Everything VanVleet

[golden]

All organizations go up and down. It’s cyclical. Spurs were at the top for a long time now they suck. This is every North American sports organization with very few exceptions (Yankees and…. that’s about it.) Winning it all takes an incredible amount of good fortune. Even amazing teams have very short timelines 3-5 years) and they are done. The odd dynasty is the result of a generational player but once he is gone (Brady, Gretzky, Jordan) those teams fade back to the pack. Not sure why you think Toronto would be or should be the Yankees of the NBA.

In hindsight, the Raptors had the perfect excuse to go into that rebuild cycle.... one micro-second after Kawhi left. The smart move would have been to sell high on Ibaka, Gasol & Lowry while the championship glow was the brightest. And maybe Danny Green (if a sign & trade scenario was available which also benefited the Lakers). I will also add selling high on Fred to that list, even though he was a young player.

[G__Deane]

The fortunate part was winning a championship in the first year of Kawhi, but stars get traded fairly often. Its also rare for a star to bolt after winning a championship.

The Raptors' philosophy of developing and winning while retaining assets worked perfectly for Kawhi because they still had a good enough team to win a title with Kawhi.

Raps currently have assets, but unfortunately the developing players and winning has been lacking.

Yup but the stars who get traded fairly often, don't often come here. The players that leave in FA so theoretically cost you nothing but $$, never come here....Masai needs to break that trend.

[slaw]

In hindsight, the Raptors had the perfect excuse to go into that rebuild cycle.... one micro-second after Kawhi left. The smart move would have been to sell high on Ibaka, Gasol & Lowry while the championship glow was the brightest. And maybe Danny Green (if a sign & trade scenario was available which also benefited the Lakers). I will also add selling high on Fred to that list, even though he was a young player.

No, that’s what trash organizations like the Marlins do. It’s a huge fuck you to both fans and the players. Sets a terrible precedent and tarnishes the front office and ownership.

[G__Deane]

All organizations go up and down. It’s cyclical. Spurs were at the top for a long time now they suck. This is every North American sports organization with very few exceptions (Yankees and…. that’s about it.) Winning it all takes an incredible amount of good fortune. Even amazing teams have very short timelines 3-5 years) and they are done. The odd dynasty is the result of a generational player but once he is gone (Brady, Gretzky, Jordan) those teams fade back to the pack. Not sure why you think Toronto would be or should be the Yankees of the NBA.

You got the point exactly backwards
I don't necessarily want the Raptors to be the Yankees of the NBA.

I just don't want them to be the Minnesota Timberwolves or the Cavs sans lebron and I think that's where we're heading. Without that one magical season, that's more what we've been (if you're counting ECF's or Chips as the goal) not just a winning organization, which they've been recently.

[Yuri Gagarin]

Re the yankees, mlb has no cap

[slaw]

You got the point exactly backwards
I don't necessarily want the Raptors to be the Yankees of the NBA.

I just don't want them to be the Minnesota Timberwolves or the Cavs sans lebron and I think that's where we're heading. Without that one magical season, that's more what we've been (if you're counting ECF's or Chips as the goal) not just a winning organization, which they've been recently.

The Raptors were one of the worst organizations in the NBA until about 8 years ago. Toronto was so bad it once centered its season ticket marketing campaign around Rob Babcock and Sam Mitchell. Raps had one coach who fought players and another who sued an opposing player for defamation. Remember when the GM came out on court after the last game of a season and apologized to fans for how shitty the team was?

Like, you're worried about the organization now? The 2022 Raptors look like the 80s Lakers compared to the 1995-2013 Raptors.

[G__Deane]

Re the yankees, mlb has no cap

No hard cap but a significant luxury tax that a select few can still ignore.

[planetmars]

In hindsight, the Raptors had the perfect excuse to go into that rebuild cycle.... one micro-second after Kawhi left. The smart move would have been to sell high on Ibaka, Gasol & Lowry while the championship glow was the brightest. And maybe Danny Green (if a sign & trade scenario was available which also benefited the Lakers). I will also add selling high on Fred to that list, even though he was a young player.

