Everything OG Anunoby

[golden]

It's almost impossible to know when the apex has or will occur. The sell high on derozan, for example, according to the forum at the time, was back when he was "overpaid" at 9 mil AAV. Had that strategy had been followed, no championship in TO.

Yeah, sure. Not disagreeing. There are many apex'es. But also so many alternate realities.

Like suppose you trade DD earlier for a FRP that becomes Giannis? Yes, championship(s).

[JawsGT]

Pascal and OG aren't going anywhere, the potential trades can only feature Fred and/or GTJr. They will look to build around Pascal, OG and Barnes, maybe Achiuwa if he can get healthy and further show what we have there.

The talk of "wait til a disgruntled star comes along" is the depth of fool's gold imo. It happened once in our history and not much more in any club's history. Waiting for too many stars to align is not a plan.

Well I'm all over the place recently, and I'm starting to settle in on what you're saying here. I don't think we've seen the best of pascal yet, and certainly not the best of OG. Nothing wrong with taking calls to see what teams are offering but it's gotta be a huge return to pull the trigger. Precious too, I like alot and am still intrigued by koloko. The rest can be replaced.

Although I think if they just move Fred as an off ball shooter primarily, it could fix some of the issues with the offence. But that just doesn't look like it's gonna happen.

[grindhouse]

I'm gonna be real for sec, if u think OG is the problem and his the solution of making this team better with trading him, your out of your f&%$$ mind.
Listen..u don't trade OG, u don't trade Barnes..u don't trade Siakim..period..
If you were trading them, why wouldnt have traded them for Kevin Durant this summer.. just stop it.

Best solution is retool, simple.
Nameless 23, G Money, Boucher, Flynn, Byrch, Banton..ect..gone..trades..
Sign a Center, get some shooters, bench players, veterans..2 complement your 3 cpres guys.. plus u never know what we get trades, draft and so on.

If u go the rebuild solution..than siakim is in play.. but I would not do that.. u need a guy thats won chip and a veteran, his been in the league long time..plus his not a bad player.

i agree with this only person i would add on your list is fred and take off banton. i really see banton in 3-5 years being a all str or close to it. we need a center and shooting guard badly. we have a lot of talent but basketball IQ along with chemistry is lacking.

[LJ2]

I think if you are going to consider OG or Siakam in a trade you do it at the draft when you can guarantee a top 5 pick + additional assets otherwise no. Even then you have to know that the scouting department has seen xyz thing in the asset incoming and that is where I would trust this front office the most with the scouting of players. It isn't a sunk cost fallacy that we are falling into with Siakam, or OG. Getting players of those calibers who are two way, who are that offensively skilled (in siakam) or elite defensively in OG, at that size is rare. OG plays a physical style that wears opponents down on both ends of the ball. That is a difficult thing to replace.

If you're trading OG or Siakam for a top 5 pick then you're punting on the current vet core. If that is the case then why wait until end of season for that when you can work on improving the positioning of your own FRP now?

[G__Deane]

Well I'm all over the place recently, and I'm starting to settle in on what you're saying here. I don't think we've seen the best of pascal yet, and certainly not the best of OG. Nothing wrong with taking calls to see what teams are offering but it's gotta be a huge return to pull the trigger. Precious too, I like alot and am still intrigued by koloko. The rest can be replaced.

Although I think if they just move Fred as an off ball shooter primarily, it could fix some of the issues with the offence. But that just doesn't look like it's gonna happen.

We keep hoping but I don't think Fred will ever see himself as anything but a 1B alpha and a top PG in the league.
It's a great mentality but doesn't mesh with his actual skill set. Love the guy but he's not what we need any more, not if it's true that Masai wants to win again and it's not all talk. He's exposed every playoff as you get set against better and better competition.

As it is right now, the Raps will not beat the Celtics, Bucks, Nets and would be lifeand death against the Sixers and Cavs.
That's in the first round .... there will be good teams in the play-in!

[LJ2]

It's easier to say Fred isn't what we need than to acquire a player that is, so we can replace him.

All of his detractors will say just hand over the offense to Scottie, but clearly he's not ready. Do you guys really think Pascal will want to resign with a team if this version of Scottie is the 2nd best player? Even OG as good as he has been can't play a two man game much less run an offense.

[G__Deane]

It's easier to say Fred isn't what we need than to acquire a player that is, so we can replace him.

All of his detractors will say just hand over the offense to Scottie, but clearly he's not ready. Do you guys really think Pascal will want to resign with a team if this version of Scottie is the 2nd best player? Even OG as good as he has been can't play a two man game much less run an offense.

There's no sure thing but I'd like to see how Scottie develops without Fred here and let Banton step into the backup PG role.
It might be one of those addition by subtraction or weird chemistry things that don't make complete sense on paper but just work out.
Plus, what are we getting back for Fred? can he bring a young player and a first rounder?
With Fred's money, what elite player can Masai finally attract here to play with Pascal???

