Everything VanVleet

[MixxAOR]

Let's see what is Plan B

[BrydenB]

There's more opportunity cost involved than you're making it out to seem. Most trades at the deadline either would have had us taking on salary for the upcoming season or had miniscule sweetener. Him simply walking gives us a lot of flexility under the tax that we can e.g. use on a free agent with the full MLE. Retaining the asset works too, but the idea that you have to trade every asset before you lose them is a pretty good example of loss aversion bias.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loss_aversion

I know what loss aversion is, I work in the financial markets.

You don’t have to trade every asset when they are coming up. Taking stock of the best case scenario for this team with Fred staying, along with the risk of him leaving, the prudent move would have been to move him imo.

Also, I’ve said this on the forum before: the real opportunity cost was not trying to get further into the lottery and losing next year’s pick (most likely) too.

[SkywalkerAC]

I don’t want Fred on this team, but losing him for nothing like Stein is reporting is about to happen… wow. You have to at least retain the asset for trades. This is a colossal organizational failure and a total misread of the trade deadline

There's more opportunity cost involved than you're making it out to seem. Most trades at the deadline either would have had us taking on salary for the upcoming season or had miniscule sweetener. Him simply walking gives us a lot of flexility under the tax that we can e.g. use on a free agent with the full MLE. Retaining the asset works too, but the idea that you have to trade every asset before you lose them is a pretty good example of loss aversion bias.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loss_aversion

[SkywalkerAC]

So what's a realistic offer the Raps can make then? $30M x 4yrs? Can they go over $30M per without being in the luxury tax?

I think that's realistic. I believe we have the room to do Jak at 20 and Fred at 30, with a bit of leeway under the tax from what I remember.

[Dr Hannibal Lecter]

I don’t want Fred on this team, but losing him for nothing like Stein is reporting is about to happen… wow. You have to at least retain the asset for trades. This is a colossal organizational failure and a total misread of the trade deadline

Hold on sec, what did stein say, common now, don't b doing this 2 me, this is like winning a championship, when it's official and if when he signs on the dotted line with another team than I can celebrate.
As for compensation, they messed that up at the deadline..but now I could care less, hell I would give up compensation 2 get this guy off this roster.

[LJ2]

I don't think so if the rumors of the offers being like Brandon Boston and a 2nd round pick for Fred.

You could retain him, but $40M per year is a lot for a team that will be basically be at the luxury tax if they re-sign Fred at $40M and Poeltl. If it was $30M, might be different.

So what's a realistic offer the Raps can make then? $30M x 4yrs? Can they go over $30M per without being in the luxury tax?

[A.I]

I don’t want Fred on this team, but losing him for nothing like Stein is reporting is about to happen… wow. You have to at least retain the asset for trades. This is a colossal organizational failure and a total misread of the trade deadline

I don't think so if the rumors of the offers being like Brandon Boston and a 2nd round pick for Fred.

You could retain him, but $40M per year is a lot for a team that will be basically be at the luxury tax if they re-sign Fred at $40M and Poeltl. If it was $30M, might be different.

[BrydenB]

I don’t want Fred on this team, but losing him for nothing like Stein is reporting is about to happen… wow. You have to at least retain the asset for trades. This is a colossal organizational failure and a total misread of the trade deadline

[Kagemusha]

But...

Van Vleet is comparable to American taxation.
He would work ok with the elite rich teams,
not in middling ones like the Raps.

[DanH]

Let's not drag the off-topic stuff in here, please.

[Quirk]

I don't think it's quite that cut and dried.

I have 2 Canadian friends currently living in Nashville and LA respectively and family in FL, NY, AZ and OR. They pay soooo much less in income tax that they can afford very comprehensive medical insurance and still come out ahead. That's before all they save in virtually everything they buy (gas, booze, food, electronics, cars etc) and the ability to semi write off their mortgage payments (at the expense of no primary residence appreciation shelter which our lovely government is looking at taxing!) That's all before considering the stronger US dollar which makes all imports cheaper and travelling outside of NA less expensive.

Don't kid yourself, we pay and pay handsomely for health insurance, it's just buried in tax up front. And although it's great to have a baby delivered free or see a primary care provider for "free", many many specialists for cancer care, knee replacement etc have multi months or year waiting lists while they wait in pain and for you to die before having to provide the free coverage.

OHIP is bleeding from its eyeballs, there's a reason why things like eye glasses, massage therapists and and physio used to be covered and they take things off the list regularly. It's going to get much worse with the aging population and taxes must continually rise and service drop to support it; if anything, we've proven that universal coverage does not work.

Not so cut and dried.

A few things.

- You have no idea what you are talking about and are just repeating crap you don't understand.
- Net savings rate of USAmericans is just over half of that of Canadians, and less than a third of French or Germans, so no they don't have more money left over.
- Health care in the US costs four times as much as in Canada (or other single payer systems) and produced poorer results.
- This whole thread is off topic, so rather than waste everyone's time being a reply guy, just get back to Fred VanVleet please

[DanH]

So you don't want Fred? Cool, me neither.

Fred is NOT A PG.

