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  • lewro wrote: View Post
    Yes, but I think there are degrees of risk. "Might" sounded a little extreme so I wanted to know why you consider the risk to be high?
    I would say the risk is moderate to low. Certainly I'd guess the defense would approve. Offensively I'd suspect some drop off. However, whiteside is a decent offensive player with some similar skills to jv. Not that we are using those skills this season and I think you are fond of saying Lowry+bench is the most effective unit this year.
    I'd say there's more risk that Whiteside is a bit of a head case and jv is selfless, almost to a fault.
    Very curious to hear what offensive skills JV and Whiteside have in common.
    twitter.com/dhackett1565

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    • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
      Fair ! So if the raps are keeping Ross in this hypothetical who else is going back with JV as its unlikely this is a straight up swap of big men...Pretty sure the heat would want whats coming back to be under the age of 25.
      I'm not sure what they need, but Delon or CJ could get thrown in, perhaps picks. I'm not saying I'm for a trade for Whiteside, just pointing out how his addition MIGHT work to get past the Cavs.

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      • DanH wrote: View Post
        Very curious to hear what offensive skills JV and Whiteside have in common.
        Their fg% is roughly the same inside of 10ft. They're both garbage beyond 10ft. Jv is a much better free throw shooter but they avg the same FTM. Hassan has twice as many FTA so he puts the opponent in foul trouble.
        Jv is much more skilled offensively but hassan is still productive and much more so on defense. Jv is not fueling the offense. He's getting put backs and setting screens.

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        • Oh you meant stats instead of skills.
          Two beer away from being two beers away.

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          • lewro wrote: View Post
            Their fg% is roughly the same inside of 10ft. They're both garbage beyond 10ft. Jv is a much better free throw shooter but they avg the same FTM. Hassan has twice as many FTA so he puts the opponent in foul trouble.
            Jv is much more skilled offensively but hassan is still productive and much more so on defense. Jv is not fueling the offense. He's getting put backs and setting screens.
            So, similar results in dramatically different systems. I'm seeing no similar offensive skills described in your post at all.

            JV scores 2 points a game from putbacks. I guess the other 10 PPG don't count. And him being top 10 in screen assists is of no value either (and his threat as a scorer on the roll has nothing to do with his effectiveness as a screener).

            Hassan doesn't "put" the opponent in foul trouble. They hack him. And it works great.
            twitter.com/dhackett1565

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            • LJ2 wrote: View Post
              I'm not sure what they need, but Delon or CJ could get thrown in, perhaps picks. I'm not saying I'm for a trade for Whiteside, just pointing out how his addition MIGHT work to get past the Cavs.
              The Heat have a PG in Dragic so Wright or Joesph might not be of interest....

              I think Whiteside is a good player. He is a better shot blocker than JV is and a marginally better rebounder, but JV is a better FT shooter and marginally better offensive player. They both can be timed with calanders running down the floor and their passing skills are about the same. So maybe a 5% margin of change for the better if Whiteside were to be wearing the Raps uniform. Not sure thats enough to make the change and pay a premium to do it.

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              • I would like to see DanH make a case for his claim of Whiteside being "elite" on defense. I know he's looking deeper than counting stats like blocks and rebounds but I don't know how clearly that would pan out.
                Two beer away from being two beers away.

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                • Buyer beware:
                  At first glance, Whiteside appears to be playing well. He’s averaging 17.3 points, 14.3 rebounds, and 2.4 blocks per game. But as in years past, the plus-minus numbers have never been kind to him. Translation: the Heat have often been better when he’s not on the floor.

                  In four games last week, he was a dreadful minus-74, which led to Erik Spoelstra benching him in the second half of their loss to the Cavs on Friday. If that wasn’t bed enough, an anonymous NBA scout recently offered Ira Winderman of ESPN.com a rather troubling assessment of the big man’s game. Here’s what Winderman had to say on The Big O Show, with a tip of the hat to SliceMiami.com for the text of that segment:

                  “I’m preparing for the game in Chicago, a scout is sitting a couple of seats down to me,” Winderman said on the Big O Show. “And he turns around to me — we’re talking about a couple Heat players — and he goes, ‘Whiteside, the kid has no motor,’ and O, that is the ultimate inditement [sic] you can give of a player in Hassan Whiteside’s role, that an outside team, a scout, a leading scout, believes you don’t have the motor to push through during a season."
                  It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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                  • charlesnba23 wrote: View Post
                    Looking at the options we have right now and seeing how well this group plays together, I think we better stand pat for the season. Thoughts?
                    Standing pat doesn't get us by Cleveland.

                    We need our 2004 Pistons moment, we need that trade that propels us to the chip.

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                    • Lupe wrote: View Post
                      Standing pat doesn't get us by Cleveland.

                      We need our 2004 Pistons moment, we need that trade that propels us to the chip.
                      Sullinger is our Rasheed Wallace

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                      • Lupe wrote: View Post
                        Standing pat doesn't get us by Cleveland.

                        We need our 2004 Pistons moment, we need that trade that propels us to the chip.
                        I think if Carroll and Ppat and Tross make the treys they make against clubs we are right there toe to toe with the Lebrons.

                        Problem is.. just like Stockton and Malone had Jordan to contend with... the Raps have Lebron to overcome.
                        Hard to beat him...... damn straight......... but not impossible.

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                        • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
                          I think if Carroll and Ppat and Tross make the treys they make against clubs we are right there toe to toe with the Lebrons.

                          Problem is.. just like Stockton and Malone had Jordan to contend with... the Raps have Lebron to overcome.
                          Hard to beat him...... damn straight......... but not impossible.
                          Unless you're of the mind that the NBA wouldn't allow it....many people are..
                          It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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                          • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
                            I think if Carroll and Ppat and Tross make the treys they make against clubs we are right there toe to toe with the Lebrons.

                            Problem is.. just like Stockton and Malone had Jordan to contend with... the Raps have Lebron to overcome.
                            Hard to beat him...... damn straight......... but not impossible.
                            No way you can beat them without JV giving you 20 and 12 ... PPat is just no consistent enough and even if plays well, he is good for the bench. So basically, we don't have a reliable PF and hence JV has to step up.

                            For us to beat them, it is all on JV.

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                            • Mess wrote: View Post
                              I would like to see DanH make a case for his claim of Whiteside being "elite" on defense. I know he's looking deeper than counting stats like blocks and rebounds but I don't know how clearly that would pan out.
                              As ever, impossible to be truly confident in any proclamation defensively without watching every game (and even then...).

                              But Whiteside was certainly elite in the stats we have last season. He led the league in BLK%. He had a great DFG% at the rim (he was among that small group of elite players for whom the stat is actually seemingly descriptive and not noise as an outlier at the bottom end). His DBPM and DRPM were great. He seems to have taken a step back this year, but his offensive role may have increased enough to drive down his defensive performance (a phenomenon observed often enough that it seems likely), and issue he wouldn't have here.

                              That said. I don't think I'd be willing to pay the price MIA would want for him - I think he would hurt the offence too much, and there's no sense in undercutting our own elite strengths to improve areas of weakness if there's no guarantee said weakness would become an elite strength.
                              twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                              • McRealistic wrote: View Post
                                No way you can beat them without JV giving you 20 and 12 ... PPat is just no consistent enough and even if plays well, he is good for the bench. So basically, we don't have a reliable PF and hence JV has to step up.

                                For us to beat them, it is all on JV.
                                So, jv averages 9 shots a game, 8 for his career. I'm no analytic wonder, perhaps DanH or Barolt can assist me on this..

                                Can jv shoot 110%?
                                It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

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