Everything VanVleet

[Primer]

The 2-man net rating for Fred+Scottie and Pascal+Scottie is about the same. That's both this year and last year. Despite Fred having a terrible start to the season. And the back half last season.

If Fred continues to play like has (where he can consistently make his 3pt shots, and be a legit threat from the outside), then I find that Scottie and Pascal will just become super redundant. Neither can play off ball well. Unless they are involved in pick and roll actions with each other, but that rarely happens. So what we get is a lot of ISO. Pascal gives it up to Scottie, and hangs back. Or Scottie gives it to Pascal and hangs back. Without either being a 3pt threat, the offense can get mucky.

When Scottie gets naturally better and we want the ball more in his hands, Pascal's strengths gets diminished.

Now if Fred is playing like crap like he did for the first 30-35 games of the year, then yeah you don't want Fred anywhere near Scottie. But the guy we've seen most recently is the Fred that I was hoping to see all year. And that guy would work better with Scottie IMO.


With all that said, I don't think we're going to trade Pascal. I just think if we had to maximize this roster and have Scottie be the man.. Pascal will have to be moved. Pascal is a great #2 (we saw that in the chip run).. but Kawhi can make 3's.. we also had Fred and Marc on that team to make things easier for everyone. It's not a huge problem for now as we're still re-tooling this roster, but I think it will eventually be an issue. The good thing as well is because we have a stinky record, Pascal will likely not get all-nba. Which also means finding a trade partner should be a bit easier. Of course he could get all-nba next season, and still be qualified for the super max.

So the net ratings show that Scottie plays just as well with either, not better with Fred.

The analysis then goes to who contributes more to winning, Fred or Pascal? The answer is Pascal by a country mile. You keep Pascal and trade Fred.

Not sure why you think Pascal and Scottie have the same game and are redundant.

[planetmars]

So the net ratings show that Scottie plays just as well with either, not better with Fred.

The analysis then goes to who contributes more to winning, Fred or Pascal? The answer is Pascal by a country mile. You keep Pascal and trade Fred.

Not sure why you think Pascal and Scottie have the same game and are redundant.

It's same but with Fred playing like a g-league player for the first half of the season. If you think he's going to play like that going forward into his next contract, then you don't want Fred anywhere around Scottie. But if he plays like he did the past 10-15 games then IMO he's a better fit.

Pascal is having a fantastic individual season. But I don't think he and Pascal are optimal together. I gave you reasons why in my previous post. Scottie and Pascal both need the ball in their hands, and neither are good off ball threats.

It's fine now, because we suck and are middling. But if you want them to be an elite team, one of them needs to learn how to be a consistent shooter or we need to trade one for someone that fits better. The NBA is always about fit and chemistry.

Playing Embiid and Jokic together would also not be great.. yet they both contribute to winning.

[G__Deane]

Nurse on FVV:
“Obviously leading up, the first half of last season up until this point, that was his [best basketball], for sure,” said Raptors head coach Nick Nurse about his point guard. “These last group of games he’s been as good as that, for sure. He’s getting to the rim. He’s shooting the ball. He’s making some open ones. He’s creating some threes. He’s hitting some step backs. He’s got a little bit of mid-range going. Looks athletically really good out there, moving side to side and guarding people. He’s playing really well right now.”
Fred being traded confirmed

VanVleet says it’s been coming for a while, it’s just taken time for the number to catch up to how he’s been feeling.
Dude, you sat out multiple games in the last week with a boad back lol

“Getting my legs under me took a little longer than I would have liked it too, said VanVleet. “I made a lot of drastic changes to my body and to my approach to my preparation and just the way that I’m approaching the season. It took a little longer for me to find it.
Wait, a few weeks ago, you were telling multiple writers that the problem was the Raptors asked you to play a different position/differently, now it's you made drastic changes to your body.

“I feel good where I’m at and I just have to find ways to maintain that on a nightly basis. When I’m fresh and I got that pop, I feel like I can compete against anybody in the league and it’s my job to continue to find ways stay ready and stay fresh for the season.”

“But I feel like I’ve been playing great basketball all season, the three’s just not falling
Complete lack of self awareness

On changing agents:
“It was a long time in the making,” he said of his decision to change agents, adding that reports that he’s going to join Klutch Sports Group, the agency representing Gary Trent Jr. and Anunoby – two other Raptors whose names have been prominent in trade rumours – were premature. “Maybe the paperwork getting filed around the time when my name is in a lot of trade rumours, it’s going to make some noise, but there’s really nothing to it.

“It’s just time for me to switch agents for the second half of my career,” he added. “It didn’t work out with the previous thing going on. I’m looking forward to a long, prosperous career, so I wouldn’t read too much into it.”

