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  • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Their defensive scheme says different. They are basically daring anyone not named Lowry/DeRozan to beat them. Unfortunately the other players aren't good enough.

    Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
    Cav's are a vet team that are going to coast through the regular season and turn it on in time for the playoffs. They are making sure they turn it on when they play us though. That's respect enough for me if the questions is do they respect the Raptors.

    Are we good enough to beat them in a playoff series, no. And that is a talent issue which at some point Ujiri will have to address.

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    • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
      Their defensive scheme says different. They are basically daring anyone not named Lowry/DeRozan to beat them. Unfortunately the other players aren't good enough.

      Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
      Think that both Ross and Ppat are good enough to make the shots that are needed to beat the Cavs. So far this year they haven't made those 3 point shots against the Lebrons. However the shots are there. The offense is getting them the looks. But unlike the nights against the Hawks or Lakers Pat and Terry's shots didn't go in vs the Cavs.

      KL and DD are doing what they have to do.. they are putting up 50 or 50 plus between them in every game against the Lebrons but to win Ross and Ppat and Carroll have to do better than they did last night with the offense. JV and Bebe and Siakam are going to have to find a way to get more boards than Thompson and Love on defense.

      Yeah its going to be hard. Yeah its a lot to ask of your personnell because we don't matchup well at all against the Lebrons when they go small... but these are the NBA champions and to beat them you need to be better at everything you do normally ... Thats just how it is.
      Last edited by Demographic Shift; Tue Dec 6, 2016, 02:00 PM.

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      • golden wrote: View Post
        More imaginary fuel to this imaginary fire .....



        http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=h7khsqk
        I remember talking to you about this. Looks like spurs have landed on their feet. Be interested to hear other jv trade proposals (just hypotheticals, he's still on the team). Been looking at vucevic/nurkic deals to get a sense. Its not pretty.
        I wouldn't love this but just for argument sake what about jv for bogut and a lightly protected first (say top 10, then top 3, unprotected). 2017 is loaded with pgs but 2018 has more forwards. I realize this is not an ideal return but I'm curious of jvs value.

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        • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
          Think that both Ross and Ppat are good enough to make the shots that are needed to beat the Cavs. So far this year they haven't made those 3 point shots against the Lebrons. However the shots are there. The offense is getting them the looks. But unlike the nights against the Hawks or Lakers Pat and Terry's shots didn't go in vs the Cavs.

          KL and DD are doing what they have to do.. they are putting up 50 or 50 plus between them in every game against the Lebrons but to win Ross and Ppat and Carroll have to do better than they did last night with the offense. JV and Bebe and Siakam are going to have to find a way to get more boards than Thompson and Love on defense.

          Yeah its going to be hard. Yeah its a lot to ask of your personnell... but these are the NBA champions and to beat them you need to be better at everything you do normally ... Thats just how it is.
          We've played them about 9 times now in 2016. Those players that need to make plays haven't. Its time to make a move. Counting on Ross, 2pat, Carroll and JV isn't going to work in my opinion. Need a talent upgrade.

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          @Chr1st1anL

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          • Bogut has an expiring contract and can't play more than 25 mins a game. I think JV will have more value he has one of the most team friendly contracts in the league.

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            • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
              Think that both Ross and Ppat are good enough to make the shots that are needed to beat the Cavs. So far this year they haven't made those 3 point shots against the Lebrons. However the shots are there. The offense is getting them the looks. But unlike the nights against the Hawks or Lakers Pat and Terry's shots didn't go in vs the Cavs.

              KL and DD are doing what they have to do.. they are putting up 50 or 50 plus between them in every game against the Lebrons but to win Ross and Ppat and Carroll have to do better than they did last night with the offense. JV and Bebe and Siakam are going to have to find a way to get more boards than Thompson and Love on defense.

              Yeah its going to be hard. Yeah its a lot to ask of your personnell because we don't matchup well at all against the Lebrons when they go small... but these are the NBA champions and to beat them you need to be better at everything you do normally ... Thats just how it is.
              Again, though, the offense is not the problem. Not against CLE or anyone else so far. The problem is the D; it's gotten better against middling teams the past few weeks, but they got absolutely roasted by CLE last night. Until that changes, they won't beat them 4 time in a couple of weeks in the spring.
              Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

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              • Everything Trade Chatter

                The best jv trade I can think of is jv/filler for chandler/warren

                That filler can be any of the young guys

                Chandler is the ideal centre for caseys system, and warren is a legit starting 3 with size.

                And I actually LOVE jv, but he NOT being used correctly here, and he's being benched late for BEBE. Like that unacceptable for your starting center


                Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                I'm back. I no longer worship joe johnson

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                • Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                  We've played them about 9 times now in 2016. Those players that need to make plays haven't. Its time to make a move. Counting on Ross, 2pat, Carroll and JV isn't going to work in my opinion. Need a talent upgrade.

                  Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
                  Continuity has entrenched itself into the Raptors operating principles.... It would be highly unlike Ujiri to make an impulsive trade as a result of losing games, albeit to the team you have to beat in the playoffs to get where you want to go, in the regular season.
                  Ross and Paterson have shown they can make those shots... they did it against the Hawks / Lakers and Ross had one waived off in Sacto that we all hate... but they have to make them against the likes of the Lebrons and against other high level competition in the playoffs. Thats between the ears stuff. Ujiri will continue to be patient with those two.

