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  • Dr Hannibal Lecter wrote: View Post
    I wish their was a player like Charles Oakley around, his the kind player they need 2 smack the sense in this team...Team is very soft interior, bad rebounding..lazy pick an roll defending, especially JV..if their is a guy that needs 2 b moved..sooner than later, it's him..they won't win with him..
    We had a Charles Oakley type player last year but we just let him walk away in the offseason smh.
    Mamba Mentality

    Comment


    • Mapko wrote: View Post
      Could this (decreased rebounding & blocks) be the result of "Stretch 4"?
      Eg: If guarding say Ryan Anderson (likely around 3 pt line):
      -How are you going to get a RB if he misses while 20ft away from basket?
      -If Ibaka is setting around 3 pt line & another team-mate shoots, he is kind of out of rebounding range.
      -If they swing the ball inside -how do you get a chance at a block?

      I get what most people are saying: We would rather have Millsap over Ibaka & yes if need to pay Millsap max rather than say 20-25 for Ibaka.
      2 Slight problems/obstacles:
      *Millsap may not even be available considering how much better Atl has been playing;
      *If Atl makes him available, it would be at a much much higher cost (if for no other reason, Atl can afford to bluff & hold out. Worse case scenario, no trade for PM, they go to playoffs then MAYBE Millsap resigns. Orlando has no such illusions -no playoffs & slim to no chance of resigning Ibaka).

      As the result of this bottom line is: If we go for Millsap -its an all in proposition. Lot more assets to acquire & pretty much must offer max to keep. With Ibaka, cost a lot less (according to rumours) and still have assets for another deal.
      Personally, I too would slightly prefer Millsap, everything being equal or close to, but it is not.
      This. Ibaka is not a star player. But he will do what you want him to do.

      In OKC, there was not really a huge force inside besides him, and they definitely didnt need him to shoot 3s.

      In Orlando, complete opposite.

      He would fit greaaatly here... I'm sure of it. In fact, I'm probably the only one around here that would rather have him than Millsap.

      Comment


      • Scraptor wrote: View Post
        It's also an issue. I think the difference is twofold:

        1. Millsap is a proven star who can create his own offense to a greater extent than Ibaka. 51% of Ibaka's shots are catch-and-shoot, vs 32% for Millsap. 55% of Ibaka's shots are open vs 46% for Millsap. You can give the ball to Millsap in the post and he can make something happen.

        2. Millsap's game is more built on BBIQ than athleticism, vs Ibaka who has been more of an athletic freak. You can expect Millsap to age more like a David West with Indiana, whereas Ibaka's decline could be more severe/unpredictable.

        So despite Millsap being older, people are willing to bet on the more certain thing, because they'll both get paid huge.

        Neither is a perfect solution though. There may not be a perfect solution, we have to make the best of what's available.
        36 year old West making 1.5 mil is a hell of a player/deal;
        36 (& 37) year old Millsap making 30 mil could cripple us.

        Comment


        • TRex wrote: View Post
          We had a Charles Oakley type player last year but we just let him walk away in the offseason smh.
          We didn't have his bird rights so not sure what you wanted the raps to do. Also that 72 million contract is looking terrible since he doesn't fit with the magic.

          Comment


          • charlesnba23 wrote: View Post
            This. Ibaka is not a star player. But he will do what you want him to do.

            In OKC, there was not really a huge force inside besides him, and they definitely didnt need him to shoot 3s.

            In Orlando, complete opposite.


            He would fit greaaatly here... I'm sure of it. In fact, I'm probably the only one around here that would rather have him than Millsap.
            I agree (see bold). Who was OKC 5 at the time? Perk & young Adams (both for at least a few years). Enough said.
            This might help a bit (not a huge difference, age notwithstanding. Age will be more of a factor if are planning of resigning either player next year)

            http://www.landofbasketball.com/play...ul_millsap.htm

            Again, it appears that cost of acquiring Ibaka would be substantially less, thus allowing us to assess situation at the end of year, and if necessary let him walk (if say get blown out by Cavs again, dont even make it to ECF, poor chemistry...).
            With 32 year old Millsap (if we get him) -I'm afraid we've crossed Rubicon. The fact that at age 36 & 37 (years 4 &5 of potential max contract) he might be making 30 mil is ridiculous (regardless of high BBIQ etc).

