Everything Pascal Siakam

[Primer]

How is it that Dallas has zero elite defender yet they're the 2nd best team defensively.

You'll need to address this question to Golden, he's the one who said we had the most elite defenders of any team in the NBA. I don't agree with that.

[planetmars]

Dallas had the 7th best defense. They weren't 2nd. Golden State was 2nd after Boston.

Raptors ended up 9th. I think the concern I have is that the Raptors bring in defense first guys. And our general motto is if you can't play defense you can't come to this team. 9th is good.. but if you are bringing in defense first guys then it should be a whole lot better.

And I get we had injuries, but every team had someone hurt. Our replacement level players should still be able to play defense, because again our general motto is that if you can't play defense you can't come to this team.

Maybe the switch everything type of defense we play isn't the best system available. Or we're missing better rim protection.. because we had a top 5 defense when we had Marc and Serge.. and both those guys were well past their primes here.

Having Koloko is going to help a lot I think.. let's just hope Nurse finds a way to get him minutes.

[LJ2]

The missing ingredient isn't rim protection, it's basketball IQ which is gained through experience.

We were starting a rookie, a second year C that hardly played his first season, Trent Jr. in his first full year with the team had poor depth which coincidentally was also inexperienced.

The system isn't the standard guard the player you're assigned to or the section of the floor you're assigned to. It's guard every player on all sections of the floor. You need experience to understand all the nuances of that system, experience with studying all the players you're defending etc. You'll see this team start to climb the defense leader boards soon enough.

[Primer]

Dallas had the 7th best defense. They weren't 2nd. Golden State was 2nd after Boston.

Raptors ended up 9th. I think the concern I have is that the Raptors bring in defense first guys. And our general motto is if you can't play defense you can't come to this team. 9th is good.. but if you are bringing in defense first guys then it should be a whole lot better.

And I get we had injuries, but every team had someone hurt. Our replacement level players should still be able to play defense, because again our general motto is that if you can't play defense you can't come to this team.

Maybe the switch everything type of defense we play isn't the best system available. Or we're missing better rim protection.. because we had a top 5 defense when we had Marc and Serge.. and both those guys were well past their primes here.

Having Koloko is going to help a lot I think.. let's just hope Nurse finds a way to get him minutes.

9th is pretty damn good for a team playing a rookie the most minutes, and a 2nd year C who is still somewhat raw.

Trent is not a defense first guy, neither is Thad, so pokes a hole in your we only bring in defense first guys theory. I wouldn't call Otto a defense first guy either, he's a shooter first. So the 3 most recent additions aren't even defense first.

All that said, I expect the defense to be even better this season. We are deeper so when someone gets injured it won't be such a massive drop off. Scottie and Precious should both make jumps defensively, and hopefully Precious starts and gets more minutes.

Replacement level players were a huge problem last season, but we've taken some steps to address that. The biggest question marks defensively for me will be Banton, Flynn, Champagnie, Juancho, and if they can be serviceable or even good on that end. If they can our defensive depth looks good. If not we're still a little thin but still not as bad as last year.

[Maury]

Dallas had the 7th best defense. They weren't 2nd. Golden State was 2nd after Boston.

Raptors ended up 9th. I think the concern I have is that the Raptors bring in defense first guys. And our general motto is if you can't play defense you can't come to this team. 9th is good.. but if you are bringing in defense first guys then it should be a whole lot better.

And I get we had injuries, but every team had someone hurt. Our replacement level players should still be able to play defense, because again our general motto is that if you can't play defense you can't come to this team.

Maybe the switch everything type of defense we play isn't the best system available. Or we're missing better rim protection.. because we had a top 5 defense when we had Marc and Serge.. and both those guys were well past their primes here.

Having Koloko is going to help a lot I think.. let's just hope Nurse finds a way to get him minutes.