Didn't work out? What the hell does this even mean??? You bet on yourself and are rich beyond all reason and about to undoubtedly cash in once again shortly....Is it something more current, like the Raptors didn't cave and just sign you to some weird max contract by now?

I don't dislike FVV but I'm kinda done with him at the same time, too much drama, too much all about Fred.
Sell high on Fred....

[The Claw Reborn]

Nurse on FVV:
“Obviously leading up, the first half of last season up until this point, that was his [best basketball], for sure,” said Raptors head coach Nick Nurse about his point guard. “These last group of games he’s been as good as that, for sure. He’s getting to the rim. He’s shooting the ball. He’s making some open ones. He’s creating some threes. He’s hitting some step backs. He’s got a little bit of mid-range going. Looks athletically really good out there, moving side to side and guarding people. He’s playing really well right now.”
Fred being traded confirmed

VanVleet says it’s been coming for a while, it’s just taken time for the number to catch up to how he’s been feeling.
Dude, you sat out multiple games in the last week with a boad back lol

“Getting my legs under me took a little longer than I would have liked it too, said VanVleet. “I made a lot of drastic changes to my body and to my approach to my preparation and just the way that I’m approaching the season. It took a little longer for me to find it.
Wait, a few weeks ago, you were telling multiple writers that the problem was the Raptors asked you to play a different position/differently, now it's you made drastic changes to your body.

“I feel good where I’m at and I just have to find ways to maintain that on a nightly basis. When I’m fresh and I got that pop, I feel like I can compete against anybody in the league and it’s my job to continue to find ways stay ready and stay fresh for the season.”

“But I feel like I’ve been playing great basketball all season, the three’s just not falling
Complete lack of self awareness

On changing agents:
“It was a long time in the making,” he said of his decision to change agents, adding that reports that he’s going to join Klutch Sports Group, the agency representing Gary Trent Jr. and Anunoby – two other Raptors whose names have been prominent in trade rumours – were premature. “Maybe the paperwork getting filed around the time when my name is in a lot of trade rumours, it’s going to make some noise, but there’s really nothing to it.

“It’s just time for me to switch agents for the second half of my career,” he added. “It didn’t work out with the previous thing going on. I’m looking forward to a long, prosperous career, so I wouldn’t read too much into it.”

Didn't work out? What the hell does this even mean??? You bet on yourself and are rich beyond all reason and about to undoubtedly cash in once again shortly....Is it something more current, like the Raptors didn't cave and just sign you to some weird max contract by now?

I don't dislike FVV but I'm kinda done with him at the same time, too much drama, too much all about Fred.
Sell high on Fred....

Deaner lol….

I bet my left nut, you would get few responses like these:

“Much ado about nothing”
”These are a bunch of nothing burger”
”You are reading too much into it”
”what narrative are you selling now”

But I fully agree with you….1,000%

Sell high, Trade VanVleet

[G__Deane]

Deaner lol….

I bet my left nut, you would get few responses like these:

“Much ado about nothing”
”These are a bunch of nothing burger”
”You are reading too much into it”
”what narrative are you selling now”

But I fully agree with you….1,000%

Sell high, Trade VanVleet

Pssst, sometimes it's fun just to post a lot of hot takes to rile the boys up. The paid poster gig is lucrative....

[Dr Hannibal Lecter]

Nurse on FVV:
“Obviously leading up, the first half of last season up until this point, that was his [best basketball], for sure,” said Raptors head coach Nick Nurse about his point guard. “These last group of games he’s been as good as that, for sure. He’s getting to the rim. He’s shooting the ball. He’s making some open ones. He’s creating some threes. He’s hitting some step backs. He’s got a little bit of mid-range going. Looks athletically really good out there, moving side to side and guarding people. He’s playing really well right now.”
Fred being traded confirmed

VanVleet says it’s been coming for a while, it’s just taken time for the number to catch up to how he’s been feeling.
Dude, you sat out multiple games in the last week with a boad back lol

“Getting my legs under me took a little longer than I would have liked it too, said VanVleet. “I made a lot of drastic changes to my body and to my approach to my preparation and just the way that I’m approaching the season. It took a little longer for me to find it.
Wait, a few weeks ago, you were telling multiple writers that the problem was the Raptors asked you to play a different position/differently, now it's you made drastic changes to your body.

“I feel good where I’m at and I just have to find ways to maintain that on a nightly basis. When I’m fresh and I got that pop, I feel like I can compete against anybody in the league and it’s my job to continue to find ways stay ready and stay fresh for the season.”

