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2018-19 Trade Rumours and Discussion - Deadline February 7th 2019

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  • inthepaint wrote: View Post
    There's one thing real here to remember, which was actually said by Davis: He wants to go to a contender. Period.

    Now, I know he doesn't get to choose right away where he'll land, the Pels do, and they'll do what's best for their team, but this something to keep in mind: Whichever team acquire Davis we'll have to put forth significant assets, and if they don't remain a contender after doing so, Davis will remain unhappy and will want out of there as well.

    In other words, after you gut your team to get Davis, you better still be contending afterwards, otherwise you're no better than New Orleans right now, and he'll bail.

    Teams that don't have the assets to stay a contender AFTER gutting themselves to get Davis have less incentive to go after him because of that. Davis doesn't want go to a place that maaaybe will have Zion or maybe this or that. He wants to contend now, he's in his prime.

    Both the Knicks & Clippers would be the New NOLA if they get Davis. Knicks would have to include (Porzingis + Pick or Knox), Clips would have to gut themselves to the core just to get NOLA to pick up the phone. The main reason they're on this conversation is because they're in NY & LA and the hype machine doesn't sleep.

    Personally I think there's just about 8 or 9 teams that could give up significant assets and still contend with Davis (meaning hold on to a top 10ish player in the league + some solid role players AND add Davis:

    Raptors (best fit of them all)
    Golden State
    Nuggets (Maybe, depending on how you see Jokic)
    OKC
    Portland
    Bucks
    Philly
    Lakers
    Celtics (can't do it till the summer)

    (Now if someone could give reasons to eliminate everyone on this list but the Raps that would be awesome )

    Any other team that tries would be the new Pelicans. Davis plus no one. They would have to convince Davis that they'll either sign another star or draft a stud to play with him some day, which NOLA itself has been trying to tell him for years, and it didn't work.
    I'm not at all sure the list is as big as you make it. How do most of those teams get it done?

    The first factor here is how willing NOP will be willing to deal him within the conference. If they are, do they charge a higher price?

    Remember, Davis is making it known he basically wants to play for a contender. So any team trading for him can't look like the same kind of team he just left after they give up pieces in a trade.

    And if the price is too high for the in conference teams, can any team in the East really outbid Toronto? It would be a much bigger disruption for either Boston or Philly than it would for us.

    Philly would have to trade one of Simmons or Embiid. If they traded Simmons they'd be left with two bigs and no ballhandler/playmaker. If they trade Embiid, are they really any better off? Those guys are probably the top 2 bigs in the game. They would still have all the same holes they have now, basically. They need shooters and role players.

    Boston would have to trade Irving to be able to do it, and NOP would not value that since he'll walk, so it would take adding much more to the deal. Would they give up Tatum? If not, does Brown interest them more than Siakam? And can they afford to take that kind of hit to their perimeter offence? If they didn't have the Irving problem, I'd put them as frontrunners, but with that in mind it becomes tricky.

    Don't think the Bucks have anything of interest. Brogdon's a good young piece, but he's not nearly enough. They still don't have that much perimeter depth, so can they afford to also part ways with Middleton? Does NOP care since Middleton seems to have a player option and could walk?

    I don't know how "great" Toronto's offer can be, but it could realistically be better than what any other team is willing or able to offer. One of the things about our young pieces is that they are all on rookie deals or relatively small contracts by today's standards, and we can afford to give up 2 or 3 of them and still have enough depth/talent around our core.

    Comment


    • white men can't jump wrote: View Post
      I'm not at all sure the list is as big as you make it. How do most of those teams get it done?

      The first factor here is how willing NOP will be willing to deal him within the conference. If they are, do they charge a higher price?

      Remember, Davis is making it known he basically wants to play for a contender. So any team trading for him can't look like the same kind of team he just left after they give up pieces in a trade.

      And if the price is too high for the in conference teams, can any team in the East really outbid Toronto? It would be a much bigger disruption for either Boston or Philly than it would for us.