What I don't want is running this all back out there again and being an OK team that finishes7th in the East and bows out in the play-in or first round for the next 4 years until Pascal is washed .....

[Primer]

It's easier to say Fred isn't what we need than to acquire a player that is, so we can replace him.

All of his detractors will say just hand over the offense to Scottie, but clearly he's not ready. Do you guys really think Pascal will want to resign with a team if this version of Scottie is the 2nd best player? Even OG as good as he has been can't play a two man game much less run an offense.

Fred for Lonzo Ball. Everybody wins.

[Kagemusha]

Pascal and Scottie works fine.
Keep OG.
And Precious.

The rest can be dealt.

I hope our perception of this team didn't change because of a win.
Against the Knicks.

[DanH]

The issue here is timing. The time you are "done being a good basketball team" does not always align to when you can extract the most from your assets..... for a myriad of reasons: age, contract, health, performance, etc... An important part of buying and selling is knowing when you are at the apex of a market bubble, and this is clearly one of those apex moments for Pascal & OG, which could even go higher in the off-season if OG wins DPOY and if Pascal makes All-NBA again. And Masai doesn't want to be just a "good basketball team". He wants championships and nothing less.

But you are right, it's moot anyway. Masai will not tank in front of our hometown fans (Tampa was a one-off). In the past he's been adamantly against tanking, so I guess they are trying to find a new path to build from the middle again. They will wait for another superstar to shake loose. We've done it before.

Until that superstar trade is available, Masai & Bobby will keep betting on Pascal, Fred & OG. History shows Masai always re-signs our own free agents that we want to keep. We all know that's what is going to happen.

I think the most fascinating aspect is when Masai has always done two different things that clash, and that's coming up soon. One of the core four likely have to go, because although it is possible they all squeeze under the tax there's no guarantee they can be re-signed for reasonable enough amounts to ensure that.

So, Masai always brings his guys back. And Masai does not pay the tax for a non-contending team.

Makes one at least wonder how he approaches this deadline. I still think the most obvious pieces to move to address that conflict as well as allow the team to stay good and bet on the vision they have in terms of roster building are Gary and Fred, but others are options too. I just have a hard time seeing OG or Pascal being the pieces they move - it would absolutely have to be a mind-blowing offer for them to think about it, and even then I'm not sure it's a sure thing because of their likely intent to build to win around those two (and Scottie, eventually). Also makes Fred a little less likely to move, but a robust market for him compared to Gary could shift that balance, I think, if the value returned is different enough, just because Fred's fit with that long term vision is less rock-solid than OG's or Pascal's.

[LJ2]

There's no sure thing but I'd like to see how Scottie develops without Fred here and let Banton step into the backup PG role.
It might be one of those addition by subtraction or weird chemistry things that don't make complete sense on paper but just work out.
Plus, what are we getting back for Fred? can he bring a young player and a first rounder?
With Fred's money, what elite player can Masai finally attract here to play with Pascal???

What I don't want is running this all back out there again and being an OK team that finishes7th in the East and bows out in the play-in or first round for the next 4 years until Pascal is washed .....

No sure thing indeed, but I would think for his confidence alone it would be better to bring Scottie along slowly. It's one thing if he was playing really well and was ready to take on more of a role...you could say Fred being the lead guard was holding him back at that point, but that hasn't been the case.

The mob are already starting to light the torches and get the pitchforks out with the way Scottie has been playing. Can you imagine what it would be like if Fred wasn't there to receive the brunt of the hate from Raptors fans? Scottie's confidence would be at an all time low.

[LJ2]

Fred for Lonzo Ball. Everybody wins.

Didn't they just surgically repair his knee? Hasn't event played a game this season and who knows if he'll be the same? At least we know what we have with Fred whose been the better player when both have been healthy.

[The Great One]

Fred for Lonzo Ball. Everybody wins.

Great. Let's trade for another injury prone player.

[G__Deane]

Great. Let's trade for another injury prone player.

Masai likes injury players but he's only 6'6 not tall enough for project 6'9

[Primer]

Didn't they just surgically repair his knee? Hasn't event played a game this season and who knows if he'll be the same? At least we know what we have with Fred whose been the better player when both have been healthy.

Yeah the injuries are a problem. Outside of that I just think he fits our team a lot better than Fred.

He doesn't need a lot of shots (11 FGA per game), he's an excellent 3PT shooter, he's a great passer, rebounds well, get lots of steals and is a good defender. He's also big enough to guard wings.

If the plan is to build around Pascal, OG, and Scottie then Lonzo is an excellent fit with them as the starting PG.

With the injury history we could get a pick heading our way as well. I'd take a chance on Ball.