That 2020 team without Kawhi was a contender.. and unfortunately they ran into a pandemic. Pascal turned into a shell of what he was earlier in the year. Gasol got really old. And we lost home court advantage. Still got to the second round easily and made it interesting, despite being down 3-0.

It was the right call to go for it.. that team still was great.

[Kagemusha]

That 2020 team without Kawhi was a contender.. and unfortunately they ran into a pandemic. Pascal turned into a shell of what he was earlier in the year. Gasol got really old. And we lost home court advantage. Still got to the second round easily and made it interesting, despite being down 3-0.

It was the right call to go for it.. that team still was great.

Every team was affected by the pandemic, not just the Raptors, not just Pascal.
And no, Pascal would never have been able to carry that team.

[Dr Hannibal Lecter]

Lord works in mysterious ways..however u guys are Trash and not even God can fix Garbage..

I'll be definitely praying 2 lord 2 get rid Of Nameless 23...every night until his bum a#@ is gone..

[planetmars]

Every team was affected by the pandemic, not just the Raptors, not just Pascal.
And no, Pascal would never have been able to carry that team.

I don't really agree. We played the Lakers well in the regular season. Heat weren't that great. Celtics were tough and if we had home court we would have beaten them. The toughest team would have been the Bucks. They lost to the Heat in the bubble. Maybe that doesn't happen outside a bubble. But we would have had a good game plan for Giannis again.

You are maybe misremembering how good that 2020 team was. Our bench was awesome that year.

[A.I]

Every team was affected by the pandemic, not just the Raptors, not just Pascal.
And no, Pascal would never have been able to carry that team.

A whole lot of differences. Canadian rules on the pandemic were stricter than the States. Its also been said the Lakers, and probably other teams held secret practices during the hiatus. We know Pascal wasn't able to practice at all, even by himself. The hiatus especially helped the Lakers because AD and Lebron got rest and could stay healthy.

It affected players in different ways. Whatever PG and Pascal went through mentally, then you had Murray and Mitchell averaging 40 while playing without a crowd. Nuggets also made two 3-1 comebacks. It was a weird time.

[Kagemusha]

I don't really agree. We played the Lakers well in the regular season. Heat weren't that great. Celtics were tough and if we had home court we would have beaten them. The toughest team would have been the Bucks. They lost to the Heat in the bubble. Maybe that doesn't happen outside a bubble. But we would have had a good game plan for Giannis again.

You are maybe misremembering how good that 2020 team was. Our bench was awesome that year.

My point is that if we are thinking that Pascal would be THE guy that replaced Kawhi, and who would have been tasked to carry the team the way Kawhi did, then we are seriously over valuing him.
Pascal was never that guy, especially at that point in his career, and even up to now.
We all know that a deep bench is useful in the regular season, it shortens significantly in the playoffs.

[planetmars]

My point is that if we are thinking that Pascal would be THE guy that replaced Kawhi, and who would have been tasked to carry the team the way Kawhi did, then we are seriously over valuing him.
Pascal was never that guy, especially at that point in his career, and even up to now.
We all know that a deep bench is useful in the regular season, it shortens significantly in the playoffs.

That team was more about the sum of its parts.. like the 2004 Pistons. The East was there for the taking. Tatum and Giannis still didn't have "it". And Butler was the lone guy in Miami with up and comers in Bam and Herro. No super teams except out West with the Lakers. Warriors were a lottery team that year too.

[Kagemusha]

That team was more about the sum of its parts.. like the 2004 Pistons. The East was there for the taking. Tatum and Giannis still didn't have "it". And Butler was the lone guy in Miami with up and comers in Bam and Herro. No super teams except out West with the Lakers. Warriors were a lottery team that year too.

Giannis was the MVP that year