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  • slaw wrote: View Post
    I don't want to be Nurse's apologist necessarily, and I've been pretty vocal about my skepticism to their general approach this year, but a couple of points in the coaching staff's defense.

    The Lin, McCaw, Meeks, Powell lineup was his bench. With Serge. One of the 'big' options he had was starting because someone had another day off.

    It's also the case that he has Gasol and Lin, both of whom have been there for a very short period of time. Now, you can say, 'hey, it's two guys,' but that's 20% of your rotation if you go 10 deep and even more if you don't. It's not insignificant. Add to that he's also faced with a starting lineup that has rarely seen the floor together (and another brand new one last night). Factor in the pretty obvious issue that the Raps are clearly restricting minutes and it becomes increasingly difficult and almost impossible to manufacture 48-minute rotations in any game, let alone over the course of week - forget a month.

    There seems to be an underlying assumption that the whole Leonard load management stuff is a non-issue cause they are still winning and it doesn't matter anyway cause it's the regular season but those assumptions ignore the fact that everything changes when your best player is out. Roles change. Expectations change. Rotations change. Same thing when a guy like Gasol comes in - you don't just add a couple of plays with him at the high post and sit down for celebratory beers. There's a list of dynamics at play a mile long. Nurse is dealing with all that pretty well in my view but managing the chaos they've created won't go perfect all the time.
    I understand all that and I definitely do not envy him, it's not easy dealing with all the injuries, new players and load management he's had to deal with. BUT I do think it's not that hard to ALWAYS have one of Kyle, Pascal or Gasol in the game at all times. And when Kawhi is playing add Kawhi to that group.

    So many teams do it. He's one of the only good teams still playing all bench lineups. And not just all bench lineups but all bench lineups that include like 2 new guys and 3 guys who haven't played much together. It's not going to work. There is no reason to experiment with something like that. It should be even more reason why he HAS to make sure he always has one to two of our best players and best ball handlers in the game at all times.

    In practice today he did acknowledge that he should have done that and he fucked up with rotations last game so that's good to hear. Hopefully that means he won't do this shit again. That's one good difference between him and Casey; Casey would ever accept his faults lol
    I relish negativity and disappointment. It is not healthy. Somebody buy me a pony.

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    • GLF wrote: View Post
      I understand all that and I definitely do not envy him, it's not easy dealing with all the injuries, new players and load management he's had to deal with. BUT I do think it's not that hard to ALWAYS have one of Kyle, Pascal or Gasol in the game at all times. And when Kawhi is playing add Kawhi to that group.

      So many teams do it. He's one of the only good teams still playing all bench lineups. And not just all bench lineups but all bench lineups that include like 2 new guys and 3 guys who haven't played much together. It's not going to work. There is no reason to experiment with something like that. It should be even more reason why he HAS to make sure he always has one to two of our best players and best ball handlers in the game at all times.

      In practice today he did acknowledge that he should have done that and he fucked up with rotations last game so that's good to hear. Hopefully that means he won't do this shit again. That's one good difference between him and Casey; Casey would ever accept his faults lol
      Yeah I agree with this; it's easier said then done but if Leonard is out, in my opinion you slot OG in the starting lineup and try to disrupt the rotation as little as possible. If you don't have OG to backup Siakam because he's starting in place of Leonard, have Ibaka backup Siakam for some minutes for a Gasol + Ibaka look (which is actually something you might see in the playoffs). Or if you'd prefer small ball, go Lowry-Lin-Danny-Siakam-Ibaka, with OG still free to backup Siakam or Danny.

      If you want to get a look at Meeks, slot him in Danny's place with 2 or 3 other starters still anchoring the lineup. If you'd like to give some run to McCaw & Powell, have them in the place of Danny or OG (but preferably not both at the same time). The goal of the team now should be to zero-in on a stable, effective rotation where guys can start to build chemistry around each other.

      Regardless of how one sees the merit of Kawhi being out, as a coach you don't compound the disruption of him not being in by going the other way and running lineups you'll never see the playoffs (like the 4 guard combo of Lin/McCaw/Meeks/Powell).

