Jclaw wrote:
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The OPTIMISTIC Everything 2017 Offseason Thread
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yep...or its spitting distance close.
trading carroll and adding hamilton took them to or just under 119....
Joseph was making 7.8 and miles will get 8.3....500k dif
we are guessing...but bobby webster and ujiri arent...so they are pretty likely under the taxThere's no such thing as a 2nd round bust.
- TGO
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SkywalkerAC wrote: View PostWe're not under the tax though, are we?
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007 wrote: View PostSo how can we add more players while making sure we don't hit the tax?
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DanH wrote: View PostI say the optimistic version of a realistic scenario would be: we trade Cory and BeBe for no salary back, get a high second rounder out of it. And waive and stretch Hamilton. That clears $12.5 M in salary, putting the team 16M below the apron. Meaning they can sign a full MLE (Miles), BAE (some vet shooter) and a minimum salary guy and still have wiggle room for any moves later on.
1. because its supposed to be optimistic
2. because we got cj miles for joseph like 2 hours after it was posted.
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c-troop wrote: View Posti think this is funny.
1. because its supposed to be optimistic
2. because we got cj miles for joseph like 2 hours after it was posted.
Off-season is going very well!
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007 wrote: View PostSo how can we add more players while making sure we don't hit the tax?
Kyle 28,703,704
DeMar 27,739,975
Serge 20,061,728
Jonas 15,460,674
CJ (est.) 8,333,333
Bebe 2,947,305
Poeltl 2,825,640
Bruno 2,451,225
OG 1,645,200
Delon 1,645,200
Norm 1,471,382
FVV 1,312,611
Pascal 1,249,920
Hamilton (stretch) 1,500,000
Total salary in 2017-18 so far: $117,347,897
The luxury tax threshold is $119,266,000, which leaves us with $1,918,103 for the remaining two slots, assuming players don't hit incentives.
Just for the sake of argument, here are the minimum salaries that some free agents discussed by people here could sign with us for:
Thabo Sefalosha, Gerald Green, Aaron Afflalo: 2,328,652
Luc Mbah a Moute: 2,116,955
Jonas Jerebko: 1,974,159
Derrick Williams: 1,841,849
Shabazz Muhammad: 1,577,230
KJ McDaniels, Thomas Robinson: 1,524,305
Basically, in order to avoid tax entirely while still carrying 15 players, it would at minimum involve trading probably Bebe.
Another possibility: trading Jonas in order to try to snag JaMychal Green.
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magoon wrote: View PostRight now, not counting Alfonzo McKinnie's $815K deal since it's non-guaranteed and if we don't sign him for the season we'll end up paying him about 50K for training camp:
Kyle 28,703,704
DeMar 27,739,975
Serge 20,061,728
Jonas 15,460,674
CJ (est.) 8,333,333
Bebe 2,947,305
Poeltl 2,825,640
Bruno 2,451,225
OG 1,645,200
Delon 1,645,200
Norm 1,471,382
FVV 1,312,611
Pascal 1,249,920
Hamilton (stretch) 1,500,000
Total salary in 2017-18 so far: $117,347,897
The luxury tax threshold is $119,266,000, which leaves us with $1,918,103 for the remaining two slots, assuming players don't hit incentives.
Just for the sake of argument, here are the minimum salaries that some free agents discussed by people here could sign with us for:
Thabo Sefalosha, Gerald Green, Aaron Afflalo: 2,328,652
Luc Mbah a Moute: 2,116,955
Jonas Jerebko: 1,974,159
Derrick Williams: 1,841,849
Shabazz Muhammad: 1,577,230
KJ McDaniels, Thomas Robinson: 1,524,305
Basically, in order to avoid tax entirely while still carrying 15 players, it would at minimum involve trading probably Bebe.
Another possibility: trading Jonas in order to try to snag JaMychal Green.
Common practice is top up the rookie scale deal by 20%...so if it isn't in the calc..that would adds ~ 325k
Looks like this how it lines up now...13 contracts.
Lowry, Wright, VanVleet
DeRozan, Powell
Miles, Anunoby, Caboclo, (McKinnie has an ungauranteed deal for ~800K)
Ibaka, Siakam
Valanciunas, Poeltl, Bebe
Could use some help with a bigger veteran SF..who could play some PF or vice versa....
FWIW I think JV stays until
A)the trade market for C improves,
B)he plays his way off the trade block or
C)god forbid he regresses and plays his way to DNP -CD when he moves for another teams bad deal.
One of sefalosha, MBah a moute or Jerebco could fit....There's no such thing as a 2nd round bust.