            Comment


            • Mapko wrote: View Post
              I agree (see bold). Who was OKC 5 at the time? Perk & young Adams (both for at least a few years). Enough said.
              This might help a bit (not a huge difference, age notwithstanding. Age will be more of a factor if are planning of resigning either player next year)

              http://www.landofbasketball.com/play...ul_millsap.htm

              Again, it appears that cost of acquiring Ibaka would be substantially less, thus allowing us to assess situation at the end of year, and if necessary let him walk (if say get blown out by Cavs again, dont even make it to ECF, poor chemistry...).
              With 32 year old Millsap (if we get him) -I'm afraid we've crossed Rubicon. The fact that at age 36 & 37 (years 4 &5 of potential max contract) he might be making 30 mil is ridiculous (regardless of high BBIQ etc).
              ...and you actually believe Serge is only 27??? LMAO!!

              Comment


              • Well looks like Sap may be officially off the market....good thing Ross + Patterson will help carry us to the Promised land Masai.

                http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...-Deadline-Move

                Comment


                • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
                  ...and you actually believe Serge is only 27??? LMAO!!
                  How old do you think he is? 32?
                  OK. I agree it might be somewhat difficult to gauge weather Ibaka is 27 or 32 (or in between) NOW.
                  But, he was drafted in 2008 as an 19 year old (according to him & his agent). I find it unlikely that somebody could not figure out he was 24 then (rather than 19). There usually is a noticeable difference between a 19 yr old and a 24 yr old in physical look, attitude, mentality, physical strength...
                  Where is Masai from? One would think he has some contacts all over that could help him confirm/verify this.
                  Besides, Ibaka is auditioning with us (and rest of NBA) for new contract. If MU does not like what he sees, let him go. Cost to get him would be significantly lower than last year & he definitely (IMO) would give us a solid chance to at least go to 2nd round or ECF.

                  Comment


                  • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
                    Well looks like Sap may be officially off the market....good thing Ross + Patterson will help carry us to the Promised land Masai.

                    http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...-Deadline-Move
                    Again, I don't think we can conclude the Raptors rejected a Millsap trade. The Windhorst quote you posted is as follows:

                    Brian Windhorst on a potential Paul Millsap trade to Toronto: “I was talking to an executive just yesterday about a potential Toronto-Atlanta trade and he was like, ‘If they can get two assets out of it, then Atlanta would have done a good job.’ The two assets are Patrick Patterson and Terrence Ross.”

                    He was talking to a guy that gave his opinion. Perhaps I've missed something but I don't think we can jump over Masai for rejecting a Millsap trade based on a Hoopshype article that quotes a guy quoting a guy providing his opinion on what would be a good job for Atlanta.
                    Last edited by Rudy Bargnani; Thu Feb 9, 2017, 09:22 PM.

                    Comment


                    • JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
                      Well looks like Sap may be officially off the market....good thing Ross + Patterson will help carry us to the Promised land Masai.

                      http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap...-Deadline-Move
                      Guh? How is it Masai Ujiri's fault that the Hawks don't want to trade Paul Milsap?

                      Good grief.

                      Comment


                      • I think the Raps should be looking at a guy like Ersan Ilyasova on the Sixers to fill the starting PF spot. HIgh IQ player who can do a bit of everything at an above average level (shoot, drive, pass, defend), including stretch the floor. Solid veteran player. Alot like a younger, more mobile version of Luis Scola. He is expiring and will probably leave in free agency. Philly has a loaded front court and his age (29) doesn't align with their core.

                        CoJo for Ilyasova works perfectly as a salary match and frees up minutes for Delon Wright and FVV.

                        Comment


                        • golden wrote: View Post
                          I think the Raps should be looking at a guy like Ersan Ilyasova on the Sixers to fill the starting PF spot. HIgh IQ player who can do a bit of everything at an above average level (shoot, drive, pass, defend), including stretch the floor. Solid veteran player. Alot like a younger, more mobile version of Luis Scola. He is expiring and will probably leave in free agency. Philly has a loaded front court and his age (29) doesn't align with their core.

