Everything 2018 Off Season

[inthepaint]

How is that any more likely than if he doesn't come here? Nevermind that the full 5 year max seems important to Butler.

Meanwhile, the odds of both playing for the Raps in 19-20 is basically zero if we don't trade for him.

If you have someone that is "determined" to find its way to the Clippers as Butler suggested (if the reports are true), combined with another star that also expressed explicit interest in going to LA, yeah that's a risk. It doesn't mean it will happen, but the chance of them bonding over this potential future during practice, travel etc,, is not insignificant. Neither of them wanted to be in Toronto to begin with and both publicly expressed, within 4 months apart, that they wanted to be in LA.

Yes, the odds of both playing here in 19-20 is zero if we don't trade for Butler, but the chances of Kawhi re-signing on his own for 19-20 is real, just as it was before Butler was on the picture.

The most important thing for the franchise is to re-sign Kawhi long run. Everything else is secondary. So to me basically it comes down to what effect Butler would have on Kawhi: If one believes his presence will make it more likely Kawhi will re-up, you go get him. I personally think the opposite is true.

[DanH]

If you have someone that is "determined" to find its way to the Clippers as Butler suggested (if the reports are true), combined with another star that also expressed explicit interest in going to LA, yeah that's a risk. It doesn't mean it will happen, but the chance of them bonding over this potential future during practice, travel etc,, is not insignificant. Neither of them wanted to be in Toronto to begin with and both publicly expressed, within 4 months apart, that they wanted to be in LA.

Yes, the odds of both playing here in 19-20 is zero if we don't trade for Butler, but the chances of Kawhi re-signing on his own for 19-20 is real, just as it was before Butler was on the picture.

The most important thing for the franchise is to re-sign Kawhi long run. Everything else is secondary. So to me basically it comes down to what effect Butler would have on Kawhi: If one believes his presence will make it more likely Kawhi will re-up, you go get him. I personally think the opposite is true.

The one common theme of being able to re-sign big stars in the modern NBA is having other stars. I'd think being able to pitch the two of them on staying is the best chance we have to re-sign either of them.

[golden]

I found a report here about Jimmy:
https://nba.nbcsports.com/2018/09/20...t-this-summer/

Looks like Jimmy just wants $$$. He would have stuck around in Minny if instead of giving him a 4 year $100M extension (which they offered), that they renegotiate his contract and then extend him to a 5 year $190M offer (basically the full max, which is about $38M per year). They didn't do that and now he's looking for that 5 year max extension from a team like LAC, Brooklyn or NY (which I think he can get if he's traded now).

So Toronto could hypothetically hold on to Jimmy if they gave him that max contract. Is Jimmy worth $38M a year? That seems like a lot for a guy that's banged up as much as he is.

If Masai wants to shell out $190M for Jimmy for the next 5 years.. he's ours even if he's not on our wish list I bet.

This whole thing smelled like it was about money. With the owner stepping in, it sounds like he got pissed off with Butler's perceived greed. Hopefully it's gotten personal and Taylor will do everything in his power to make sure that Butler has to leave money on the table next off-season if he really wants to get to his desired destinations (Clips, Nets, NYK). If Taylor wants to be a prick then he really should ship him off to the Raptors, but he's actually being smart in accelerating a bidding war before Butler's trade value drops even further.

[Hotshot]

Has anyone checked with K "silent one" L whether he is ok with Jimmy?

Call "his people" and find out.

[planetmars]

I'm on the get Butler train just because Jimmy Butler is a top 15 player in the league. These guys are really hard to find even if you are a lottery team for years on end.

I'm assuming that if we get Butler he's getting a 5 year $190M max from Toronto and we're not just getting him for one year. He would have signed a 5 year max to play in Minny with KAT and Wiggins as the report I linked to earlier implied. So as long as he gets his money he'll play anywhere I suppose.

So with that, I guess there are 4 possibilities here:

1) We don't get Butler, Kawhi leaves. This is the most likely situation. At that point we're going into a short rebuild/retool hoping to catch Giannis' eye or we just rebuild through the draft hoping to find another star.

2) We get Butler, Kawhi still leaves. This means we've lost some depth to get Butler (hopefully its a crap offer like Serge+Norm or someone like Miles). If we get Butler we're giving him a 5 year max. That means we forgo the rebuild and start looking at retooling on the fly. Perhaps getting Lowry a third contract that's far cheaper than what he has now.. and work on building a team around Butler as our best player. We're probably not a contender but closer to a team like Indiana or Milwaukee in the Eastern conference. There is a chance too that Kawhi might hate playing with Jimmy which could be more ammunition for him to take off. But the chances of keeping Kawhi whether we get Jimmy or not are slim anyway.

3) We don't get Butler, Kawhi stays. This would be awesome. Kawhi is the guy we build around and we can be competitive for as long as we have a healthy Kawhi to play with. We've talked ad nauseam about this all summer since Jimmy was never on our radar until now.