      Since the beginning of the season, this team never felt like it would work nicely with an all bench unit as it did last season, and that's okay, because in the playoffs you rarely see that anyway. You typically have 2 or 3 starters on the floor at all times anchoring the floor. Even with injuries this team can achieve that, because we have a number of versatile players that can play multiple positions. IMO, you just have to shift the gear from perpetual experimentation to finding your best rotation pattern and honing it so you're on your stride by April.
      2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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      • inthepaint wrote: View Post
        Yeah I agree with this; it's easier said then done but if Leonard is out, in my opinion you slot OG in the starting lineup and try to disrupt the rotation as little as possible. If you don't have OG to backup Siakam because he's starting in place of Leonard, have Ibaka backup Siakam for some minutes for a Gasol + Ibaka look (which is actually something you might see in the playoffs). Or if you'd prefer small ball, go Lowry-Lin-Danny-Siakam-Ibaka, with OG still free to backup Siakam or Danny.

        If you want to get a look at Meeks, slot him in Danny's place with 2 or 3 other starters still anchoring the lineup. If you'd like to give some run to McCaw & Powell, have them in the place of Danny or OG (but preferably not both at the same time). The goal of the team now should be to zero-in on a stable, effective rotation where guys can start to build chemistry around each other.

        Regardless of how one sees the merit of Kawhi being out, as a coach you don't compound the disruption of him not being in by going the other way and running lineups you'll never see the playoffs (like the 4 guard combo of Lin/McCaw/Meeks/Powell).

        Since the beginning of the season, this team never felt like it would work nicely with an all bench unit as it did last season, and that's okay, because in the playoffs you rarely see that anyway. You typically have 2 or 3 starters on the floor at all times anchoring the floor. Even with injuries this team can achieve that, because we have a number of versatile players that can play multiple positions. IMO, you just have to shift the gear from perpetual experimentation to finding your best rotation pattern and honing it so you're on your stride by April.
        This is called structure. All good teams have structure and identity with championship teams have superior talent, structure and identity. We've assembled talent but have yet to establish structure and / or identity. Time is running out.

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        • BTW a team with structure would never put out the line-ups we saw on Sunday.

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          • Zak24gege wrote: View Post
            BTW a team with structure would never put out the line-ups we saw on Sunday.
            Half the team changed at the deadline and Kawhi was out. Look at the roster, I'm not sure what people wanted the bench to look like that game?
            "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

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            • I still don't understand the hockey lineup shit, and if we see it in the playoffs we're not coming out of the East.

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              • S.R. wrote: View Post
                Half the team changed at the deadline and Kawhi was out. Look at the roster, I'm not sure what people wanted the bench to look like that game?
                Ooh, ooh, I can answer that! They wanted one of Lowry or Siakam on the floor at all times. 48 minutes, every single one with Lowry or Siakam. Every game. Every single game.

                What they did not want was playing like 25 different lineups in that game, using the most used lineup for only 9 minutes, and yet STILL going huge stretches without Lowry or Siakam (or even Gasol!) on the floor.
                twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                • As I mentioned on the other thread....

                  The ECF without HCA (most likely the Raps fate) will come down to coaching.

                  Bud vs. Nick - odds of winning goes to Bud.

                  Nick just hope that the talents he possessed will overcome the ultra-talented Greek Freak and his band of 22.01 feet specialists.

                  Because the simplistic coaching strategy with a sprinkle of experimentation and a very stale after time out plays will not produce a winning cuisine

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                  • S.R. wrote: View Post
                    Half the team changed at the deadline and Kawhi was out. Look at the roster, I'm not sure what people wanted the bench to look like that game?
                    Sure, he has no control over how the bench looks like. What he has control over is the decision to play 4 or 5 of them at the same time. I don't think Lowry & Siakam need to play 40+ minutes, but if they're both sitting at the same time, I'd try to have at least Danny & Kawhi o the floor. If Kawhi is out for the game, have Danny with one or two of Ibaka & Gasol.

