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  • KeonClark wrote: View Post
    There is only 2 ways of doing that. 1. Acquire a guy that demar would understand he's lower on the totem pole than, or 2. Trade demar
    I disagree with this. You are not reducing his minutes, just his usage, and not to zero, but to third on the team. If DeMar can improve his defense and efficiency by taking a step back in terms of shots under Nurse, he can significantly improve his value as a player.

    Yes, if he refused to buy into this, trade him. But I have no reason to believe that he wont as of yet, and no reason to believe trading him will improve the team.

    There are many, many stars in the league who are not one of the first two options on offence on their team. At this stage I see no reason to doubt that Nurse and Masai can convince DeMar to be one of them.

    And if we can get Butler or Kawhi for a package based around DeMar, you do it in a heart beat. I just don't see that happening.

    Comment


    • Quirk wrote: View Post
      I disagree with this. You are not reducing his minutes, just his usage, and not to zero, but to third on the team. If DeMar can improve his defense and efficiency by taking a step back in terms of shots under Nurse, he can significantly improve his value as a player.

      Yes, if he refused to buy into this, trade him. But I have no reason to believe that he wont as of yet, and no reason to believe trading him will improve the team.

      There are many, many stars in the league who are not one of the first two options on offence on their team. At this stage I see no reason to doubt that Nurse and Masai can convince DeMar to be one of them.

      And if we can get Butler or Kawhi for a package based around DeMar, you do it in a heart beat. I just don't see that happening.
      Waiting to trade DeMar has an opportunity cost. It's not as simple as "If he doesn't buy in, trade him".
      twitter.com/anthonysmdoyle

      Comment


      • Barolt wrote: View Post
        Waiting to trade DeMar has an opportunity cost. It's not as simple as "If he doesn't buy in, trade him".
        Why? How are you comparing current trade options to later ones?

        Also, don't you think Nurse, Masai and DeRozan will be talking about this? Surely Nurse will be laying out what he envisions Demar's role to be next year, and will know how he feels about it.

        Comment


        • Quirk wrote: View Post
          Why? How are you comparing current trade options to later ones?

          Also, don't you think Nurse, Masai and DeRozan will be talking about this? Surely Nurse will be laying out what he envisions Demar's role to be next year, and will know how he feels about it.
          I guess from an offensive standpoint I don't see any reason his role should be any different from last year. The Raptors were a stellar offensive team and that offensive strength stayed in the playoffs at least until Demar completely lost it. And this is despite Ibaka only showing up for the first two games, FVV missing almost the whole Washington series, and Poeltl becoming nearly unplayable.
          That is a normal collar. Move on, find a new slant.

          Comment


          • Quirk wrote: View Post
            I disagree with this. You are not reducing his minutes, just his usage, and not to zero, but to third on the team. If DeMar can improve his defense and efficiency by taking a step back in terms of shots under Nurse, he can significantly improve his value as a player.

            Yes, if he refused to buy into this, trade him. But I have no reason to believe that he wont as of yet, and no reason to believe trading him will improve the team.

            A) There are many, many stars in the league who are not one of the first two options on offence on their team.
            B) At this stage I see no reason to doubt that Nurse and Masai can convince DeMar to be one of them.


            C)And if we can get Butler or Kawhi for a package based around DeMar, you do it in a heart beat. I just don't see that happening.
            A) Outside of the Warriors who have somewhat of a unique situation with that team and Klay Thompson... name 3 players who fit that description.

            B)Are you fucking serious ? Demar accepting he is better suited to coming in off the bench after being the first option on a 4 year running playoff team. Really ? He would demand a trade out of toronto... and be justified in doing so. It really burns because by him asking out .. the Raps have most likely significantly reduced their leverage in a trade. Shrewd.

            C)Glad to see you have slowly come around to the possibility that Demar is worth more than nothing to anyone.Not that anyone expects a DD for Leonard.. or Butler... or George trade to be likely.. but to use it as reference point says that he has a value between 100% and 0%. If Ujiri can get salvage value of 60 to 70% for DD in the next couple weeks...he is moving on.
            Last edited by Demographic Shift; Wed Jun 20th, 2018, 02:05 PM.

