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Who has been the 3rd best Raptor?

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  • lewro
    replied
    There's a way, Brooklyn. Near max starts to push it toward $60m

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  • JamesNaismith
    replied
    lewro wrote: View Post
    Norm is my favourite player outside of Lowry but the $ makes me consider to trade him. If he gets more mins and reaches his potential then I can see him getting max or near max offer from a Brooklyn type team. That's like $60m at SG. Delon is coming back too. I'd like to see delon or cory traded for forward and norm turned into Westbrook lite. That could really extend the Lowry window and give Ross some mins at SF.
    Even with increased minutes in the rotation (which is very likely in a year) there's no way imo someone will give him a max contract. He simply won't get enough minutes or touches to show that. But I won't be surprised if he blows up ala Biz. I would trade Ross or Carroll with something if need be because I think he would be taking DD's spot eventually and I really believe he could eventually become a leader of the team. He has a real impact on how we play.

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  • lewro
    replied
    3inthekeon wrote: View Post
    He's going to be restricted - no extension(as we've mentioned multiple times) He's not going to be cheap unless he turns into a dud.
    Norm is my favourite player outside of Lowry but the $ makes me consider to trade him. If he gets more mins and reaches his potential then I can see him getting max or near max offer from a Brooklyn type team. That's like $60m at SG. Delon is coming back too. I'd like to see delon or cory traded for forward and norm turned into Westbrook lite. That could really extend the Lowry window and give Ross some mins at SF.

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  • white men can't jump
    replied
    Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Your entiltled to your opinion. JV depends too much on match ups. One day he is 3rd option next game he cant stay on the court because of defense.

    Ross gives you consistent 10 points and good d. When he is on your looking at 25+ night. He gets it with in the offense. For JV to put up big numbers we have to slow the game down and force fed him the ball.

    Also JV is in that same tier as Ross, 2pat,

    Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
    We have pretty much never force fed JV the ball and he's put up big numbers despite that, so I don't know where that's coming from.

    We also aren't a fast team and aren't suited to trying to be. We have the athleticism to run off our D when we can, but we don't have players that excel when they get sped up.

    JV doesn't depend on match ups, he's just an afterthought in our gameplanning. How much better would we have been in the playoffs last year if JV was actually accustomed to heavier usage? He carried us while still being ignored some nights. And on those nights his impact was still felt by his mere presence, where he could collapse the D just by rolling through the paint, and attracted double/triple teams even just on rebounds, which gives an opportunity for others to crash the glass and makes it very hard for the other team to run.

    These are things that depend on playing him and using him enough for the other team to be forced to adjust to him. If you do it right, match ups become the opponent's problem.

    Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

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  • 3inthekeon
    replied
    JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
    I was mostly saying it tongue n cheek. I know he hasn't proven it but I do believe that it's simply because he doesn't get consistent minutes. But I really do believe he is the 3rd best player on the roster but just needs the minutes to prove it. Of course I don't expect him to get those minutes and won't until probably a year from now or so when we sign him to a cheap extension then he'll get his just due. For now I'd say the 3rd best would be between Carroll or Ross.
    He's going to be restricted - no extension(as we've mentioned multiple times) He's not going to be cheap unless he turns into a dud.

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  • Chr1s1anL
    replied
    white men can't jump wrote: View Post
    Your 3rd best player can't be a "when he's on" guy. Partly because that could be true of anybody "when they're on". If Joseph our 3rd best player because if he scored 20 pts it'd be hard for us to lose?

    Your best players are consistent, and often capable of contributing in ways beyond scoring to impact the game.

    Other than the rough patch JV has had after tweaking his ankle, he's been consistent and contributes beyond scoring. I don't see anyone who was shitting on him for his bad D the last couple of weeks coming out to support him after last night where he was solid to excellent on D on cleaned up on the glass.

    The next tier is Pat, Cojo and Ross. And Ross and Pat have been the best there so far this year. And if anyone can be argued as 3rd best there it's Pat, but his case is helped by how shallow we are at PF.

    Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
    Your entiltled to your opinion. JV depends too much on match ups. One day he is 3rd option next game he cant stay on the court because of defense.

    Ross gives you consistent 10 points and good d. When he is on your looking at 25+ night. He gets it with in the offense. For JV to put up big numbers we have to slow the game down and force fed him the ball.

    Also JV is in that same tier as Ross, 2pat,

    Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
    Last edited by Chr1s1anL; Tue Dec 13, 2016, 01:06 PM.

