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How do we fix our defense?

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  • How do we fix our defense?

    Axel wrote: View Post
    I think the problem that some are trying to come to accept is that no one player or position is the cause of our defensive problems. People want an easy solution and Biyombo leaving and JVs play are the perfect scapegoats, and some are determined to go down that rabbit hole no matter what.

    The defensive issues are across the board and may include the very system. No easy fix to be found.
    I think if you read my arguments than you may see that I am saying this as well.
    All acquisitions are rabbit holes, so is speculation on internal growth. Just like Alice, some make you bigger or smaller, advantages or disadvantages. None of it is easy.
    I've said this before, I'm probably 90% sure that the raps don't trade for noel. I have 0 evidence it will improve their team. I think "some" (I honestly don't know if this is you?) are so attached to certain players (understandably) that they instinctively reject the idea that the player might be traded or reduced in role, etc. For me, it's just an exercise and fantasy around something that I have no control over. It's harmless. I think it's fun to imagine and speculate. That's all. If raps are seriously rumoured around boogie, I will do the same.
    Last edited by Axel; Fri Nov 25, 2016, 01:18 PM.

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    • lewro wrote: View Post
      Didn't Kyrie look amazing vs gsw in the finals!? He's not a big game player? What game is bigger!? Demar and Kyle haven't looked big game in many of our series. They got swept twice. I still think they can be big game players. You don't Kyrie is that?
      The cavs look even better this yr.
      Heres a hypothetical for you to consider...
      Kyle Lowry is with Cleveland and Kyrie Irving is with the Raps...

      Does Cleveland have as a good a chance as they did with Irving to win the NBA championship ?

      Do the Raptors get to the ECF last year with Irivng running the point ... are they even a 50 win team ?

      No doubt Irving has tremendous skills.. but the best of the lot is to be on the same team as one Lebron James.

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      • You can disparage Kyrie and Cleveland all you want, doesn't change the fact that they're better than last season.
        Two beer away from being two beers away.

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        • Axel wrote: View Post
          So 90% of the roster is unfixable and it's only the C position that can be remedied by a trade? I find that hard to believe but that is what it appears to be based on the trade talks I've seen.

          My point is that the problems are much more layered and complex than the solutions being presented seem to address.
          LOL. That's not all what's being suggested. There are 2 guys who are HIGHLY unlikely to be moved to improve this team in the short term and they represent the skill that we are weakest at, across the board: keeping people in front so that you minimize your reliance on a 5 who isn't well-suited to watching your back. If Masai trades either Lowry or Derozan, it suggests a complete rebuild (hopefully around JV...) -- but we can all admit that's as likely as Toronto trading for Anthony Davis.

          You missed the point. Or more likely ignored it so you could yet again take a cut at someone who has different ideas.
          Definition of Statistics: The science of producing unreliable facts from reliable figures.

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          • Mess wrote: View Post
            You can disparage Kyrie and Cleveland all you want, doesn't change the fact that they're better than last season.
            It was written simply as a hypothetical... judging by your response putting out that its a "disparagement" of Irving one might take it that your possibly leaning towards the notion that Cleveland does as well and the Raptors might not.... in the hypothetical.

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            • jimmie wrote: View Post
              LOL. That's not all what's being suggested. There are 2 guys who are HIGHLY unlikely to be moved to improve this team in the short term and they represent the skill that we are weakest at, across the board: keeping people in front so that you minimize your reliance on a 5 who isn't well-suited to watching your back. If Masai trades either Lowry or Derozan, it suggests a complete rebuild (hopefully around JV...) -- but we can all admit that's as likely as Toronto trading for Anthony Davis.

              You missed the point. Or more likely ignored it so you could yet again take a cut at someone who has different ideas.
              I'm not taking a cut at anyone, can you honestly say the same thing? Your attempts to get a dig in at me are completely pointless to the thread.

              Perimeter defence goes beyond just Kyle and Demar but even they can make adjustments. Perhaps it's changing our angles on PnR defence. Perhaps it's related to helping out more on the glass.

              Or perhaps it is a trade, or a change in the rotation (more Powell won't hurt our perimeter defence). Or it could be a combination of many little things that actually makes the difference. But again, most of the "solutions" I've seen are entirely related to trading for a C that covers up other problems better; and I don't think that is really a solution.
              Heir, Prince of Cambridge

              If you see KeonClark in the wasteland, please share your food and water with him.