Like holy crap guys, he's just not.

He's a combo guard who leans heavily towards SG.

Just because he's short does not make him a PG.

Do you have, like, a measure by which he is not a PG? How do you draw that line? Like, was Lowry a point guard?

Like, early in his career I was very much in the Fred-is-a-SG camp, but he's made huge strides in playmaking since then. Was obviously pretty apparent late in the season when he had Jak to run PnR with, but even before then, it seems like you are holding him to elite PG requirements to be able to claim he is not a PG at all, and no one is claiming he is an elite PG.

[G____Deane]

The bold is one of the best parts of Canada. USA is only good for the insanely rich. They get taxed at a much lower rate. I pay a higher % of my income than Elon Musk or Jeff Bezos. My wife and I make 6 figures but having our baby cost us over $30K out of pocket after insurance. We got ZERO paid maternity or paternity days off. We get ZERO to help with child care. If you get sick, enjoy ZERO paid days off and ZERO protection of your job, if they can they will replace you. USA is a freaking disaster for everyone but the mega rich. Please please please do not think it's better over here, it isn't. If something happens to one of us medically we go bankrupt. The by FAR number 1 reason for bankruptcy in the USA is medical debt. Everyone who gets cancer, regardless of income, is bankrupt within 3 years. It's a horrible awful system that isn't humane in the slightest. Thank god I'm a Canadian citizen, if myself or my wife or kids get cancer we're moving to Canada so we don't go broke. USA is not a system to envy. Do you guys get blasted with drug ads when you watch TV? No? Because they're illegal everywhere but the USA. Drug companies spend WAY more on ads than research. Health insurance companies is the biggest scam of all time. How much would you pay to stay alive? Probably anything right? They know that, and act accordingly. USA is great if you're a millionaire, if not, you're much better off in Canada or just about anywhere else.

I don't think it's quite that cut and dried.

I have 2 Canadian friends currently living in Nashville and LA respectively and family in FL, NY, AZ and OR. They pay soooo much less in income tax that they can afford very comprehensive medical insurance and still come out ahead. That's before all they save in virtually everything they buy (gas, booze, food, electronics, cars etc) and the ability to semi write off their mortgage payments (at the expense of no primary residence appreciation shelter which our lovely government is looking at taxing!) That's all before considering the stronger US dollar which makes all imports cheaper and travelling outside of NA less expensive.

Don't kid yourself, we pay and pay handsomely for health insurance, it's just buried in tax up front. And although it's great to have a baby delivered free or see a primary care provider for "free", many many specialists for cancer care, knee replacement etc have multi months or year waiting lists while they wait in pain and for you to die before having to provide the free coverage.

OHIP is bleeding from its eyeballs, there's a reason why things like eye glasses, massage therapists and and physio used to be covered and they take things off the list regularly. It's going to get much worse with the aging population and taxes must continually rise and service drop to support it; if anything, we've proven that universal coverage does not work.

Not so cut and dried.

[Primer]

22 percent compare vs little less than 50 percent..
40 million taxed at 22 percent vs 30 million taxed 50 percent.
Houston clean 31.2 million vs Raptors 15 million or so...
Canada sucks..the more u make the more they tax u..that's why all these athletes hid money into retirement fund when these athletes retire there done at age 35 .Damn..no tax..clean, can't do that anymore.
Either way..let him go 2 Houston Dan..Gully, u have hard on for him, what is about him that appeal 2 u...I don't get love affair, his not a 30 million player, Houston wants give him 40 million, I mean damn, just go 2 Houston, plz go away..all the Raptors will say thank u for not committing 2 guy who is 30 but plays like 40...
U don't need him

The bold is one of the best parts of Canada. USA is only good for the insanely rich. They get taxed at a much lower rate. I pay a higher % of my income than Elon Musk or Jeff Bezos. My wife and I make 6 figures but having our baby cost us over $30K out of pocket after insurance. We got ZERO paid maternity or paternity days off. We get ZERO to help with child care. If you get sick, enjoy ZERO paid days off and ZERO protection of your job, if they can they will replace you. USA is a freaking disaster for everyone but the mega rich. Please please please do not think it's better over here, it isn't. If something happens to one of us medically we go bankrupt. The by FAR number 1 reason for bankruptcy in the USA is medical debt. Everyone who gets cancer, regardless of income, is bankrupt within 3 years. It's a horrible awful system that isn't humane in the slightest. Thank god I'm a Canadian citizen, if myself or my wife or kids get cancer we're moving to Canada so we don't go broke. USA is not a system to envy. Do you guys get blasted with drug ads when you watch TV? No? Because they're illegal everywhere but the USA. Drug companies spend WAY more on ads than research. Health insurance companies is the biggest scam of all time. How much would you pay to stay alive? Probably anything right? They know that, and act accordingly. USA is great if you're a millionaire, if not, you're much better off in Canada or just about anywhere else.

[Primer]

No, I want an actual PG.

So you don't want Fred? Cool, me neither.

Fred is NOT A PG.

Like holy crap guys, he's just not.

He's a combo guard who leans heavily towards SG.

Just because he's short does not make him a PG.