Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Everything Trade Chatter

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • KeonClark wrote: View Post
    I would like it. In carrying raptor tradition, we had 2 Williams, then we had 2 Johnsons. I think we need 2 Powells.

    #makemeGM
    Sometimes, 2 of something is an overkill.
    Whats wrong with having just 1 (but good) Johnson?

    Comment


    • Scraptor wrote: View Post
      You still don't move JV for capspace unless you're getting picks back in return. If Dallas wants to give us their unprotected first this year, we have to give it serious thought, but that wasn't the proposal.

      Besides, and Dan can correct me if I'm wrong, the cap hold on Lowry will still keep us from signing a max deal even if we dump JV and renounce Patterson. Not to mention our luck in free agency is generally garbage; think of all the names bandied about the last couple years and we've ended up with Carroll and Sullinger.

      This reminds me of when people were arguing we should let DeMar go for nothing... We can't afford to dump value for the purpose of fit. We need to achieve dual objectives: fit AND value.
      I haven't looked at the new CBA. I think if you traded jv for bogut + 1st, if bogut and Pat/Sully walk, pick up fvv and norm you are 90m with Lowry's hold (15.6m). I think in the new CBA you have to resign your guys first? You're over then for sure. Dan will know for sure.
      Jv is not a salary dump. Carroll is still effective but closest we got to a dump.
      I entertained the idea of jv for bogut + a protected 1st. Unprotected is a whole other conversation. The 1st overall pick definitely makes us first call for millsap or boogie. No way Dallas does that. 2018 top 5 protected, maybe if they like jv. Best case. Imo

      Comment


      • Long story short - with increased cap holds, there is basically no way to generate max cap room and keep Lowry, unless you shred the team, essentially. Trading players for cap relief would be a way to dodge the tax, not to be able to chase a free agent.
        twitter.com/dhackett1565

        Comment


        • DanH wrote: View Post
          Long story short - with increased cap holds, there is basically no way to generate max cap room and keep Lowry, unless you shred the team, essentially. Trading players for cap relief would be a way to dodge the tax, not to be able to chase a free agent.
          I think dodging the tax is still something this ownership group would like to see, at all costs, despite what the public message has been. I'll believe the deep pockets are finally open when I see it.
          Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

          Comment


          • jimmie wrote: View Post
            I think dodging the tax is still something this ownership group would like to see, at all costs, despite what the public message has been. I'll believe the deep pockets are finally open when I see it.
            Fair enough imo. MLSE seems like a huge thing, but we don't really know if owners are actually ready to spend big $$. We'll know soon enough

            Comment


            • I think we should give MLSE the benefit of the doubt, if the ballin practice facility/ibm watson + toronto fc signings + lou lamareillo/Babcock getting paid like rock stars etc means anything. They've already proven that they want to be first class in all 3 sports..
              It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

              Comment


              • jimmie wrote: View Post
                I think dodging the tax is still something this ownership group would like to see, at all costs, despite what the public message has been. I'll believe the deep pockets are finally open when I see it.
                I understand that opinion. I don't understand why any fan would advocate for trades to chase that goal.
                twitter.com/dhackett1565

                Comment


                • DanH wrote: View Post
                  I understand that opinion. I don't understand why any fan would advocate for trades to chase that goal.
                  I don't think anyone is advocating for trades solely for cap relief. Cap relief is one aspect/'additional value coming back' of one single trade that was proposed.
                  Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

                  Comment


                  • jimmie wrote: View Post
                    I don't think anyone is advocating for trades solely for cap relief. Cap relief is one aspect/'additional value coming back' of one single trade that was proposed.
                    As far as I could tell, it was the only real value coming back, since the talent downgrade was significant.
                    twitter.com/dhackett1565

                    Comment


                    • KeonClark wrote: View Post
                      I think we should give MLSE the benefit of the doubt, if the ballin practice facility/ibm watson + toronto fc signings + lou lamareillo/Babcock getting paid like rock stars etc means anything. They've already proven that they want to be first class in all 3 sports..
                      I'm sure they quite enjoyed the three bonus rounds of playoff gate income, tv broadcasts and merchandise sales.

                      Though maybe they don't want the team to be too good - a sweep is only 2 home games, why not stretch it to 4 each round!
                      Two beer away from being two beers away.

                      Comment


                      • DanH wrote: View Post
                        As far as I could tell, it was the only real value coming back, since the talent downgrade was significant.
                        The #1 overall pick has more value than jv, so much so the Dallas would never do that.

                        Comment


                        • lewro wrote: View Post
                          The #1 overall pick has more value than jv, so much so the Dallas would never do that.
                          OakTree didn't have the #1 pick in his hypothetical trade proposal. It was JV for Powell + an expiring contract.

                          Comment


                          • planetmars wrote: View Post
                            OakTree didn't have the #1 pick in his hypothetical trade proposal. It was JV for Powell + an expiring contract.
                            scraptor discussed dallas unprotected. i have discussed protected a few times in the recent past. i did not agree with oak tree earlier in the thread.

                            Comment


                            • lewro wrote: View Post
                              scraptor discussed dallas unprotected. i have discussed protected a few times in the recent past. i did not agree with oak tree earlier in the thread.
                              And as you said, there is no scenario where a team trades an unprotected high lotto pick for JV. And a protected one (ie late lotto at best) would not be enough to make such an immediate downgrade and get no usable cap space out of it.
                              twitter.com/dhackett1565

                              Comment


                              • DanH wrote: View Post
                                And as you said, there is no scenario where a team trades an unprotected high lotto pick for JV. And a protected one (ie late lotto at best) would not be enough to make such an immediate downgrade and get no usable cap space out of it.
                                it depends on how much a team values jv. declining protection can become unprotected. there's value in that. there's also value in trading such a pick, that's why boston (via nets) has an advantage to get millsap or boogie over us. a three team deal could be negotiated between dallas or new orleans, for example, if they value jv. i certainly wouldn't want to build that way but a guy like cuban seems to want to be relevant every year. it's conceivable that he might want to grab a good point guard in the 2017 draft, jv as his centre with matthews, powell, anderson and roll the dice that is enough to get out of the lottery and build from there (so best case the pick is 2017, 1-5, 2018 1-3, 2019 unprotected). or that new orleans is desperate to get a center next to AD and thinks jv is a good fit. i dont think it is a good idea but it's conceivable that dell demps wants to keep AD there and save his job. we've seen hennigan roll the dice to save his job in orlando. these are hypotheticals with no intel on what front offices are thinking and likely no bearing on reality. however, i wouldnt have guessed the hennigan would do the ibaka deal either for that price.
                                you and i dont see the same value in jv on this team and it seems in the league as well. i will change my view if and when his role increases, he plays better (particularly on defense), or the league trend changes. downgrade depends on available replacement and what happens with the pick. it might facilitate a trade for millsap or it might change our window away from lowry if it seems we just cant get past lebron. a jv trade like that could happen next yr if he doesnt pan out by the end of the year, for example.
                                you consider an absolute downgrade but there are multiple scenarios and variables. there is a small likelihood that this happens but its for arguments sake. just like trading gay had an unexpected outcome that even the professionals did not anticipate. its dangerous to deal in absolutes. just like saying that if norm needs mins that he will get them in the dleague. that didnt happen, nor should it. can you imagine sending norm down? obviously you did but i never could. i dont absolutely believe that jv or his role cant change, i just dont see any indication based on his career or caseys decision making.
                                i never agreed with the salary dump and i said as much earlier.
                                note: 2017 draft is loaded with pgs but 2018 is loaded with forwards.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X