                    Something like Lin-Danny-OG-Ibaka-Gasol is a lineup that doesn't have any of our all-stars or Siakam, but it's anchored by starter caliber players. Doesn't have a lot of ball handling there, but got two good playmakers/offence initiators in Lin & Gasol, good size, and good 3 & D in Danny/OG. Just an example though.

                    Then when you can, go back to the more traditional lineups with some combo of Lowry/Siakam/Leonard. No lineup will be perfect but if you strive to have it balanced and anchored by 2 or 3 higher caliber players, you will not only brew familiarity/chemistry but you're also on par with what other contending teams are doing ahead of the playoffs.

                    I think Nick knows this though. He's probably taking the time to experiment around Lin/Gasol/Meeks because they just got here, but it won't be long till he settles down on more structure.
                    2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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                    • Everything Nick Nurse

                      With your superstar out and the team not playing well, its not crazy to experiment with lineups and see what may give you a push, especially with 3 new players on the team.

                      On the bright side, Nurse knows it was a mistake and took responsibility for it.

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                      • inthepaint wrote: View Post
                        Sure, he has no control over how the bench looks like. What he has control over is the decision to play 4 or 5 of them at the same time. I don't think Lowry & Siakam need to play 40+ minutes, but if they're both sitting at the same time, I'd try to have at least Danny & Kawhi o the floor. If Kawhi is out for the game, have Danny with one or two of Ibaka & Gasol.

                        Something like Lin-Danny-OG-Ibaka-Gasol is a lineup that doesn't have any of our all-stars or Siakam, but it's anchored by starter caliber players. Doesn't have a lot of ball handling there, but got two good playmakers/offence initiators in Lin & Gasol, good size, and good 3 & D in Danny/OG. Just an example though...I think Nick knows this though. He's probably taking the time to experiment around Lin/Gasol/Meeks because they just got here, but it won't be long till he settles down on more structure.
                        We can all only hope.

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                        • A.I wrote: View Post
                          With your superstar out and the team not playing well, its not crazy to experiment with lineups and see what may give you a push, especially with 3 new players on the team.

                          On the bright side, Nurse knows it was a mistake and took responsibility for it.
                          I typically don't listen to post game interviews. Is that what happened?

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                          • Nurse on Lin and Gasol after practice this morning:

                            “There were maybe five situations in the film room today where we were going over stuff we weren’t sure we’ve quite gone over with those guys. Defensively, mostly,” Nurse said. “There’s so many little things that you’re doing when you’re switching, and this, and that, and you’re over, you’re picking up at this point, and you’re not picking up at this point. So, a lot of nuances there that we continue to teach them.

                            “I thought we had a good learning day. Not only for the short term but the long term. We did a lot, a lot of film today on a lot, a lot of topics. Some on last night, some tomorrow night, and some not related to last night or tomorrow night — relating to the long term.”

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                            • G__Deane wrote: View Post
                              Nurse on Lin and Gasol after practice this morning:

                              “There were maybe five situations in the film room today where we were going over stuff we weren’t sure we’ve quite gone over with those guys. Defensively, mostly,” Nurse said. “There’s so many little things that you’re doing when you’re switching, and this, and that, and you’re over, you’re picking up at this point, and you’re not picking up at this point. So, a lot of nuances there that we continue to teach them.

                              “I thought we had a good learning day. Not only for the short term but the long term. We did a lot, a lot of film today on a lot, a lot of topics. Some on last night, some tomorrow night, and some not related to last night or tomorrow night — relating to the long term.”
                              Awesome. Now continue to play Lin & Gasol along with Danny/Siakam/Kawhi, instead of Norm/McCaw/Meeks, so they can implement all this film learning on the court
                              2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

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                              • Can we give Nick Nurse some credit? Its a make or miss league, but he generates great open 3s in his offense. Also we saw some very good ball movement and plays today. The play where theres a double screen up top (Lowry being the 2nd screener) always leads to good results: Kawhi got a wide open dunk.

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