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  • Holy fuck idk or care what they are actually going to do. It's a forum, we don't have any control here. We talk about what we WANT the team to do or what we thinking they should do.

    The only benefit of running some rendition of this same team back is playoff revenue. I personally am tired of having a 0% chance of winning the title every year due to a lack of a superstar.

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    • Yeah most likely they will stand pat with this core for the next 2 years. But as of right now it does feel like we're just postponing the inevitable. Shame that we'll waste best of OG's years
      Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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      • magoon wrote: View Post
        Note that Charlotte can't "protect" the pick because the trade would have to take place as of July 1; if it's the 2018 first-rounder, what happens is Charlotte drafts who Masai wants. Obviously if Charlotte gets a top-three pick (unlikely) they'd keep it because one of Luka Doncic, Deandre Ayton or Jaren Jackson is probably not worth the deal, but a late-lottery in 2018 is and a 2019 probably doesn't come with much protection if any because Charlotte is coming out ahead in the deal.

        The Charlotte deal I structured specifically to address both teams' issues. Charlotte gets one good player (Ibaka) and a question mark who will probably develop out okay (Powell) for $33m per year, instead of having one okay player (Batum) for 24 million per year. Toronto gets Batum - who can potentially still return to his Portland form and whose skills complement the system Masai wants in place much more than Ibaka's do - and a pick, plus the cap room to resign Freddy and still be under the tax (which matters to them). Maybe Toronto throws in Malachi Richardson as well if they don't want him, I dunno, give Charlotte another cheap questionable wing prospect and free up some more cash.



        Turner is garbage and Ibaka is not. I'm not going to write out Ibaka's stats again but let's just assume this as said: Ibaka is a good player who clearly doesn't work in Toronto's system. Aminu is a bench player who is Portland's best power forward and arguably their best big (Nurkic is fool's gold) and Ibaka represents a major upgrade in that respect, and Portland isn't going to get that for free. If Portland wants to continue competing with Dame/CJ as their backcourt (and I'm not saying they should; I think they should trade CJ, but that's me and not Portland), they need to upgrade their frontcourt to compensate and Ibaka is a good way of doing that.



        This trade idea is a total sales job. Sell Ibaka to New Orleans, who need another quality big, for a money reduction and a pick. Period. (Also note that NO can't "offload Boogie for a bunch of assets" because he's a free agent.) Honestly, there's an argument that New Orleans could just buy Ibaka for the pick instead but I'm trying to be as realistic as possible.



        Never underestimate Sacramento being stupid. NEVER UNDERESTIMATE THEM.



        Who are they signing, exactly? Have you seen the free agent crop this year? It's terrible. A bunch of guys Dallas won't get (LeBron, KD, PG13, CP3), a bunch of mediocre restricted free agents (Aaron Gordon, Jabari Parker, Jusuf Nurkic, Julius Randle), a couple of RFAs who will definitely be re-signed by their current teams (Zach LaVine, Clint Capela), and some huge question marks who probably won't be worth the money they want (DeAndre Jordan, Boogie Cousins, Isaiah Thomas). You're going to spend Ibaka-level money to get any of them anyway, and Ibaka is only on your books for two more years rather than three or four, and he's a safer bet than most of the guys Dallas could conceivably sign.
        I don't want to go too much into trade scenarios that probably won't happen. With the Cousins thing with New Orleans I meant in a sign-and-trade. Though if they let him go for nothing that's probably even more likely. I think that's the best trade on the board of the ones you offered, other than the unrealistic Aminu one.

        But yes your general point is a good one that Ibaka is tradeable, if not for much value. New Orleans traded Omar Asik and got a useful piece back! (They also traded a first with that, but point stands.)
        That is a normal collar. Move on, find a new slant.

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        • We're literally going to end up like the last few years of that Hawks team if we don't rebuild now.

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          • MixxAOR wrote: View Post
            Shaolin is right. You can fail with superstar talent. But you'll never win without it
            Well, you actually can have much lesser talent and win, bit it's rare: Mavs and Spurs over Lebron/Wade/Bosh in their primes are good examples, and going way back to Pistons over Shaq/Kobe. Rare, but possible.

            Honestly, I'm open to anything right now. But even setting yourself up to tank properly, it could take years to strip down this roster as currently constructed and get the assets you want back. And with the new CBA draft picks are highly valued and harder to come by.

