ups. That was 60th percentile.

JV had a 60% eFG% as the roll man in PnR's. That was 90th percentile, which is elite. But only 101 times in 60 games.

Bargnani last year was the roll man 108 times in 45 games despite a pretty shitty 45.6 eFG%.

Maybe instead of being so up in arms about his lack of post-ups, maybe we should be wondering why he isn't utilized in the PnR more often?

Just wondering.

[DanH]

JV had a 47.7% eFG% on post-ups. That was 60th percentile.

JV had a 60% eFG% as the roll man in PnR's. That was 90th percentile, which is elite. But only 101 times in 60 games.

Bargnani last year was the roll man 108 times in 45 games despite a pretty shitty 45.6 eFG%.

Maybe instead of being so up in arms about his lack of post-ups, maybe we should be wondering why he isn't utilized in the PnR more often?

Just wondering.

We've been up in arms about that for 4 years. The post up thing is newer.

[3inthekeon]

We've been up in arms about that for 4 years. The post up thing is newer.

Well, I'm officially starting year 5 of lack of roll man touch complaints.

[grindhouse]

Is big men dead in the NBA?

JV had a 47.7% eFG% on post-ups. That was 60th percentile.

JV had a 60% eFG% as the roll man in PnR's. That was 90th percentile, which is elite. But only 101 times in 60 games.

Bargnani last year was the roll man 108 times in 45 games despite a pretty shitty 45.6 eFG%.

Maybe instead of being so up in arms about his lack of post-ups, maybe we should be wondering why he isn't utilized in the PnR more often?

Just wondering.

U know why it's so hard to run pick and rolls with JV derozan can't shot 3's.
And he needs the ball in his hand

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[3inthekeon]

3 post up per game is terrible when a team has what 50-60-70 possessions a game. The best shoots shot what around 35% from 3 while most bigs shot 50% plus. I really don't understand the math analytics of this whole thing


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Did you (or anyone) catch Steve Kerr's interview during the game today? Didn't catch much of it, but he did mention that teams nowadays can overload the strong side, which they couldn't do before, in regards to the decline of the post game.

[grindhouse]

Did you (or anyone) catch Steve Kerr's interview during the game today? Didn't catch much of it, but he did mention that teams nowadays can overload the strong side, which they couldn't do before, in regards to the decline of the post game.

Maybe they need to remove zone defence again


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