I think the idea is that these principles lend themselves to the playoffs more, and in the regular season you’ll get burned more often than you would if you really got to lock in on a team in a 7 game series but it’s all moot if you can’t perform in the playoffs. Sort of the opposite of a Casey team. Ultimately, though, I think Nurse has to look back at how Kawhi got his rest the year we won. Just because our guys don’t have degenerative quads doesn’t mean you can run them into the ground. If the regular season really doesn’t matter, you’ve gotta hold minutes under IMO 35 a game for your best players (Jokic plays 33 or so, that would be ideal for me). We really can’t afford to put 40mpg seasons on Scottie’s legs. It’s going to severely neuter his longevity.

Hopefully the depth they’ve added can come in and play the right way, and I’m glad we’re finally adding veterans as depth rather than just using every non-starter roster spot as a chance to see on a young guy that might pan out or not. It’s definitely something Nurse has to be conscious of, though.

[DanH]

Raps were also a top 5 defensive team the entire second half of the season, they mostly struggled heavily early in the season when Precious didn't have his feet under him, Pascal was missing games or coming back from injury, Scottie was at his rookie-est, and guys like Svi were getting relatively consistent minutes.

[TrueTorontoFan]

Dallas had the 7th best defense. They weren't 2nd. Golden State was 2nd after Boston.

Raptors ended up 9th. I think the concern I have is that the Raptors bring in defense first guys. And our general motto is if you can't play defense you can't come to this team. 9th is good.. but if you are bringing in defense first guys then it should be a whole lot better.

And I get we had injuries, but every team had someone hurt. Our replacement level players should still be able to play defense, because again our general motto is that if you can't play defense you can't come to this team.

Maybe the switch everything type of defense we play isn't the best system available. Or we're missing better rim protection.. because we had a top 5 defense when we had Marc and Serge.. and both those guys were well past their primes here.

Having Koloko is going to help a lot I think.. let's just hope Nurse finds a way to get him minutes.

I agree everything except for the switch everything...



The issue is we played switched everything AND sent aggressive doubles. A guy like Koloko should in theory allow you to play more aggressive and yet have a backline that can step up more easily or at least that is what Nurse has voiced

[golden]

I think the idea is that these principles lend themselves to the playoffs more, and in the regular season you’ll get burned more often than you would if you really got to lock in on a team in a 7 game series but it’s all moot if you can’t perform in the playoffs. Sort of the opposite of a Casey team. Ultimately, though, I think Nurse has to look back at how Kawhi got his rest the year we won. Just because our guys don’t have degenerative quads doesn’t mean you can run them into the ground. If the regular season really doesn’t matter, you’ve gotta hold minutes under IMO 35 a game for your best players (Jokic plays 33 or so, that would be ideal for me). We really can’t afford to put 40mpg seasons on Scottie’s legs. It’s going to severely neuter his longevity.

Hopefully the depth they’ve added can come in and play the right way, and I’m glad we’re finally adding veterans as depth rather than just using every non-starter roster spot as a chance to see on a young guy that might pan out or not. It’s definitely something Nurse has to be conscious of, though.

Those principles never held up. Doc Rivers and the entire Sixers team was ready and waiting to exploit our defensive principles in the playoffs. Nurse showed his cards in the last regular season game and our principles were laughably easy to scheme into wide open shots and historic opposition ORTGs.

We need to re-evaluate the principles, which are taking away from showcasing the natural defensive talent of the long, versatile types we are bringing in. Nurse is clearly over-coaching defense. Schemes need to be simplified, which he in fact did, to avoid being swept by Philly. Hope that’s a long-term lesson learned.

Speaking of Kawhi… we haven’t won a playoff series since Kawhi left (Long Island Nets doesn’t count). We haven’t been an elite defensive team since Gasol left.

[DanH]

Those principles never held up. Doc Rivers and the entire Sixers team was ready and waiting to exploit our defensive principles in the playoffs. Nurse showed his cards in the last regular season game and our principles were laughably easy to scheme into wide open shots and historic opposition ORTGs.

We need to re-evaluate the principles, which are taking away from showcasing the natural defensive talent of the long, versatile types we are bringing in. Nurse is clearly over-coaching defense. Schemes need to be simplified, which he in fact did, to avoid being swept by Philly. Hope that’s a long-term lesson learned.