      Philly would have to trade one of Simmons or Embiid. If they traded Simmons they'd be left with two bigs and no ballhandler/playmaker. If they trade Embiid, are they really any better off? Those guys are probably the top 2 bigs in the game. They would still have all the same holes they have now, basically. They need shooters and role players.

      Boston would have to trade Irving to be able to do it, and NOP would not value that since he'll walk, so it would take adding much more to the deal. Would they give up Tatum? If not, does Brown interest them more than Siakam? And can they afford to take that kind of hit to their perimeter offence? If they didn't have the Irving problem, I'd put them as frontrunners, but with that in mind it becomes tricky.

      Don't think the Bucks have anything of interest. Brogdon's a good young piece, but he's not nearly enough. They still don't have that much perimeter depth, so can they afford to also part ways with Middleton? Does NOP care since Middleton seems to have a player option and could walk?

      I don't know how "great" Toronto's offer can be, but it could realistically be better than what any other team is willing or able to offer. One of the things about our young pieces is that they are all on rookie deals or relatively small contracts by today's standards, and we can afford to give up 2 or 3 of them and still have enough depth/talent around our core.
      Oh sure, I'd love if that list was smaller and it probably is, those are just teams that would be a step above NOP for Davis if he came, but it's very much arguable if they would all be able to get it done.

      The point in bold is precisely the point of my post and I totally agree. I think a lot of people are ignoring that when the put teams like Kings, Knicks or Clippers in the mix.

      Agreed with your point re: Philly and also the asking price for western teams being higher. If NOP is smart they should try to move him to the East.

      I hope I'm wrong but I think unfortunately the Bucks could do it. They're in a position analogous to the Raps in the sense that they are a contender in the East that can throw the kitchen sink at NOP (everything but Giannis), and arguably be better off after. If they do Middleton, Brogdon, Lopez and Illyasova that works salarywise. That's 3 starters on the top team in the league now, so that would be hard to beat, It'd be risky for them to do that because they're already doing really well, but the flipside is they'd have Giannis + AD on the same team, and would beat other offers with a package like that without probably having to include any picks. They could probably throw Divicenzo or Thon Maker in it who wants out of there anyway, which NOP would value after losing AD as a big. Again, I hope I'm wrong.

      Masai definitely needs to be on this, if anything to try to drive the price up for other teams.
      2019 NBA Champions. Glad to have doubted the doubters.

      Comment


      • It's possible, Demps is no Rocket Sugeon, but NO shouldn't be acting on AD demands.

        NO should get the best deal they can, if that's Cleveland you take it. Fuck'em

        The compelling reason to believe it isn't PHX CLE and their ilk is that their assets are future picks that are diminished by AD raising those teams out of the lottery. Still leaves the 15 in the playoff picture and the 6 teams in the hunt minus the Celtics.

        We gotta dodge the thirsty GMs in the mushy middle tripping over themselves to give away picks they shouldn't and role players that make their teams go.

        Comment


        • Woj wrote:
          multiple league sources expect the agent and star to soon deliver word throughout the league that Davis' preferred destination is the Lakers and he'll become a rental player until 2020 with a trade anywhere else.
          http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/2...al-overwhelmed

          Comment


          • That's the last lever, in the 'good guy' toolkit.

            Should scare most of the mushy middle off. Now we hope Demps is big mad and MU Nolans him.

            Comment


            • Kawhi and AD would be so ridiculous together and if Masai can swing it without giving up KL or KL, he pretty much has to. If they could keep Siakam -- it'd be unbelievable. It's crazy that we'll likely be one of the few teams closest in the hunt. Our win now mode just makes total sense to continue to push our chips in, as we did in trading for Kawhi.

              All that said... there's something that concerns me about our hopes of retaining AD, more so than with Kawhi. ... I'd imagine I'm much more optimistic than the average poster that we have a good chance to keep Kawhi if our post-season goes well. I genuinely believe Kawhi will put value on a strong team culture and winning. He doesn't wanna go join Lebron. (If he wants to be near his daughter in Cali, not much we can do there.)

