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Game 23: Golden State Warriors (15-8) 128 - Toronto Raptors 131 (19-4)

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  • Truth Teller wrote: View Post
    Siakam is getting more hype than OG.
    Why wouldn't he?

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    • So Webber made an interesting point last night, that we don't often talk about.

      I'm paraphrasing, but the gist of it was that late in the 4th quarter, "open shots" simply aren't good enough. You need your best players taking the best shots. This might've been said around the 6 minute mark of the 4th when Durant was single-handedly cutting into the lead, and OG was repeatedly clanking wide open 3s.

      Do you think this is something Nurse addresses? Or is any open shot a good shot at any point in time?

      Comment


      • Nilanka wrote: View Post
        So Webber made an interesting point last night, that we don't often talk about.

        I'm paraphrasing, but the gist of it was that late in the 4th quarter, "open shots" simply aren't good enough. You need your best players taking the best shots. This might've been said around the 6 minute mark of the 4th when Durant was single-handedly cutting into the lead, and OG was repeatedly clanking wide open 3s.

        Do you think this is something Nurse addresses? Or is any open shot a good shot at any point in time?
        Well, ideally you get your best players the best shots. It's just that those specific shots are the ones the defence should be trying to prevent as priority one. Durant wasn't really getting great looks (he got a few, but not many). He was hitting everything, is all.
        twitter.com/dhackett1565

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        • rocwell wrote: View Post
          He needs to be more active. Drink a redbull before the game or something.
          It was a rough game for him, and I was screaming at him when he was giving up offensive boards on top of the rest of it. But sadly we'll see this JV a lot more often if he continues to play with these bench units he doesn't fit in.
          twitter.com/dhackett1565

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          • DanH wrote: View Post
            Well, ideally you get your best players the best shots. It's just that those specific shots are the ones the defence should be trying to prevent as priority one. Durant wasn't really getting great looks (he got a few, but not many). He was hitting everything, is all.
            Sure, but if this was a Game 7, do we want OG taking those shots, or do we want him to ease up, and continue to move the ball, allowing the offense to create a better opportunity for Lowry, Kawhi or Ibaka?

            Assuming there's enough time on the clock, of course.

            Comment


            • Nilanka wrote: View Post
              So Webber made an interesting point last night, that we don't often talk about.

              I'm paraphrasing, but the gist of it was that late in the 4th quarter, "open shots" simply aren't good enough. You need your best players taking the best shots. This might've been said around the 6 minute mark of the 4th when Durant was cutting into the lead, and OG was repeatedly clanking wide open 3s.

              Do you think this is something Nurse addresses? Or is any open shot a good shot at any point in time?
              I would say we've spent most of the last 3-4 talking about this all the time and that this board disagreed with Webber.

              Personally, I think it's nuanced. You need to try and continue running your best stuff but in such a way that you end up with your best guys with the ball in their optimal spots. However, you ultimately need other guys to make shots. It's why guys like Steve Kerr, Michael Cooper, Danny Ainge, Korver, Jason Terry were so valuable to championship teams: your best guy can't always get a look.

              Comment


              • slaw wrote: View Post
                I would say we've spent most of the last 3-4 talking about this all the time and that this board disagreed with Webber.

                Personally, I think it's nuanced. You need to try and continue running your best stuff but in such a way that you end up with your best guys with the ball in their optimal spots. However, you ultimately need other guys to make shots. It's why guys like Steve Kerr, Michael Cooper, Danny Ainge, Korver, Jason Terry were so valuable to championship teams: your best guy can't always get a look.
                We've been talking about force feeding your stars ISO possessions, but I don't think that's what Webber was eluding to.

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                • DanH wrote: View Post
                  Well, ideally you get your best players the best shots. It's just that those specific shots are the ones the defence should be trying to prevent as priority one. Durant wasn't really getting great looks (he got a few, but not many). He was hitting everything, is all.
                  Yeah, a good shot for Durant is a turnaround fadeaway from the corner with 2-time DPOY guarding you with his massive hand in your face. That shot was effing ridiculous. Great play call by Kerr.

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                  • Nilanka wrote: View Post
                    We've been talking about force feeding your stars ISO possessions, but I don't think that's what Webber was eluding to.
                    But if you need, need your best players to get the shot then that is what it means. You can't run a motion offence and plan having Leonard get the ball annd the shot that way.

