Everything Trade Chatter

[lewro]

Cojo's playoffs WS & WS/48 was 4th best on the team.

And JV's playoff BPM was 4.0 (best on team) and vorp was .5 (2nd best).

DD's playoff vorp was a team worst -0.3

Cherrypicking stats is fun.

It was honest cherry picking. I didn't look at those stats. I was actually surprised to see his playoffs stats bc I thought he played great (so ws makes sense) and his stats this year probably got off to a slow start and will go up. It wasn't in depth, just a glance. Thx.

[hotfuzz]

After seeing his recent antics, my opinion on Boogie: DO NOT WANT.

I'd stay as far away from him as possible.

[DanH]

It was honest cherry picking. I didn't look at those stats. I was actually surprised to see his playoffs stats bc I thought he played great (so ws makes sense) and his stats this year probably got off to a slow start and will go up. It wasn't in depth, just a glance. Thx.

In general, over small samples, BPM and RPM are pretty much useless. So quoting a playoff BPM will inherently be misleading more often than not. Same for BPM so far this season - some will make sense, some will be wild outliers. RPM and BPM are stats derived from RAPM - an adjusted plus-minus that was taken (and regularized) over a 2 year sample because even 1 year samples of APM had too much year to year variance - it was mostly noise. Now we use these new fangled versions with small samples and never really think about how problematic that is.

BPM especially is funny, because in an attempt to get away from those small sample restrictions, they've tied a lot (read: all) of the stat into correlations with box score stats - unfortunately, that goes away from the entire concept of plus-minus stats, that players can be affecting the play without it registering in the box score. So even if on aggregate, BPM will show who is an impact player because most impact players get steals, for example, there are certainly guys who don't get steals that impact the game just as much that the BPM stat is missing - any regression based stat will inherently miss a lot of things.

In any case, for both stats, small samples are still very misleading most of the time.

[lewro]

You can look across Cory's career BPM and vorp and see some consistency.
I'm in transit on my phone so when I scrolled over, the win shares were off screen. I like cory so it was an honest omission.
Most of us are not as invested in analytics so the Coles notes explanation is appreciated. Thx.
I'm mostly interested in getting norm pt, clearing the log jam and getting front court help. I'm not attacking Cory, I'm just suggesting that he might be a movable piece to accomplish some of the above.

[Lupe]

After seeing his recent antics, my opinion on Boogie: DO NOT WANT.

I'd stay as far away from him as possible.

Pistons traded for Rasheed Wallace (who was not as talented as Cousins but a similar player in attitude and play-style) mid-season and won the title in 2004.

Idk why every player we need to trade for needs to be an angel. Cousins has a lot of fire and anger because he wants to win. He's not complaining because of his stats or touches or a feud with another player on a team or his contract or anything selfish like that. He's mad cause they aren't winning enough. That's what you fucking WANT. If anything he's less of an issue than Lowry was when we acquired him because Lowry's complaints mainly had to do with his own playing time and role.

He wants to win. We're going to win, a lot. He gives us that superstar or third all-star that could get us by Cleveland. We would be stupid to not trade for Cousins if we can get him without moving DeRozan or Lowry.

[rocwell]

Stephen A. Smith also have a story about Boogie & media.

You know, I love Boogie. He's 2nd-best big man in the league imo. But damn. He hasn't learned the lesson of his past 'problems'. just yet.. It's coming, I have no doubt. It will make him a better person and hell of a player on the championship team.

[Chr1s1anL]

Pistons traded for Rasheed Wallace (who was not as talented as Cousins but a similar player in attitude and play-style) mid-season and won the title in 2004.

Idk why every player we need to trade for needs to be an angel. Cousins has a lot of fire and anger because he wants to win. He's not complaining because of his stats or touches or a feud with another player on a team or his contract or anything selfish like that. He's mad cause they aren't winning enough. That's what you fucking WANT. If anything he's less of an issue than Lowry was when we acquired him because Lowry's complaints mainly had to do with his own playing time and role.

He wants to win. We're going to win, a lot. He gives us that superstar or third all-star that could get us by Cleveland. We would be stupid to not trade for Cousins if we can get him without moving DeRozan or Lowry.

The fact that he has never demanded a trade is crazy.

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[rocwell]

The fact that he has never demanded a trade is crazy.

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I agree with First Take guys. I think he wants to play with John Wall. Although I'm not sure reunion is possible w/ Wall still under contract.

[hotfuzz]

Pistons traded for Rasheed Wallace (who was not as talented as Cousins but a similar player in attitude and play-style) mid-season and won the title in 2004.

Idk why every player we need to trade for needs to be an angel. Cousins has a lot of fire and anger because he wants to win. He's not complaining because of his stats or touches or a feud with another player on a team or his contract or anything selfish like that. He's mad cause they aren't winning enough. That's what you fucking WANT. If anything he's less of an issue than Lowry was when we acquired him because Lowry's complaints mainly had to do with his own playing time and role.

He wants to win. We're going to win, a lot. He gives us that superstar or third all-star that could get us by Cleveland. We would be stupid to not trade for Cousins if we can get him without moving DeRozan or Lowry.

Imo there can only be one knucklehead in the team. Two of them fucks everything up.

[Chr1s1anL]

Stephen A. Smith also have a story about Boogie & media.

You know, I love Boogie. He's 2nd-best big man in the league imo. But damn. He hasn't learned the lesson of his past 'problems'. just yet.. It's coming, I have no doubt. It will make him a better person and hell of a player on the championship team.

Kyle/Deebo fit the type of player they are talking about. Boogie wasn't a problem on team USA and he wouldn't be one in Toronto either.

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[Chr1s1anL]

Imo there can only be one knucklehead in the team. Two of them fucks everything up.

I wouldn't consider Lowry a knucklehead anymore.

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[rocwell]

Kyle/Deebo fit the type of player they are talking about. Boogie wasn't a problem on team USA and he wouldn't be one in Toronto either.

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Well, maybe, but we don't really know that.

[rocwell]

I wouldn't consider Lowry a knucklehead anymore.

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Casey said it's not always easy with Kyle but I agree with you. He grew up.

[Chr1s1anL]

Well, maybe, but we don't really know that.

The only way he would be a problem is if the Raptors started losing. Just don't see a trio of Deebo/Klow/Boogie losing many games.

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[planetmars]

Boogie would be stupid to ask for a trade now. He can get a super-max extension under the new CBA by just holding tight. Then ask for a trade after he's gotten his $$$.