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Legacy League match 22 Bobloblaw vs Maury

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  • BobLoblaw
    replied
    He didn't throw outlet passes on most possessions, and I can't really 'prove' to you in a written form that he's fast. Simply watch games and tell me he's fast and quick. Watch how he runs the floor, watch how he moves in halfcourt. Don't just watch a few highlights and then rationalize why he might seem slow to me. I've seen most of his Lakers and 76ers series from 77, I know how he played and I know full well that he was good at outlet passes, and he still seemed slowish for a center to me.

    If you did watch games and still think he's an athletic and quick guy, capable of playing pf, then it's fair enough, everyone can have an opinion, i'll just disagree with yours.

    Good center overall though. Not a great shooting touch and not the most athletically gifted from what ive seen, but great otherwise, rebounding, rim protection, post moves, smart.

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  • e_wheazhy_
    replied
    He wouldn't make it past half court because he threw pin point outlet passes, his team was fast and liked to run, they usually scored before he even needed to get there

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  • Maury
    replied
    BobLoblaw wrote: View Post
    To clarify here what I meant with that Kareem sentence. I was just using Kareem to paint a picture, so to speak, since I think he's much more known/ seen than Walton. Kareem was a pure center, Walton was a slow pure center.

    I was about to use modern comparisons there, but I decided it's a bit too shaky to do when there's a word limit. Everyone can open up a game and see him play Kareem, no one can see him play modern players.

    I'd say he's definitely taller and less mobile than Valanciunas. He's a slowish tall rim protector. In 1977 finals he didn't even make it across halfcourt on offensive possessions a lot of the time, not much of a runner and his main job was to stay around the rim.

    I didn't mean to compare Kareem and McHale, I just meant to say Walton's a slow player and pairing him with another really slow player is going to end badly. Yao alone could be liability in certain defensive situations because of his lack of speed.

    I think it's like starting two Hibberts, one might be ok and you can drop him back and cover for his mobility with a good scheme. Two Hibberts, it's going to be impossible to cover. People will want to switch, attack them in pick and rolls. Big numbers advantage on both ends of a floor for a few seconds, while slow giants jog across.

    ---

    As far as McHale, I'd say he was a solid athlete, he wasn't challenged athletically, he was mobile and could jump fine. The Celtics would often ask him to defend people like Nique or Worthy, athletic small forwards / small power forwards, to save Bird on defense. He probably scored more off simple athletic plays and putbacks than off his post up game. He was a fine athlete, just not a Shawn Kemp or Charles Barkley level athlete.
    He was as athletic as any centre, and incredibly mobile. At his peak, he rivals the likes of Kareem and Russel for greatest centre of all time. He was the ultimate impact player and could do it all, and would do it all for his team to win. He would hang back on defence when his team went on a fast break in case the other team got a fast break, which was a smart play and worked all the time for him. He was anything but a slow rim-protector.

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  • BobLoblaw
    replied
    Axel wrote: View Post
    Walton certainly seems quick enough to hang with McHale though (which is what Maury said was the plan, so your point about him not being athletic enough for Kareem seems off base). McHale doesn't scream "athletic" PF, so Walton seems to fit.
    To clarify here what I meant with that Kareem sentence. I was just using Kareem to paint a picture, so to speak, since I think he's much more known/ seen than Walton. Kareem was a pure center, Walton was a slow pure center.

    I was about to use modern comparisons there, but I decided it's a bit too shaky to do when there's a word limit. Everyone can open up a game and see him play Kareem, no one can see him play modern players.

    I'd say he's definitely taller and less mobile than Valanciunas. He's a slowish tall rim protector. In 1977 finals he didn't even make it across halfcourt on offensive possessions a lot of the time, not much of a runner and his main job was to stay around the rim.

    I didn't mean to compare Kareem and McHale, I just meant to say Walton's a slow player and pairing him with another really slow player is going to end badly. Yao alone could be liability in certain defensive situations because of his lack of speed.

    I think it's like starting two Hibberts, one might be ok and you can drop him back and cover for his mobility with a good scheme. Two Hibberts, it's going to be impossible to cover. People will want to switch, attack them in pick and rolls. Big numbers advantage on both ends of a floor for a few seconds, while slow giants jog across.

    ---

    As far as McHale, I'd say he was a solid athlete, he wasn't challenged athletically, he was mobile and could jump fine. The Celtics would often ask him to defend people like Nique or Worthy, athletic small forwards / small power forwards, to save Bird on defense. He probably scored more off simple athletic plays and putbacks than off his post up game. He was a fine athlete, just not a Shawn Kemp or Charles Barkley level athlete.

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  • e_wheazhy_
    replied
    I Vote Maury

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  • Axel
    replied
    Tight match. Few hours left to vote.

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  • Joey
    replied
    I think Bob matches up nicely against Maury. Nice defense and shooting balance for Bob. Tough choice though.

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  • Axel
    replied
    BobLoblaw wrote: View Post
    All this team will ever do is shoot contested midrange jumpers because there's no space inside.
    Currently leaning Maury, because even if this is true, MJ, DrJ and Zeke can make those.

    I think Penny struggles mightily vs Zeke and that is currently tipping the balance imo

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  • BobLoblaw
    replied
    Hehe, well, i can't reply anymore.

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  • Axel
    replied
    BobLoblaw wrote: View Post
    Walton wasn't athletic or quick. Way below Kareem as athlete. Can't picture Walton as PF.

    Not a shooter either.

    This team starts 2 slowish centers, rim protectors. I doubt that works defensively or offensively.

    All this team will ever do is shoot contested midrange jumpers because there's no space inside.
    Walton certainly seems quick enough to hang with McHale though (which is what Maury said was the plan, so your point about him not being athletic enough for Kareem seems off base). McHale doesn't scream "athletic" PF, so Walton seems to fit.

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  • BobLoblaw
    replied
    Walton wasn't athletic or quick. Way below Kareem as athlete. Can't picture Walton as PF.

    Not a shooter either.

    This team starts 2 slowish centers, rim protectors. I doubt that works defensively or offensively.

    All this team will ever do is shoot contested midrange jumpers because there's no space inside.

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  • Maury
    replied
    Axel wrote: View Post
    Totally first read this as "whores throughout" which would be amazing.
    Interpret as you wish 😉.

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  • Axel
    replied
    Maury wrote: View Post
    Bob's bench has wholes throughout.
    Totally first read this as "whores throughout" which would be amazing.

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  • Maury
    replied
    Every single person in my lineup is an above average mid range shooter, so spacing isn't much of an issue. Bob is under rating Walton as an athlete. He was athletic and mobile and the combo of him and Yao would definitely overpower Robinson and Mchale. Bob's bench has wholes throughout.

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  • e_wheazhy_
    replied
    I like Bill Walton on McHale, and Yao has a size advantage on the Admiral. Bob has good d in the Starting Lineup but everyone in there needs the ball in their hands to be successful. I think it'll come down to a front court duel, which I think maury takes.

    I can already see Jordan backing down Kobe with that signature smirk on his face, shimmy, shake him, hit a jumper over his shoulder and then give him the shrug.

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