                    Anyway, based on Nurse's and Green's comments post game, I'd expect to see them keep moving the ball and taking the best available shot.

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                      • slaw wrote: View Post
                        But if you need, need your best players to get the shot then that is what it means. You can't run a motion offence and plan having Leonard get the ball annd the shot that way.

                        Anyway, based on Nurse's and Green's comments post game, I'd expect to see them keep moving the ball and taking the best available shot.
                        Yeah, you run your offense to get the defense slightly off-balance to open up a seam for driving, or get a mismatch or space for a shot for your best players. If the offense is running properly, the ball should eventually find your main guys in their spots. The problem is when you have Kawhi bring the ball up and pound it for 15 seconds, trying to create space against a set defense with everybody in the building knowing he's not passing it.

                        Comment


                        • Headliner again: http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...oronto-raptors

                          Kawhi and Green seeping out confidence that they are both winners in big moments, seeing rest of the Raptors trying to absorb that as the season progresses.

                          Comment


                          • slaw wrote: View Post
                            I would say we've spent most of the last 3-4 talking about this all the time and that this board disagreed with Webber.

                            Personally, I think it's nuanced. You need to try and continue running your best stuff but in such a way that you end up with your best guys with the ball in their optimal spots. However, you ultimately need other guys to make shots. It's why guys like Steve Kerr, Michael Cooper, Danny Ainge, Korver, Jason Terry were so valuable to championship teams: your best guy can't always get a look.
                            Big Shot Bob! Derek Fisher! A lot of NBA Finals highlights are actually role players drilling big shots, but the narrative of "just give it to your best player and he should shoot it" is persistent and something that's dogged Lebron his entire career. People get mad at him for passing to Kevin Love for an open 3 off the drive & kick if Love misses. If Love hits it, it's another great basketball play by Lebron James. If Love misses, James is not clutch, not Jordan, not a scorer. One thing I respect about Lebron is that he insists he'll make the right basketball play every time. Personally that's what I think should happen. What was the difference between OG clanking 3's and Danny Green hitting a big one in OT? Nothing other than one guy missed and one guy hit it.

                            A guy like Durant who can hit shots like he can against defence like that - that's really rare. Lowry and Leonard were both getting their drives snuffed out with some regularity in crunch time, they had to move the ball and the teammates need to hit their shots. (Leonard's got a really nice fadeaway tho.)

                            For fans, I think a lot of it's psychological. If you've got a great best player and he takes your shot and just misses, you're maybe okay with that. If a role player gets the season-on-the-line shot and misses, half the fan base hates him.
                            "We're playing in a building." -- Kawhi Leonard

                            Comment


                            • The Claw Reborn wrote: View Post
                              Headliner again: http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...oronto-raptors

                              Kawhi and Green seeping out confidence that they are both winners in big moments, seeing rest of the Raptors trying to absorb that as the season progresses.
                              This is kind of the gist of it.

                              The win pushed the Raptors to an NBA-best 19-4 this season and improved their current winning streak to a season-best seven games. But it also exposed all of the flaws that have so many questioning whether Toronto -- despite its record -- truly is the favorite to get out of the East.

                              Kyle Lowry, one of the main culprits in those collapses of the past, didn't allow himself to shoot a wide-open 3-pointer with three minutes to go, and was a dismal 4-for-14 on the night. Toronto, in general, felt like a team that was struggling to breathe as it attempted to move to heights it hadn't reached before.

                              But this time, the Raptors had a pair of players, in Leonard and Green, who have been in every possible situation on a basketball court before. They've played in the crucible that is the NBA Finals -- and came out the other side with rings on their fingers.

                              Comment


                              • Nilanka wrote: View Post
                                So Webber made an interesting point last night, that we don't often talk about.

                                I'm paraphrasing, but the gist of it was that late in the 4th quarter, "open shots" simply aren't good enough. You need your best players taking the best shots. This might've been said around the 6 minute mark of the 4th when Durant was single-handedly cutting into the lead, and OG was repeatedly clanking wide open 3s.

                                Do you think this is something Nurse addresses? Or is any open shot a good shot at any point in time?
                                As my coach use to say
                                1. I will never get mad at anyone for taking a open shot if we miss go back on defence
                                2. Hit your open shots

                                Comment

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