4) We get Butler, and Kawhi stays. This would be awesome too, but our cap would be f*cked for the foreseeable future. How much tax are we willing to spend considering 2 of our guys will be using up around 60% of our cap space all by themselves. However if this works out both on the court and off the court, we could have a hell of a team for quite some time.


Note: If we get Butler and he's not meshing at all with Kawhi and our team starts struggling.. than we have the option to try and flip Butler to a team like LAC before the deadline. If LAC is willing to give a 5 year max to Butler. We won't have to give back Dieng as Minny is trying to do, thus creating a more favourable trade package. So we could recoup some of our losses although this situation would not be ideal.

[planetmars]

The one common theme of being able to re-sign big stars in the modern NBA is having other stars. I'd think being able to pitch the two of them on staying is the best chance we have to re-sign either of them.

Yeah this is my thought process too. Like how OKC gambled on George to keep Russ.

[Ebonhawke]

Sacramento has waived Deyonta Davis, who was bandied about as a potential Raptors pick

[planetmars]

Has anyone checked with K "silent one" L whether he is ok with Jimmy?

Anyone have a direct connection to Uncle Dennis?

[planetmars]

A lot of this situation seems to scare me... a lot. This could potentially end up being OKC where their three guys just struggled to mesh. Enough star power to compete with the Warriors, which OKC did, but on a nightly basis, struggle to play an effective style of basketball, which was exposed by Utah.

Like Melo, Butler doesn't fit in with what Kawhi and Lowry are so good at doing: shooting the 3, playing off-the-ball, and dominant in the pick-&-roll.

Butler is ball-dominant but doesn't necessarily have an advantage every night offensively, unlike Lowry or Kawhi. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

I feel we overlook the on-court disadvantages because Butler is an all-star, and arguably a top-15 player. Offensively, he's not great at one. He's a jack-of-all-trades offensive player. However, what puts him above the rest is how good he is as a rebounding forward, and obviously as a top-five perimeter defender in the league.

Looking at the roster and how Nick Nurse intends to the utitlize a similar system to last season, Butler is a square peg trying to fit in a round hole; it's not going to work, in my opinion.

At first, I was on the "trade for Butler" train, but after having some time to think, I'd prefer to stay away from gutting the team's depth to acquire a guy who will take opportunities away from Lowry/Kawhi, and cause locker room strife based on his track record in both Chicago and Minnesota.

Jimmy plays elite defense.. so that's the part that intrigues me the most. If he doesn't fit offensively you can try to turn him into a 6th man. Start him so his ego isn't crushed, but than rest him early and have him lead the bench mob. Defensively though you can play him 48 minutes a night. He's plays hard.

Melo doesn't mesh because he's sort of become like Bargnani. Not a great shooter anymore. Too soft to play inside. Doesn't play hard on defense. He's got respect from the players and will probably get to the Hall (although that's a question for a different day). Jimmy is like the anti-Melo.

But yeah I get your concerns.. they're definitely concerns I have too. But I think it's worth the gamble. Having Jimmy for 5 years would ensure we keep winning and having another star could keep Kawhi around. Especially since now a days players love playing with other stars.

[S.R.]

The one common theme of being able to re-sign big stars in the modern NBA is having other stars. I'd think being able to pitch the two of them on staying is the best chance we have to re-sign either of them.

Yeah, we're making this too complicated. Masai's job is to bring in the talent. Nurse's job is to make the locker room and on-court stuff work. Players' job is to deliver the goods on court.

We could second guess everything else all day long. Get the best damn team possible and let the chips fall where they may.

[Joey]

Yeah, we're making this too complicated. Masai's job is to bring in the talent. Nurse's job is to make the locker room and on-court stuff work. Players' job is to deliver the goods on court.

We could second guess everything else all day long. Get the best damn team possible and let the chips fall where they may.

I assume by "chips", you mean Championchips? Yes? Lol

[Bendit]

Anyone have a direct connection to Uncle Dennis?

"Direct" maybe beyond my own capabilities of unearthing that form of connection ...but how about :

https://www.linkedin.com/in/dennis-r...tson-004a7447/

for anyone interested in beginning the process

[Bendit]

Sacramento has waived Deyonta Davis, who was bandied about as a potential Raptors pick

Disclosure: I was on that bandwagon.

And then we heard his interviews..

But still it's not how one speaks/interviews is it? And how many teams has he been thru? And if SK ar now letting him go that's not exactly a notch in the belt is it?

Poor Deyonta is probably headed for the G league

[Maury]

Disclosure: I was on that bandwagon.

And then we heard his interviews..

But still it's not how one speaks/interviews is it? And how many teams has he been thru? And if SK ar now letting him go that's not exactly a notch in the belt is it?

Poor Deyonta is probably headed for the G league

He didn’t get his second contract

[Hotshot]

Heh

In a deal that cements him as the franchise’s long-term cornerstone, Minnesota Timberwolves All-Star center Karl-Anthony Towns has agreed to a 5-year, $190M super-maximum extension, league sources tell ESPN.

— Adrian Wojnarowski (@wojespn) September 23, 2018