Speaking of Kawhi… we haven’t won a playoff series since Kawhi left (Long Island Nets doesn’t count). We haven’t been an elite defensive team since Gasol left.

So... he simplified his schemes, got good defensive results, and then... suffered the biggest blowout of the series in game 6, giving up a 140 opponent ORTG? Did he reimplement the schemes he went away from?

Methinks you are oversimplifying this. Maybe they were just hurt and had little room for error on that front.

Again, top 10 defensive team last year with OG and Pascal missing huge chunks and Fred being hurt half the year. Top 5 defensive team second half of the year. How is that not an elite defensive team?

[golden]

So... he simplified his schemes, got good defensive results, and then... suffered the biggest blowout of the series in game 6, giving up a 140 opponent ORTG? Did he reimplement the schemes he went away from?

Methinks you are oversimplifying this. Maybe they were just hurt and had little room for error on that front.

Again, top 10 defensive team last year with OG and Pascal missing huge chunks and Fred being hurt half the year. Top 5 defensive team second half of the year. How is that not an elite defensive team?

Duh. Doc Rivers made adjustments for Game 6. He thoroughly out-coached Nurse in the series... getting the jump-start in games 1 & 2 (because Nurse showed his cards in the last regular season game), and then Doc made further adjustments for the close-out game 6. Playoffs are all about adjustments. That's why we fired Casey and hired Nurse, right?

[DanH]

Duh. Doc Rivers made adjustments for Game 6. He thoroughly out-coached Nurse in the series... getting the jump-start in games 1 & 2 (because Nurse showed his cards in the last regular season game), and then Doc made further adjustments for the close-out game 6. Playoffs are all about adjustments. That's why we fired Casey and hired Nurse, right?

Right, so it wasn't some fundamental system flaw like you said for the first couple games - it was Nurse slow to adjusting, right? And then with a changed system, thus avoiding the fundamental system flaw, another adjustment.

Just... please get straight exactly what the critique is. There's no issue critiquing the coach, just, let's be clear about what it is. Is it a defensive approach that is fundamentally broken and easy to scheme for? Or is it slow adjustments, with identical outcomes whether starting from the "fundamentally broken" defensive system or not? Hard to see it being both.

The system is fine, given the pieces. As are Nick's adjustments, based on his history to date. We didn't have the pieces for either this time. We'll have more pieces next time, with any luck at all.

[TrueTorontoFan]

Duh. Doc Rivers made adjustments for Game 6. He thoroughly out-coached Nurse in the series... getting the jump-start in games 1 & 2 (because Nurse showed his cards in the last regular season game), and then Doc made further adjustments for the close-out game 6. Playoffs are all about adjustments. That's why we fired Casey and hired Nurse, right?

did he outcoach him if barnes, birch, gtj alll got injured.... freddy was gimpy.... and OG was still working his way back from an injury.

[TrueTorontoFan]

[G__Deane]

Duh. Doc Rivers made adjustments for Game 6. He thoroughly out-coached Nurse in the series... getting the jump-start in games 1 & 2 (because Nurse showed his cards in the last regular season game), and then Doc made further adjustments for the close-out game 6. Playoffs are all about adjustments. That's why we fired Casey and hired Nurse, right?

Your constant dislike for any Nurse admiration is almost as consistent as Dan's thinly veiled "Gary needs to be on the bench" mantra expertly weaved into every comment

[golden]

Your constant dislike for any Nurse admiration is almost as consistent as Dan's thinly veiled "Gary needs to be on the bench" mantra expertly weaved into every comment

So when I praise or agree with Nurse, like I’ve done on many occasions this season, am I supposed to argue against myself? Lol.

That said, Nurse HAS dialed down the frequency of the over-helping defense this season, so I guess I was right about that: ie, it doesn’t work as a high frequency core defense. And it’s even worse in the playoffs. It’s useful as a gimmick defense in small doses, like zone or press. It also neuters the natural talents of our elite 1-on-1 defenders by taking them out of position.

But no major complaints of Nurse so far this season from me, other than hopefully please do not burn out the starters again ala Thibs (which I pointed out years before people would admit it).