Everything 2018 Off Season

[slaw]

How about this: Masai had a plan, that plan has now backfired (based on current contractual obligations), and now the initial noble idea looks awfully mis-judged.

So where do we go from here?

It has? How so? He created a three-year window for himself with Lowry, Derozan and Ibaka. This was pretty clear from the contracts they got in the offseason when everyone thought Lowry and Ibaka were going to get 4-5 deals.

In year one, they won 59 games and probably have the deepest roster in the league. They will be a 50+ win team again next year. They lost to the Cavs. It's awful. It sucks. It's unacceptable how they lost. But it doesn't render everything else they've accomplished meaningless. That's shortsightedness. People complain about Masai being reactionary and then want the most reactionary move imaginable to be made!

Change is needed but you don't need to start over from scratch. A new voice in the locker room is required. It's risky but the franchise, in my view, is now in a position such that it can take a risk. That coach has two years. If it can't be done then they'll be rebuilding anyway.

[Nilanka]

It has? How so? He created a three-year window for himself with Lowry, Derozan and Ibaka. This was pretty clear from the contracts they got in the offseason when everyone thought Lowry and Ibaka were going to get 4-5 deals.

In year one, they won 59 games and probably have the deepest roster in the league. They will be a 50+ win team again next year. They lost to the Cavs. It's awful. It sucks. It's unacceptable how they lost. But it doesn't render everything else they've accomplished meaningless. That's shortsightedness. People complain about Masai being reactionary and then want the most reactionary move imaginable to be made!

Change is needed but you don't need to start over from scratch. A new voice in the locker room is required. It's risky but the franchise, in my view, is now in a position such that it can take a risk. That coach has two years. If it can't be done then they'll be rebuilding anyway.

A 3 year plan was made 12 months ago. We now have more evidence today to judge whether that 3 year plan still makes sense. To me, it doesn't.

We're giving way too much credit to LeBron, and not putting enough emphasis on our core's inabilities.

[golden]

You still have yet to say what our strategy is. You can be sarcastic all you want but that isn't a rebuttal.

How do you plan to get this team from good to great? Or more accurately, what is Masai's plan?

Who is the best player Masai Ujiri has acquired in eight years as an executive?

Back when Masai first decided against tanking the main argument was that Masai could carefully accumulate assets and parlay them into valuable pieces. Yet we are about to go deep into luxury tax territory with no picks. Our best player will be 34 when his contract ends.

So what exactly is the plan? I'm all ears.

I believe that Masai's strategy was to keep all team building options open: (1) Attracting or Keep FAs, (2) Building through the draft, (3) Trades, (4) Internal Player Development

We can argue about the execution, but I feel like Masai was good to great at all of these areas. The biggest letdown, IMO, is letting Casey strongly influence roster construction for 6 years and also ingraining playing habits which come back to bite us hard during playoff time. Every year, Casey made excuses about needing this and that after each playoff exit, and every off-season, Masai raided the asset piggybank to get Casey what he said he needed, until he is where is he now... out of excuses with a capped out roster full of Casey's guys, who are difficult to trade.

Let's rewind it back just 10 days, shall we: we the overwhelming favorite to win this series. Everyone from the money guys (Vegas) to long-time haters (Stephen A) said we were clearly the superior team. Cavs were ready to be taken out and we let them off the mat and gave them back their swagger. TBH, I think this series was lost in the 2nd quarter of game 1, when we let them get back into the game. Casey should have burned timeouts, left, right and center to keep that lead up to double digits and slow down the momentum. That game should have been a blowout, and then Lebron would have turned on his teammates and thrown them under the bus. We gave them life.

Not to mention that it's finally clear to everybody that Casey's in-game coaching under the pressure cooker of the playoffs is severely lacking. I was beating the "Casey is gonna cost us in the playoffs drum", but wanted so badly to eat crow on this point.... you know, reverse-jinx and all that. Without elite talent, an well-coached team can still beat vastly superior talent. We just saw that with UTAH taking out the reigning MVP with 2 perennial all-stars riding shot-gun. Mitchell is great, but man, he's just a rookie. Joe Ingles is your starting SF? C'mon.

We didn't even take 1 freakin' game. Pacers took 3 and got jobbed by the refs way harder than us. And we got blown out 50% of the time - once on our sacred home court no less. Pacers showed zero fear, played smart and physical and Nate McMillan isn't even in the class of coach as Brad Stevens and Quin Snyder. If there isn't enough evidence now to confirm that Masai's biggest mistake was retaining Casey, as far as maximizing our playoff ceiling, then you can't be convinced. Sure, transcendent talent sometimes can overcome mediocre coaching (although it didn't work for Billy Donovan), but if you can't access those guys, then you absolutely need elite coaching.

[Joey]

C'mon guys, let's talk ball. Stop making me delete stuff that's not related.

[ebrian]

I told you so !

Sorry.. I don't read this forum too often. Didn't know you posted about the grammar already.

It's a sound argument imo. In all seriousness, I don't know how to fix this team to beat Lebron James.. I don't think you can. Just keep developing talent and wait out this crazy player and hope the next one is still a long ways away (or that he ends up on our team).

I am okay with a team that makes the playoffs and bows out to Lebron James every year. The alternative is making a drastic/sweeping Colangelo move and try again but I don't think Masai is that kind of GM.