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              • jimmie wrote: View Post
                LOL. That's not all what's being suggested. There are 2 guys who are HIGHLY unlikely to be moved to improve this team in the short term and they represent the skill that we are weakest at, across the board: keeping people in front so that you minimize your reliance on a 5 who isn't well-suited to watching your back. If Masai trades either Lowry or Derozan, it suggests a complete rebuild (hopefully around JV...) -- but we can all admit that's as likely as Toronto trading for Anthony Davis.

                You missed the point. Or more likely ignored it so you could yet again take a cut at someone who has different ideas.
                Yeah have to agree.... Pretty much have to believe after backing up a brinks truck full of money for DD and giving out a 5 year term that the GM is very unlikely to change his mind about a major personal and financial commitment he made less than 6 months ago.

                With Kyle being in a contract/player option year not sure the GM could get FMV for him if something were to actually bubble up to solve a defensive issue. Also think that it being a contract year you would likely get the best out of Kyle this year. Those two thoughts would probably preclude a trade of him from my front row seat in the peanut gallery.

                Which leaves....

                The usual suspects ... JV and Ross and CoJo and Ppat... in the never ending good natured discussion on trading for the holy grail of a rim protector... a lock down perimeter defender.... or the most elusive of targets the bona fide stretch 4.

                Everyone has an opinion... we'll be talking on this one forever..
                Last edited by Demographic Shift; Fri Nov 25, 2016, 04:58 PM.

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                • Personally I would wait to see how Sully looks before making a trade. Even though a front court of Sully/Jv/Noel sounds great for a playoffs run.

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                  @Chr1st1anL

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                  • jimmie wrote: View Post
                    LOL. That's not all what's being suggested. There are 2 guys who are HIGHLY unlikely to be moved to improve this team in the short term and they represent the skill that we are weakest at, across the board: keeping people in front so that you minimize your reliance on a 5 who isn't well-suited to watching your back. If Masai trades either Lowry or Derozan, it suggests a complete rebuild (hopefully around JV...) -- but we can all admit that's as likely as Toronto trading for Anthony Davis.

                    You missed the point. Or more likely ignored it so you could yet again take a cut at someone who has different ideas.

                    Beautiful Post ... I don't know how people don't get this ... It is very simple ...

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                    • I think Sully will help the D when he gets back. JV/Sully frontcourt will dominate the defensive glass. Less second chance points for the opponent. He's a smart player. Always knows where to be. It's kind of how lowry makes up for his lack of athleticism at his own position.

                      Also a have feeling that a Sully/2pat frontcourt is going to be very good on both ends. Two smart defenders.

                      The team is really high on the rookies and this is good development time for them. Once Sully gets back the will both be out of the rotation.

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                      • Players seem to be echoing some of the thoughts in this thread. Shows that discussion is rooted in some level of fact if guys like CoJo are pointing out that things went a lot smoother defensively with Biz in there.

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                        • Yes our D was entirely dependent on a one dimensional player who played less than half a game.

                          I still dont get it...how much did Charlotte's D suffer with Biz gone? Not one bit. Their defensive coach hated playing Biz because of how bad he could be beyond his shotblocking. And they had/have arguably the worst group of bigs defensively in the league after they lost Biz.

                          I don't get how people don't understand that for your D to be good, all 5 guys need to be responsible. If guys think they can relax/gamble because they have a shotblocker behind them, they're not doing their part. And if they are not doing their part it doesn't matter who you have back there you'll get exposed, especially in the playoffs.

                          *oh and your coaches need to preach principles that make sense. I dont know if players are being told to do this, but if i see us go above the screen on a non-shooter again i may break down and cry. Last game was the perfect example as we did so against Giannis a ton especially early on. It made no sense at all.

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                          Last edited by white men can't jump; Sat Nov 26, 2016, 12:43 PM.

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                          • Lupe wrote: View Post
                            Players seem to be echoing some of the thoughts in this thread. Shows that discussion is rooted in some level of fact if guys like CoJo are pointing out that things went a lot smoother defensively with Biz in there.
                            Biz is a very good rim protector - true. Had 2.6 blocks per 36 last year and is at 2.4 this year. career high 2.9.

                            Nerlens last year 1.8 per 36, though to be fair, it was 2.1 when he played as the primary centre. 2.2 per 36 the year before.

                            Bebe is now at 3.7 blocks per 36. Only Joel Embiid has played more minutes than Bebe with a higher block rate.
                            If we knew half as much about coaching an NBA team as we think, we"d know twice as much as we do.

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                            • Not entirely dependent just that he had a big impact.

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                              • Not just shot blocking. Great in PnR situations as well.

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