            Comment


            • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
              A) Outside of the Warriors who have somewhat of a unique situation with that team and Klay Thompson... name 3 players who fit that description.

              B)Are you fucking serious ? Demar accepting he is better suited to coming in off the bench after being the first option on a 4 year running playoff team. Really ? Oh yeah.. I stink... put me on the bench coach. He would demand a trade out of toronto... and be justified in doing so.

              C)Glad to see you have slowly come around to the possibility that Demar is worth more than nothing to anyone.Not that anyone expects a DD for Leonard.. or Butler... or George trade to be likely.. but to use it as reference point says that he has a value between 100% and 0%. If Ujiri can get salvage value of 60 to 70% for DD in the next couple weeks...he is moving on.
              A/ Sorry no, it's self evident and I'm not making lists for you that involve figuring the relative salary of all players on each team. Provide a list of the second highest player on each team and we can talk.

              B/ Third highest usage is not coming off the bench.

              C/ Demar is not worth anything to anyone that would make the team better than keeping Demar. You can certainly trade him just to trade him. But why? if you are not getting Butler or Kawhi, who are you targeting? Why does Masai need to "salvage" anything? DeMar is a good player and can play a valuable role.

              Comment


              • Quirk wrote: View Post
                A/ Sorry no, it's self evident and I'm not making lists for you that involve figuring the relative salary of all players on each team. Provide a list of the second highest player on each team and we can talk.

                B/ Third highest usage is not coming off the bench.

                C/ Demar is not worth anything to anyone that would make the team better than keeping Demar. You can certainly trade him just to trade him. But why? if you are not getting Butler or Kawhi, who are you targeting? Why does Masai need to "salvage" anything? DeMar is a good player and can play a valuable role.
                Demar will not accept playing 3rd fiddle to JV and Kyle. Period end of. It's just not dealing in reality, same as shaolins month long crusade on tanking. And as other Scott said, offense is not really the problem.

                Now, you're likely never going to win a championship with demar as your go to usage guy. But that same sentence is true swapping his name for Lowry or jv. I wish we had a better top scorer than demar. So does masai I'm sure. But the answer will not be found in JV or Lowry. I'm SURE nurse will bring the usage of the 3 guys a little closer than Casey had it. But demar will not take a back seat as long as he's a raptor and in his prime.
                It's Klaw Season. Time to hunt.

                Comment


                • Quirk wrote: View Post
                  A/ Sorry no, it's self evident and I'm not making lists for you that involve figuring the relative salary of all players on each team. Provide a list of the second highest player on each team and we can talk.

                  B/ Third highest usage is not coming off the bench.

                  C/ Demar is not worth anything to anyone that would make the team better than keeping Demar. You can certainly trade him just to trade him. But why? if you are not getting Butler or Kawhi, who are you targeting? Why does Masai need to "salvage" anything? DeMar is a good player and can play a valuable role.
                  DeMar ACTIVELY hurts the team, on offense, if you cut his usage. He will not be defended off-ball, so you're playing 4-on-5 on offense with the ball not in his hands.
                  twitter.com/anthonysmdoyle

                  Comment


                  • Quirk wrote: View Post
                    A/ Sorry no, it's self evident and I'm not making lists for you that involve figuring the relative salary of all players on each team. Provide a list of the second highest player on each team and we can talk.

                    B/ Third highest usage is not coming off the bench.

                    C/ Demar is not worth anything to anyone that would make the team better than keeping Demar. You can certainly trade him just to trade him. But why? if you are not getting Butler or Kawhi, who are you targeting? Why does Masai need to "salvage" anything? DeMar is a good player and can play a valuable role.
                    "DeMar is a good player and can play a valuable role" but no one will trade anything of value for him.

                    Are you seeing the problem here? I'm seeing a problem here.

                    Comment


                    • Here's an interesting thought.. what about a DeMar for Blake swap?

                      DeMar gets to play with Casey again. We get a guy that's a bit of a malcontent but actually shows up in the playoffs. Has a better 3pt percentage (on more attempts). Can pass the ball and rebound. Not a good defender but would be better than DeMar. Far more injury prone.

                      But he would be quicker than Serge and would be able to keep up with the Boston bigs like Horford, Morris and Tatum.