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                  • jimmie wrote: View Post
                    Again, though, the offense is not the problem. Not against CLE or anyone else so far. The problem is the D; it's gotten better against middling teams the past few weeks, but they got absolutely roasted by CLE last night. Until that changes, they won't beat them 4 time in a couple of weeks in the spring.
                    I think thats a function of matchups on D right now.
                    We have no answer for them right now when they go "small".. JV just can't chase either of Love or Frye out to the perimeter. He just can't. Its putting him in a position to fail miserably. Its not fair to him to make him try do something he isn't equipped to do. He has to come out.
                    Bebe is the more mobile 5 and if we stick with him, Ppat at the 4 and DD and Kyle and one of Ross/Powell/Cojo or Carroll at the other wing/guard spot all the focus is going to be on Ppat slowing Lebron as best he can and Bebe hedging like a madman on Frye or Love when Lebron pushes the pass out of the paint to one of those two standing at the arc. One of the wings is going to have to become a monster on the glass if Bebe commits to the close out and can't get back in time.
                    Its a real problem to solve and so far the Raps have come up a couple of puzzle pieces short each time this year.

                    yeah.. lebron fucking james is a helluva problem to solve.
                    Last edited by Demographic Shift; Tue Dec 6, 2016, 02:33 PM.

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                    • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
                      We have no answer for them right now when they go "small".. JV just can't chase either of Love or Frye out to the perimeter. He just can't. Its putting him in a position to fail miserably. Its not fair to him to make him try do something he isn't equipped to do. He has to come out.
                      Bebe is the more mobile 5 and if we stick with him, Ppat at the 4 and DD and Kyle and one of Ross/Powell/Cojo or Carroll at the other wing/guard spot all the focus is going to be on Ppat slowing Lebron as best he can and Bebe hedging like a madman on Frye or Love when Lebron pushes the pass out of the paint to one of those two standing at the arc. One of the wings is going to have to become a monster on the glass if Bebe commits to the close out and get back in time.
                      You're right -- we have no answer when they go small(ish), but that applies to most opponents, not just CLE. And I agree that it's just something JV is going to struggle with, probably his whole career -- PnR vs. quicker bigs, and guarding bigs who can shoot from the perimeter.

                      I don't think I share your enthusiasm for Bebe as a long-term solution. He's a better rim protector and is more mobile, but he's not an elite defender by any stretch. I really think -- unless they're saying screw it, no one is beating CLE/GSW anyway -- the answer to beating those two teams is better D. Move whoever you need to move to get that.
                      Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

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                      • slamdunk23 wrote: View Post
                        Bogut has an expiring contract and can't play more than 25 mins a game. I think JV will have more value he has one of the most team friendly contracts in the league.
                        I realize that but it's about the talent upgrade with a high lottery pick. Conflict to me is more our timeline with lowry, whether the pick hits and if the Mavs would say yes. Bogut is more salary match, play d and reb without needing touches. Clears some salary but doesn't help us much.
                        Jv has a value contract but I'm not sure of his market value in trade? That's really what I'm asking.

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                        • yabadabayolo wrote: View Post
                          The best jv trade I can think of is jv/filler for chandler/warren

                          That filler can be any of the young guys

                          Chandler is the ideal centre for caseys system, and warren is a legit starting 3 with size.

                          And I actually LOVE jv, but he NOT being used correctly here, and he's being benched late for BEBE. Like that unacceptable for your starting center


                          Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                          Unacceptable as a big 3. I don't see phx moving warren for jv. I like warren too.

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                          • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
                            I think thats a function of matchups on D right now.
                            We have no answer for them right now when they go "small".. JV just can't chase either of Love or Frye out to the perimeter. He just can't. Its putting him in a position to fail miserably. Its not fair to him to make him try do something he isn't equipped to do. He has to come out.
                            Bebe is the more mobile 5 and if we stick with him, Ppat at the 4 and DD and Kyle and one of Ross/Powell/Cojo or Carroll at the other wing/guard spot all the focus is going to be on Ppat slowing Lebron as best he can and Bebe hedging like a madman on Frye or Love when Lebron pushes the pass out of the paint to one of those two standing at the arc. One of the wings is going to have to become a monster on the glass if Bebe commits to the close out and can't get back in time.
                            Its a real problem to solve and so far the Raps have come up a couple of puzzle pieces short each time this year.

                            yeah.. lebron fucking james is a helluva problem to solve.
                            Noel can guard perimeter and protect the rim. Sully can rebound and stretch the floor. Our guards can throw lobs and kick outs. Still not gonna beat cavs but helps compete imo.

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                            • I'd love to trade a JV package to the Spurs for Aldrirdge but I doubt they would make that trade during the season. Or Milsap but I don't think they would be interested in JV.

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                              • slamdunk23 wrote: View Post
                                I'd love to trade a JV package to the Spurs for Aldrirdge but I doubt they would make that trade during the season. Or Milsap but I don't think they would be interested in JV.
                                Lots of folks would like Paul Milsap if he were to become available... Its hard to say if he helps as much we hope he would against the Lebrons... The firm of Horford and Milsap even when they won 60 went into Cleveland and came out 2nd best .. this too when they had Carroll at his best....AND this was when Love was still figuring out his role and Frye wasn't there yet..

                                Might be if we can't figure out a way to defend the Cavs and Lebron then the Raps simply try to outgun them.

                                There is no easy answer right now... and that applies to the other 29 teams equally.


                                EDIT... Agree its unlikely that the Spurs move Aldridge during the course of the year... especially since they are off to yet another great start.
                                Last edited by Demographic Shift; Tue Dec 6, 2016, 03:12 PM.

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