[rocwell]

"Winning comes first," Fred VanVleet says on free agency. Also mentions he's restricted, so doesn't have "ultimate green light to go somewhere else." "I love it here, this is the place that gave me a chance, gave me the opportunity. I'm a loyal guy."

— Ryan Wolstat (@WolstatSun) May 8, 2018

[MixxAOR]

So but Rodney Hood: Someone pointed this out on here last week, but apparently he's known to have had huge anxiety issues in/before games?

— Farmer Jones (@thefarmerjones) May 8, 2018

in case some people still want Hood

[KeonClark]

I will explain once and for all why we lost and we keep losing in the playoffs. It's very simple:

We The North.

We angered the grammar gods. I guarantee you guys that if we change it to We Are The North, the grammar gods will grant us favor and we'll go on to win the championship. Same reason the Leafs can't win anything.

Screw gramer gods there buncha dix neways,

[saints91]

I don’t know how you can go into next season trying to contend with guys that already have a defeatist mindset. You can see the way they played and the way they spoke after games.

Masai gave this core a 2 to 3 year window but I think if they can cash in and get value, I think you do it. Start planing for 2 to 3 years from now. The warriors will have to break it up because of luxury tax, LeBron might start regressing by that time. Boston and Phili are the future, time to retool and fight them.

I’m not entirely sure how drastic to go... because I do enjoy the personalities on this team, but this just isn’t working.

On a positive note... how many teams have beaten “prime” Lebron? Not many, and those who have, have had amazing talent and top tier coaching. Can’t get down on these guys too much. It’s just disappointing that they got swept... If we went out like Indy went out, it would be totally different.

[KeonClark]

I don’t know how you can go into next season trying to contend with guys that already have a defeatist mindset. You can see the way they played and the way they spoke after games.

Masai gave this core a 2 to 3 year window but I think if they can cash in and get value, I think you do it. Start planing for 2 to 3 years from now. The warriors will have to break it up because of luxury tax, LeBron might start regressing by that time. Boston and Phili are the future, time to retool and fight them.

I’m not entirely sure how drastic to go... because I do enjoy the personalities on this team, but this just isn’t working.

On a positive note... how many teams have beaten “prime” Lebron? Not many, and those who have, have had amazing talent and top tier coaching. Can’t get down on these guys too much. It’s just disappointing that they got swept... If we went out like Indy went out, it would be totally different.

What I found interesting was your last sentence. It's true. If we took cavs to hard fought 7 games, a very very large majority here would be fine to stay the course and tinker. But the end result would still be the same. And is Indy any closer to the end goal then Toronto? Hell No.

Food for thought

[Nilanka]

I don’t know how you can go into next season trying to contend with guys that already have a defeatist mindset. You can see the way they played and the way they spoke after games.

Masai gave this core a 2 to 3 year window but I think if they can cash in and get value, I think you do it. Start planing for 2 to 3 years from now. The warriors will have to break it up because of luxury tax, LeBron might start regressing by that time. Boston and Phili are the future, time to retool and fight them.

I’m not entirely sure how drastic to go... because I do enjoy the personalities on this team, but this just isn’t working.

On a positive note... how many teams have beaten “prime” Lebron? Not many, and those who have, have had amazing talent and top tier coaching. Can’t get down on these guys too much. It’s just disappointing that they got swept... If we went out like Indy went out, it would be totally different.

Last sentence is key. If we lost in a game 7 nail biter, there would be absolutely nothing to sulk over, and the current core would be considered good enough keep trying with.

[The Great One]

I don’t know how you can go into next season trying to contend with guys that already have a defeatist mindset. You can see the way they played and the way they spoke after games.

Masai gave this core a 2 to 3 year window but I think if they can cash in and get value, I think you do it. Start planing for 2 to 3 years from now. The warriors will have to break it up because of luxury tax, LeBron might start regressing by that time. Boston and Phili are the future, time to retool and fight them.

I’m not entirely sure how drastic to go... because I do enjoy the personalities on this team, but this just isn’t working.

On a positive note... how many teams have beaten “prime” Lebron? Not many, and those who have, have had amazing talent and top tier coaching. Can’t get down on these guys too much. It’s just disappointing that they got swept... If we went out like Indy went out, it would be totally different.

They completely QUIT after Game 1 period. You can't win with this core. They've proven it time and time again. Their 2 all stsrs continues to disappear in the playoffs. DeRozan 8 points in Game 3, Lowry 5 points.
Unacceptable.

I also don't want to hear the "how many teams have beaten LeBron" narrative. The reality is this is not a good Cleveland team. They almost lost to the Pacers in the 1st round.

Also, this core historically have struggled in the playoffs against lesser teams. They got swept by the Wizards in 2015. BARELY beat the Pacers and the Heat in 2016. Last year they were down 1-2 to the Bucks. Hell, the 1st round this year against the Wizards wasn't easy.

[Nilanka]

The narrative: All teams lose to LeBron.

The truth: All teams lose to LeBron, but only 1 team crumbles at his feet.

[planetmars]

The narrative: All teams lose to LeBron.

The truth: All teams lose to LeBron, but only 1 team crumbles at his feet.

Will be interesting to see how Boston fares against these Cavs. We gave the Cavs so much confidence that if they play anywhere close to how they played us.. Boston is not winning a game either.

[ebrian]

The narrative: All teams lose to LeBron.

The truth: All teams lose to LeBron, but only 1 team crumbles at his feet.

So we're the George Costanza of teams who lose to Lebron?