                      Downside is we're paying for another year at like $30M a year which is a year outside that window that Masai created.

                      I think Blake would fit a Nurse team better than DeMar would. You move Lowry to SG and Fred to PG.. or try to move Serge for a SG. Maybe a guy like Snell from the Bucks.. the Bucks need a big desperately.

                      Comment


                      • planetmars wrote: View Post
                        Here's an interesting thought.. what about a DeMar for Blake swap?

                        DeMar gets to play with Casey again. We get a guy that's a bit of a malcontent but actually shows up in the playoffs. Has a better 3pt percentage (on more attempts). Can pass the ball and rebound. Not a good defender but would be better than DeMar. Far more injury prone.

                        But he would be quicker than Serge and would be able to keep up with the Boston bigs like Horford, Morris and Tatum.

                        Downside is we're paying for another year at like $30M a year which is a year outside that window that Masai created.

                        I think Blake would fit a Nurse team better than DeMar would. You move Lowry to SG and Fred to PG.. or try to move Serge for a SG. Maybe a guy like Snell from the Bucks.. the Bucks need a big desperately.
                        No thanks. I want to change the format of the team, not move the problems to a different position or make them younger(Wiggins). I want athletic guys who can switch on defense.
                        twitter.com/anthonysmdoyle

                        Comment


                        • Quirk wrote: View Post
                          A/ Sorry no, it's self evident and I'm not making lists for you that involve figuring the relative salary of all players on each team. Provide a list of the second highest player on each team and we can talk.

                          B/ Third highest usage is not coming off the bench.

                          C/ Demar is not worth anything to anyone that would make the team better than keeping Demar. You can certainly trade him just to trade him. But why? if you are not getting Butler or Kawhi, who are you targeting? Why does Masai need to "salvage" anything? DeMar is a good player and can play a valuable role.
                          so on A... you got nuthin.... except some kind of lame ass "I am not looking that up". you said there were many... you can't name 3.

                          on B... thats what pretty much all have been saying but you... DD even with the third highest usage isn't coming off the bench. Not today.. not tomorrow... not next year... not for Pop..... just take a knee on this.

                          on C... your response is an exercise in circumlocution worthy of Sarah Huckabee Sanders defending the latest Trump lie. You start out by saying DD has no value and wind up saying he should stay because he has value but in a diminished role.

                          Inherit lots and lots of money.....you'll need it...
                          Last edited by Demographic Shift; Wed Jun 20th, 2018, 03:13 PM.

                          Comment


                          • Barolt wrote: View Post
                            No thanks. I want to change the format of the team, not move the problems to a different position or make them younger(Wiggins). I want athletic guys who can switch on defense.
                            Only another 30 or so hours before the end of the draft.... should have at least an idea if there is a new direction Ujiri is attempting to take the team in by then if he is able to make a trade or two ...... or .........if he is going to take one more run at it and bring the band back intact....

                            If Demar is back ... I wonder if he starts ?

                            Comment


                            • KeonClark wrote: View Post
                              Demar will not accept playing 3rd fiddle to JV and Kyle.
                              You may be right, but I have no reason to believe this. Has DeMar or anybody who would know commented on this?

                              Comment


                              • Demographic Shift wrote: View Post
                                so on A... you got nuthin.... except some kind of lame ass "I am not looking that up". you said there were many... you can't name 3.

                                on B... thats what pretty much all have been saying but you... DD even with the third highest usage isn't coming off the bench. Not today.. not tomorrow... not next year... not for Pop..... just take a knee on this.

                                on C... your response is an exercise in circumlocution worthy of Sarah Huckabee Sanders defending the latest Trump lie. You start out by saying DD has no value and wind up saying he should stay because he has value but in a diminished role.

                                Inherit lots and lots of money.....you'll need it...
                                a. burden of proof is on you, not me. That no 2nd highest paid player would ever accept a 3rd highest usage role is your argument.
                                b. no idea why you keep talking about him coming of the bench. he will remain a starter.
                                c. I'm saying that you wont get any player better than DeMar, any valuable draft picks or any worthwhile prospects for DeMar, therefore you it makes more sense to keep him. Clear enough?

                                Comment

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