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            • magoon wrote: View Post
              i think the second half of this statement is questionable at best
              Didn't you see how many poor bastards showed up at Jurassic Park last night, lol

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              • golden wrote: View Post
                Well, you actually can have much lesser talent and win, bit it's rare: Mavs and Spurs over Lebron/Wade/Bosh in their primes are good examples, and going way back to Pistons over Shaq/Kobe. Rare, but possible.

                Honestly, I'm open to anything right now. But even setting yourself up to tank properly, it could take years to strip down this roster as currently constructed and get the assets you want back. And with the new CBA draft picks are highly valued and harder to come by.
                The Mavs had FUCKING DIRK.

                Dirk probably top 20 all time. The Spurs had Duncan who granted was 37 but go look at his advanced numbers from the 2014 playoffs. He was still at a superstar level just not his best level. Not to mention Kawhi and the GOAT coach.

                Detroit had Billups who was basically what we want Lowry to be in the playoffs, two-way superstar. And probably the 2nd best defensive player of all time Big Ben (Hakeem is #1) and 2 other all-stars.

                We do not have the talent of those teams stop lying to yourselves.

                Comment


                • golden wrote: View Post
                  Well, you actually can have much lesser talent and win, bit it's rare: Mavs and Spurs over Lebron/Wade/Bosh in their primes are good examples, and going way back to Pistons over Shaq/Kobe. Rare, but possible.

                  Honestly, I'm open to anything right now. But even setting yourself up to tank properly, it could take years to strip down this roster as currently constructed and get the assets you want back. And with the new CBA draft picks are highly valued and harder to come by.
                  two of those teams didn't have offesive superstar I agree but in both Detroit and Spurs cases they had DPOY on those teams. Those are rare too.
                  Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

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                  • Shaolin Fantastic wrote: View Post
                    The Mavs had FUCKING DIRK.

                    Dirk probably top 20 all time. The Spurs had Duncan who granted was 37 but go look at his advanced numbers from the 2014 playoffs. He was still at a superstar level just not his best level. Not to mention Kawhi and the GOAT coach.

                    Detroit had Billups who was basically what we want Lowry to be in the playoffs, two-way superstar. And probably the 2nd best defensive player of all time Big Ben (Hakeem is #1) and 2 other all-stars.

                    We do not have the talent of those teams stop lying to yourselves.
                    Dirk also has one of the biggest positive jumps in his offensive production from regular season to playoffs. He's not only GOAT scorer at his position, when they playoffs come around he's essentially the anti-DeMar.
                    "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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                    • Shaolin Fantastic wrote: View Post
                      Holy fuck idk or care what they are actually going to do. It's a forum, we don't have any control here. We talk about what we WANT the team to do or what we thinking they should do.

                      The only benefit of running some rendition of this same team back is playoff revenue. I personally am tired of having a 0% chance of winning the title every year due to a lack of a superstar.
                      Ok, continue to yell at air if that's your fancy

                      I'm thinking of the moves that could make this team better because retool is the most drastic possibility this off-season
                      9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum

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                      • Retooling is just such a bad, cowardly idea. We won't even be able to beat Boston next year when Kyrie and Hayward come back, let alone LeBron.

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                        • Shaolin Fantastic wrote: View Post
                          Retooling is just such a bad, cowardly idea. We won't even be able to beat Boston next year when Kyrie and Hayward come back, let alone LeBron.
                          Why? Do you not think replacing 2/3rds of our 3 headed snake with better playoff composure could completely transform this team? We have a ton of great pieces, many of them young and improving by the day
                          9 time first team all-RR, First Ballot Hall of Forum

                          Comment


                          • KeonClark wrote: View Post
                            Why? Do you not think replacing 2/3rds of our 3 headed snake with better playoff composure could completely transform this team? We have a ton of great pieces, many of them young and improving by the day
                            But do we have anyone to give the ball to, in the dying seconds of the game, with the instructions, "win it for us"?

                            Not since Carter.

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                            • KeonClark wrote: View Post
                              Why? Do you not think replacing 2/3rds of our 3 headed snake with better playoff composure could completely transform this team? We have a ton of great pieces, many of them young and improving by the day
                              Keon, Boston, Philly are gonna get better too. That Tatum guy is gonna have confidence like he's MJ after a year he had.
                              Only one thing matters: We The Champs.

                              Comment


                              • This is why they should have fired Casey after the Wiz sweep. Could've tried the internal promotion then. And if things still didn't work, it would be a lot easier to justify large scale changes at a time like now.

                                Ah well.

                                Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

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