Everything Pascal Siakam

[Primer]

I think Pascal not playing with a legit center was the biggest issue.

Kyle/DeMar had JV, Amir and Biyombo (that one season).

Pascal/Fred had Baynes, Len, and Birch.


Kyle also didn't do much with Baynes/Len either. He was there in Tampa too.

Those centers were never 1a or 1b or 2a or 2b they were third tier or worse on offense and somewhat liabilities on defense too.

Pascal needed a top level guard or wing to play with and he didn't have that. He had chucker Mcgee missing more shots than anyone else in the NBA.

[planetmars]

Those centers were never 1a or 1b or 2a or 2b they were third tier or worse on offense and somewhat liabilities on defense too.

Pascal needed a top level guard or wing to play with and he didn't have that. He had chucker Mcgee missing more shots than anyone else in the NBA.

Most teams are fine with role playing centers.. but they still needed one. Baynes was one of the worst players in the league that year. Len only played like 10 games. Then we had Birch who looked like a saviour off the buy out market that we gave him a 3 year deal. And then just never played because he got hurt. OG, Thad and/or Scottie were cos playing the center position. It just wasn't that great. We had a very mid net rating with the 5 traditional starters. We became a juggernaut when we replaced Gary with Poeltl, but he was only here for like 20 games.

JV was a really good rim protector. As were Amir and Biyombo. DeMar and Lowry didn't have to worry about the back end, and could concentrate on offense. And/or play scramble defense which was a Casey staple. But it sort of worked in the regular season. The Raptors were terrible on defense mostly. It was guys playing too hard on the perimeter causing blow byes. Over helping at the rim lead to wide open 3's. Poeltl corrected all that. And his impact stats showed how valuable he became .

And Poeltl is just a role playing center. He's not an all-star or anything close to it. It took too long for Masai and Bobby to bring that in.. and that's why we've been screaming for years to get a guy like that when Marc left.

[MixxAOR]

Every year Kyle had a decent back up guard

[The Great One]

Darko in an interview said that he wants the ball in Scottie's hands a lot this year. So how is that going to work with Siakam on the team?

[Primer]

Most teams are fine with role playing centers.. but they still needed one. Baynes was one of the worst players in the league that year. Len only played like 10 games. Then we had Birch who looked like a saviour off the buy out market that we gave him a 3 year deal. And then just never played because he got hurt. OG, Thad and/or Scottie were cos playing the center position. It just wasn't that great. We had a very mid net rating with the 5 traditional starters. We became a juggernaut when we replaced Gary with Poeltl, but he was only here for like 20 games.

JV was a really good rim protector. As were Amir and Biyombo. DeMar and Lowry didn't have to worry about the back end, and could concentrate on offense. And/or play scramble defense which was a Casey staple. But it sort of worked in the regular season. The Raptors were terrible on defense mostly. It was guys playing too hard on the perimeter causing blow byes. Over helping at the rim lead to wide open 3's. Poeltl corrected all that. And his impact stats showed how valuable he became .

And Poeltl is just a role playing center. He's not an all-star or anything close to it. It took too long for Masai and Bobby to bring that in.. and that's why we've been screaming for years to get a guy like that when Marc left.

A better center would have been nice, but that's not what held Pascal back from contending.

It was his top usage running mate.

You need at least 2 really good players, and we never paired Pascal up with another really good player.

[Primer]

Darko in an interview said that he wants the ball in Scottie's hands a lot this year. So how is that going to work with Siakam on the team?

Maybe if Siakam signs his max deal now he'll be willing to take a step back. If he's gunning for supermax he's gonna be wanting the ball in his hands. Either way they are a bad fit together.

[planetmars]

A better center would have been nice, but that's not what held Pascal back from contending.

It was his top usage running mate.

You need at least 2 really good players, and we never paired Pascal up with another really good player.

How do you define "contend"? Were Lowry and DeMar contenders? That's who I'm comparing against. And that's been the discussion.