                          CoJo for Ilyasova works perfectly as a salary match and frees up minutes for Delon Wright and FVV.
                          Meh, I'd rather just roll with Pat if that's the sort of target. Siakam is fine as a backup PF, plus you can fill minutes with a BeBe-JV frontcourt when needed.

                          Either aim big, or don't bother, IMO.
                          twitter.com/dhackett1565

                          Comment


                          • Yeah. Go and get IBAKA.

                            Comment


                            • http://www.tsn.ca/talent/raps-have-b...dline-1.668176

                              Highlights:

                              "On draft night they were in hot pursuit of Serge Ibaka, but Oklahoma City's asking price was too high and, to their surprise, someone else (Orlando) was willing to pay it.
                              When free agency opened, they enlisted the help of Dwane Casey, Kyle Lowry and DeMar DeRozan to recruit two-time NBA champion Pau Gasol. Just as they believed to have sold him on Toronto and were ready to dump Terrence Ross' contract in a trade to make it happen, Tim Duncan announced his retirement and Gregg Popovich came calling.
                              Weeks later, a trade for Chicago's Taj Gibson and Tony Snell fell through as the Bulls landed Dwyane Wade. Their big coup nearly came when - according to ESPN's Brian Windhorst - they made a strong play for Hawks forward and three-time All-Star Paul Millsap.
                              ...
                              As the deadline approaches, the Raptors figure to be one of the league's most active teams, at least in terms of discussion. They have the means (moveable contracts, young players and picks) and the motive to get something done but, once again, the market will dictate whether their roster looks any different on the 24th.
                              ...
                              Millsap - the archetype of his ideal power forward - has topped Ujiri's' wish list for years, but after shopping him early last month the Hawks have reportedly pulled him off the market in the hopes of competing for a top-4 seed. Of the names rumoured to be out there, at least a couple should get Toronto's attention.
                              All but out of it in the East, the Magic are said to be listening to offers for Ibaka, who will hit unrestricted free agency this coming off-season. Given their interest in him last summer, it's reasonable to assume the Raptors will at least do a price check on the 27-year-old forward. It's unclear what Orlando may be looking for in return, but recouping the cost they paid (Victor Oladipo, Domantas Sabonis and Ersan Ilyasova) seems unlikely with his contract about to expire.
                              In other words, if you're Ujiri, Weltman and company there's more that goes into this decision than simply 'do we give up A, B and/or C for Ibaka?'.
                              How confident are they that Ibaka would be willing to re-sign in Toronto this summer? Is the potential reward (a three-month rental) worth the risk of losing him for nothing? And, if he were to stay, do they have the commitment from ownership to go deep into the luxury tax to pay him and free agent-to-be Lowry at least $60 million annually?
                              ...
                              erhaps a safer bet might be Nuggets combo forward Wilson Chandler, another player they've looked at in the past and one that is hoping for a change of scenery. Chandler, 29, could address Toronto's needs at both the three and four positions while giving them some added size, toughness and experience in the front court. He's averaging a career-best 15.6 points and 6.8 rebounds with Denver in this, his ninth NBA season. He's locked up for next season, with a player option for 2018-19.
                              Ibaka and Chandler each make between $11-12 million so the Raptors would have to send out at least $9 million in salary to acquire either. Toronto's most expendable players, given their contracts, value and the team's depth at their positions are probably Ross ($10 million) and Cory Joseph ($7.3 million). They've also got a collection of young players to sweeten any offer (Delon Wright, Lucas Nogueira, Jakob Poeltl, Pascal Siakam and - if the return is big enough - Norman Powell) in addition to two late first-round picks in the upcoming draft (their own and the Clippers', via Milwaukee).
                              If nothing else, the next two weeks should be telling. On the court, the Raptors aim to fix their broken defence and reestablish themselves as an Eastern Conference power. Off it, they'll have a decision to make, one that could go a long way in determining their fate - both in the present and future."
                              "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

                              Comment


                              • My wishlist:

                                1. Wilson Chandler
                                or
                                2. Millsap
                                or
                                3. Ibaka

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