              AD on the other hand... I feel like he's in cahoots with Lebron, and I can almost guarantee Lebron's also selling him on "Come to LA and we'll be in SPACE JAM together, and they'll build a bit of an empire that'll have an afterlife once their NBA careers are done. I think THE BROW is definitely enticed by all that. Which means that there'd be much more likelihood of an inability on our part to sway him to resign here when the time comes.

              Considering I still believe Kawhi could stay with the rest of the squad as it currently stands, it concerns me somewhat to clear out the cupboards entirely for AD. ... If we don't get AD and we're just dealing with Kawhi, maaaaaybe Kawhi stays long term and our team looks somewhat like it does now for some years ahead, with youth stepping up and replacing Lowry/Serge. If AD leaves, and we've lost all our youth/depth... perhaps Kawhi would be soon to follow.

              That said, AD having another year on his contract makes a huge difference and if you could get two playoff runs with those two together, how could you possibly say no to that. And Kawhi may obviously be much more likely to stay if we pair him with another superstar, no doubt about it.

              Gonna be interesting to see how this plays out. Wow.

              Apologies for multi-directional rambling...

              We're all gonna be like cats chasing our tails until there's a conclusion.

              Comment


              • https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aURWvsQR8g

                really hope AD comes to torotno

                trade everybody except Kawhi and Danny G, it don't matter

                Comment


                • Kawhisexual wrote: View Post
                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aURWvsQR8g

                  really hope AD comes to torotno

                  trade everybody except Kawhi and Danny G, it don't matter
                  Every BB Youtuber seems to do the same thing, borderline shout as if it's exciting/dramatic... Cringeworthy.
                  Official Pope of the Raptors sponsored by MLSE.

                  Comment


                  • GOLDBLUM wrote: View Post
                    ...That said, AD having another year on his contract makes a huge difference and if you could get two playoff runs with those two together, how could you possibly say no to that. And Kawhi may obviously be much more likely to stay if we pair him with another superstar, no doubt about it....
                    This is the biggest consideration, in my opinion. Having AD for two championship runs would move the needle for Kawhi to stay for another year. Quite frankly you could promise to move both players for picks/prospects in the second year at the trade deadline if it looks like you aren't going to win a second trophy, thereby accelerating your rebuild. AD with two seasons of playoff runs makes this a no brainer.

                    With Kawhi and AD on board this season, how hard is it going to be to grab extra talent off of waivers? It will be like Cousins going to Golden State. They will be knocking on the door.

                    Comment


                    • bertarapsfan wrote: View Post
                      id rather he goes to LA then boston
                      Is neither the third option? Both would suck

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                      • Comment


                        • A.I wrote: View Post
                          So if he doesn’t get traded to LA right away and has to sign there in a few years, Lebron will be 37 and almost into retirement and AD is back into the same situation as he is in NO and not playing for a contender.
                          The difference being that the Lakers have always been a free agent draw while the Pelicans are considered an NBA oddity with perennial low attendance.

                          Comment


                          • Lebron and Rich Paul have out-smarted the NBA and there's absolutely nothing they can do about it. The tampering and conflict of interest is so blatant, yet they are 100% within the rules because Lebron & Rich Paul aren't technically related parties.

                            I will say this: if Lebron ever decides to go into politics one day, he could be very successful. The guy is highly intelligent.

                            Comment


                            • Wonder where the knicks pick ends up. If it’s 1 or 2 their offer is a lot stronger.

                              Porzingis and Zion or RJ is a pretty good offer.

                              But they won’t know the pick until after the trade deadline.

                              Comment


                              • golden wrote: View Post

                                I will say this: if Lebron ever decides to go into politics one day, he could be very successful. The guy is highly intelligent.
                                can you please explain for guys like me who don't understand fully what's going on

                                Comment

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