“But I feel like I’ve been playing great basketball all season, the three’s just not falling
Complete lack of self awareness

On changing agents:
“It was a long time in the making,” he said of his decision to change agents, adding that reports that he’s going to join Klutch Sports Group, the agency representing Gary Trent Jr. and Anunoby – two other Raptors whose names have been prominent in trade rumours – were premature. “Maybe the paperwork getting filed around the time when my name is in a lot of trade rumours, it’s going to make some noise, but there’s really nothing to it.

“It’s just time for me to switch agents for the second half of my career,” he added. “It didn’t work out with the previous thing going on. I’m looking forward to a long, prosperous career, so I wouldn’t read too much into it.”

Didn't work out? What the hell does this even mean??? You bet on yourself and are rich beyond all reason and about to undoubtedly cash in once again shortly....Is it something more current, like the Raptors didn't cave and just sign you to some weird max contract by now?

I don't dislike FVV but I'm kinda done with him at the same time, too much drama, too much all about Fred.
Sell high on Fred....

Lol...This team had there best game against a not really good team all year..and here we are..it's again about him, not team success..him..holy f^%%.
Even though he shot like s^$%, which is given..that's a norm I guess now days, he finally decided 2 play some D....congrats..
Whatever man, I've said my piece on this guy, we know what he is, just move on.
Move from the drama, headache, it's just nauseating. Sick of listening hot garbage.

[Yuri Gagarin]

If we had the Bulls pick combined with ours we’d have 15.8% chance at 1st overall. Rockets, Pistons & Hornets would each have 14%.

Wouldnt you have to subtract the chance chicago moves up and keeps their pick?

(20% chance chicago gets a top 4 pick and keeps it)

[Primer]

Lol...This team had there best game against a not really good team all year..and here we are..it's again about him, not team success..him..holy f^%%.
Even though he shot like s^$%, which is given..that's a norm I guess now days, he finally decided 2 play some D....congrats..
Whatever man, I've said my piece on this guy, we know what he is, just move on.
Move from the drama, headache, it's just nauseating. Sick of listening hot garbage.

Thanks for bringing this up. Everyone on the team shot fantastic too except for Flynn.

Sell high!

[DanH]

Maybe I'm cheap but an undersized gaurd who actually is better as an off ball shooter and isn't the greatest at getting his own shot and has seen players blow by him this season is worth more like the 22 or so we already offered......maybe 25.....

The 22 or so we already offered was actually 28.5M.
The 130M number is 32.5M. We're not talking a huge range here.

[TrueTorontoFan]

The 22 or so we already offered was actually 28.5M.
The 130M number is 32.5M. We're not talking a huge range here.

cool... im good though

[Dvdvideo]

The 22 or so we already offered was actually 28.5M.
The 130M number is 32.5M. We're not talking a huge range here.

Wow I though it was less, he's crazy to turn down over a hundred million dollars guaranteed on the chance of 12 million more. I mean how many mansions can you buy anyhow?
Karma should take it away.

[LJ2]

Wow I though it was less, he's crazy to turn down over a hundred million dollars guaranteed on the chance of 12 million more. I mean how many mansions can you buy anyhow?
Karma should take it away.

Did he turn it down or did both sides agree to revisit in the summer? These guys have a relatively short career so lets not talk about $12M like it's nothing. Every bit counts for a guy who is likely going to be out of a job in the next 7-8 years.

Ultimately, it's an agreement to pay Fred whatever his market value is. Raps would be losing all leverage by agreeing to let this go to the summer when he can walk.

[DanH]

We should also keep in mind the upside is not 130M, it's his max which is way higher. The 130M is more like the expected market based on other signings, he could always set a new market threshold with his signing, that's how like every market gets set.

[G__Deane]

Did he turn it down or did both sides agree to revisit in the summer? These guys have a relatively short career so lets not talk about $12M like it's nothing. Every bit counts for a guy who is likely going to be out of a job in the next 7-8 years.

Ultimately, it's an agreement to pay Fred whatever his market value is. Raps would be losing all leverage by agreeing to let this go to the summer when he can walk.

Man, we have lost the plot.

$100M net, invested conservatively @5% gets you $5,000,000, a year for life.
That's generational money for houses, toys, taking care of your family and yearly charity generosity from a Trust with tax advantages....and discounts entirely how much he's already earned.

[LJ2]

Man, we have lost the plot.

$100M net, invested conservatively @5% gets you $5,000,000, a year for life.
That's generational money for houses, toys, taking care of your family and yearly charity generosity from a Trust with tax advantages....and discounts entirely how much he's already earned.

Nobody feels bad for these guys and whatever they do with their money. It's not the point though. They all are trying to get as much out of their careers as possible. Fred, Dame and every other guy in the NBA.