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  • Just Is
    replied
    JamesNaismith wrote: View Post
    I was mostly saying it tongue n cheek. I know he hasn't proven it but I do believe that it's simply because he doesn't get consistent minutes. But I really do believe he is the 3rd best player on the roster but just needs the minutes to prove it. Of course I don't expect him to get those minutes and won't until probably a year from now or so when we sign him to a cheap extension then he'll get his just due. For now I'd say the 3rd best would be between Carroll or Ross.
    Carroll is a surprise pick.

    Granted; I don't think he's ever been 100% since he's put on a Raptors uniform (I'd be hazard to say even 90%) but I don't think I could personally put him any higher than 7th at the very most. After Lowry, Demar, JV, Ross, Patterson, and CoJo. I'd even lean towards putting Powell and Bebe above him as well.

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  • JamesNaismith
    replied
    iblastoff wrote: View Post
    powell has been sweet. but hes also played the 5th least minutes on the entire roster. saying hes 3rd best raptor is like saying bebe is the BEST on the team because in a bubble, his stats are insane.
    I was mostly saying it tongue n cheek. I know he hasn't proven it but I do believe that it's simply because he doesn't get consistent minutes. But I really do believe he is the 3rd best player on the roster but just needs the minutes to prove it. Of course I don't expect him to get those minutes and won't until probably a year from now or so when we sign him to a cheap extension then he'll get his just due. For now I'd say the 3rd best would be between Carroll or Ross.

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  • lewro
    replied
    Siakam can just be a blood bag to pat like mad Max, tether a tube the length of the court.

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  • JawsGT
    replied
    I'd put Patterson and maybe even Ross ahead of JV. JV can do more. He can still beast like he did in the playoffs without requiring more touches or a higher usage. Plus he has been inconsistent and has had matchup issues. If he had the energy, you could easily play Pat for 48 min and we would be better off for it. He makes every lineup he is in better on both ends of the floor. He can impact a game without filling the stat sheet. Super versatile and ultimate utility player. Ross has been our most consistent shooter, one of the top 3pt shooters in the league and provides a much needed scoring punch off the bench. He is the closest thing we have to a 3rd banana so to speak.

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  • lewro
    replied
    There's 50 posts here now. Even IF this thread was a troll thread there has been a number of different and interesting responses imo. Enough to warrant a poll imo.
    I'm still choosing pat, no doubt, but that's maybe 25% of the fanbase it seems. Maybe 25% Ross and 50% jv?

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  • lewro
    replied
    I only saw parts of the game. I didn't see jv play. There's been a ton of recent discussion re jvs defense on the main site, particularly in the pods, columns, Twitter and comments. There's some in the forum but it's kinda explosive so that's something of a deterrent imo.
    Here's the advanced stats:

    http://stats.nba.com/game/#!/0021600...T_RATING&dir=1

    Having missed the game, I noticed bebe's dreb%, DRtg for jv, dd, DC and the pace for jv and siakam, amongst other notable stats. Mikeymoney posted the stats with some criticism of jv on the main site.
    Demar is fair game here too. I just don't talk about it bc Casey is ride or die in his usage/mins. He's had some debatable aspects to his game in recent weeks but I haven't seen much, if any, debate his #1-2 status.

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  • white men can't jump
    replied
    Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
    Last night was prime example why I think Ross has been the 3rd best raptor. When he is on this team is almost unbeatable.

    Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk
    Your 3rd best player can't be a "when he's on" guy. Partly because that could be true of anybody "when they're on". If Joseph our 3rd best player because if he scored 20 pts it'd be hard for us to lose?

    Your best players are consistent, and often capable of contributing in ways beyond scoring to impact the game.

    Other than the rough patch JV has had after tweaking his ankle, he's been consistent and contributes beyond scoring. I don't see anyone who was shitting on him for his bad D the last couple of weeks coming out to support him after last night where he was solid to excellent on D on cleaned up on the glass.

    The next tier is Pat, Cojo and Ross. And Ross and Pat have been the best there so far this year. And if anyone can be argued as 3rd best there it's Pat, but his case is helped by how shallow we are at PF.

    Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

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  • Chr1s1anL
    replied
    Last night was prime example why I think Ross has been the 3rd best raptor. When he is on this team is almost unbeatable.

    Sent from my LG-H831 using Tapatalk

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  • LJ2
    replied
    I'd say JV's been our 3rd best player. Kind of sucks for him that what the team is asking from him is to sacrifice parts of his game to focus on being what they need, a defensive anchor, but he's never complained about it. Without his rebounding I don't know where this team would be. Once his FG% gets back to career averages then there won't be any question.

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