- TGO
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magoon wrote: View PostRight now, not counting Alfonzo McKinnie's $815K deal since it's non-guaranteed and if we don't sign him for the season we'll end up paying him about 50K for training camp:
Kyle 28,703,704
DeMar 27,739,975
Serge 20,061,728
Jonas 15,460,674
CJ (est.) 8,333,333
Bebe 2,947,305
Poeltl 2,825,640
Bruno 2,451,225
OG 1,645,200
Delon 1,645,200
Norm 1,471,382
FVV 1,312,611
Pascal 1,249,920
Hamilton (stretch) 1,500,000
Total salary in 2017-18 so far: $117,347,897
The luxury tax threshold is $119,266,000, which leaves us with $1,918,103 for the remaining two slots, assuming players don't hit incentives.
Just for the sake of argument, here are the minimum salaries that some free agents discussed by people here could sign with us for:
Thabo Sefalosha, Gerald Green, Aaron Afflalo: 2,328,652
Luc Mbah a Moute: 2,116,955
Jonas Jerebko: 1,974,159
Derrick Williams: 1,841,849
Shabazz Muhammad: 1,577,230
KJ McDaniels, Thomas Robinson: 1,524,305
Basically, in order to avoid tax entirely while still carrying 15 players, it would at minimum involve trading probably Bebe.
Another possibility: trading Jonas in order to try to snag JaMychal Green.
First off: all minimum salaries count as 2-year veteran minimum salaries for tax purposes. So all those guys would earn just under 1.5M.
If we assume the bonuses are all missed entirely, then your Lowry salary is fine. But it should be noted early on that if a team is depending on players not earning bonuses to dodge the tax, they are actively rooting against those players finding success. Not a good place to be - and betting against a guy like Lowry doesn't seem smart either. Heck, the bonuses could be anything from games played to assists per game to All-NBA selection, any of which are very possible in terms of achievement. Lowry would only have signed the contract with incentives if he thought they were achievable to some degree.
In any case, leaving aside the bonuses, you still have to a) increase Pascal and Van Vleet's salaries to the 2-year vet minimum for tax purposes; b) decrease Miles' salary to presumably his starting salary of $7,936,508, and c) decrease Hamilton's cap hit to 1M per year. Then you add a 14th man to meet the minimum roster requirements, earning that $1.5M minimum salary.
That comes out to: $118.4M. Just about $800k clear of the tax. But again, without any bonuses.
It leaves DeRozan's reported but never confirmed 1.5M in bonuses unearned (these may not even exist, he had a salary range initially reported, suggesting incentives, but we never got confirmation of them). But even leaving his aside, Lowry will have $2.22 million in incentives.
The other tricky part is how hard it is to shed salary at this point with smaller deals, like Nogueira's. He earns 2.9M, so trading him for nothing and replacing him with a minimum salary would clear only 1.4M. That might be enough to make the difference - adding that 1.4M in buffer would mean staying below the tax by 200k if Lowry meets his incentives (and DeRozan's either don't exist or he doesn't meet them).
Unfortunately, bonuses are not well reported on in the NBA, so we will always be dealing somewhat in murk when talking tax and hard cap.
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DanH wrote: View PostYou've got a bunch of stuff missing here that tweaks that tax situation a bit, though sadly we start to wade into murky waters in terms of salary reporting with bonuses.
First off: all minimum salaries count as 2-year veteran minimum salaries for tax purposes. So all those guys would earn just under 1.5M.
If we assume the bonuses are all missed entirely, then your Lowry salary is fine. But it should be noted early on that if a team is depending on players not earning bonuses to dodge the tax, they are actively rooting against those players finding success. Not a good place to be - and betting against a guy like Lowry doesn't seem smart either. Heck, the bonuses could be anything from games played to assists per game to All-NBA selection, any of which are very possible in terms of achievement. Lowry would only have signed the contract with incentives if he thought they were achievable to some degree.
In any case, leaving aside the bonuses, you still have to a) increase Pascal and Van Vleet's salaries to the 2-year vet minimum for tax purposes; b) decrease Miles' salary to presumably his starting salary of $7,936,508, and c) decrease Hamilton's cap hit to 1M per year. Then you add a 14th man to meet the minimum roster requirements, earning that $1.5M minimum salary.
That comes out to: $118.4M. Just about $800k clear of the tax. But again, without any bonuses.
It leaves DeRozan's reported but never confirmed 1.5M in bonuses unearned (these may not even exist, he had a salary range initially reported, suggesting incentives, but we never got confirmation of them). But even leaving his aside, Lowry will have $2.22 million in incentives.
The other tricky part is how hard it is to shed salary at this point with smaller deals, like Nogueira's. He earns 2.9M, so trading him for nothing and replacing him with a minimum salary would clear only 1.4M. That might be enough to make the difference - adding that 1.4M in buffer would mean staying below the tax by 200k if Lowry meets his incentives (and DeRozan's either don't exist or he doesn't meet them).
Unfortunately, bonuses are not well reported on in the NBA, so we will always be dealing somewhat in murk when talking tax and hard cap.There's no such thing as a 2nd round bust.
- TGO
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