If you are talking ECF/Finals teams, then that's different. We were more than a center and a PG away from that. Kyle and DeMar got to the ECF once but that was pretty fluky. Really bad Eastern conference teams that year. Most of the stars were out West. Lebron, a pretty young George, and an old man Wade might have been the best guys in the East. They only really became contenders when Marc and Kawhi were here.. and I'd argue that bubble season too. But even then it was their center play that helped get them far. JV was awesome in Indiana.. Biyombo the rest of the way. Kyle of course was spectacular and that was the start of his GROAT campaign season.

There were only 4 players that made the all-nba team from the East in 2016: Lebron, Kyle, PG and Drummond (and that's likely only because they had to name a 3rd center).

[DanH]

Darko in an interview said that he wants the ball in Scottie's hands a lot this year. So how is that going to work with Siakam on the team?

Siakam is an elite #2 option. Sounds good to me. Scottie creating offence out of PnR and from the high post should open up a lot of off ball stuff for Pascal that should be much easier scoring than all the isolation he's had to carry of late.

[Primer]

How do you define "contend"? Were Lowry and DeMar contenders? That's who I'm comparing against. And that's been the discussion.

If you are talking ECF/Finals teams, then that's different. We were more than a center and a PG away from that. Kyle and DeMar got to the ECF once but that was pretty fluky. Really bad Eastern conference teams that year. Most of the stars were out West. Lebron, a pretty young George, and an old man Wade might have been the best guys in the East. They only really became contenders when Marc and Kawhi were here.. and I'd argue that bubble season too. But even then it was their center play that helped get them far. JV was awesome in Indiana.. Biyombo the rest of the way. Kyle of course was spectacular and that was the start of his GROAT campaign season.

There were only 4 players that made the all-nba team from the East in 2016: Lebron, Kyle, PG and Drummond (and that's likely only because they had to name a 3rd center).

Yes, Demar and Lowry were contenders. We always made the playoffs, and would go deep until we ran into Lebron. Had Lebron been out west I think we could have made a finals.

Pascal + Fred has never sniffed that level of success. Because Fred is nowhere near the player DD or Lowry or Pascal are.

If Pascal + Fred were at least making round 2 of the playoffs we'd all be pretty happy.

[TrueTorontoFan]

You are delusional if you're expecting the Raps to make the playoffs.
We trade for Murray so that Scottie and the team gets the reps and development.

that wasn't my point reread

[LJ2]

Patrick Patterson, Cory Joseph and Luis Scola were "more help"? lmao.

DeMar & especially Kyle, carried those guys, and more importantly allowed the young guys to develop, while winning more games and making the playoffs every year. That's the point. Lowry was an analytics superstar, when it came to winning impact. Fred and Pascal are just so-so. That's why they need depth and "more help".

We all watched Kyle and DeMar. Pascal and Fred are no Kyle & DeMar. The bigger problem is that Masai & Bobby thought Pascal and Fred were Kyle & DeMar. They aren't. Their only excuse might be that Nurse sucked at player development and developing bench depth.

C'mon, if you're telling me that Joseph, Patterson, Scola, Gay, JV, Miles, Fields..before he got injured and all those others were not more productive and helpful than what Pascal and Fred had around them then I guess we don't share the same view on what it takes to win games in this league.

[SkywalkerAC]

Darko in an interview said that he wants the ball in Scottie's hands a lot this year. So how is that going to work with Siakam on the team?

0.5 second system, quick decisions, ball movement x player movement, etc.

[Kagemusha]

0.5 second system, quick decisions, ball movement x player movement, etc.

Hot potato basketball?

[Dr Hannibal Lecter]

I'm just gonna say this, they better move him, I said the same thing last year with Brick boy..look what happened, this won't change if his on the team, same s%#$ will happen.

[grindhouse]

I'm just gonna say this, they better move him, I said the same thing last year with Brick boy..look what happened, this won't change if his on the team, same s%#$ will happen.

as much as i like pascal…if it were kawhi coming he would humble himself but scottie is not there yet so he is fighting. if we move him i am ok with that