Everything Marc Gasol

[DanH]

Is Serge that awful against starting bigs? He was our starter from when we traded JV up until near the playoffs if I'm remembering correctly (admittedly I'm foggy there). We still managed to get the second seed.

I mean, he's not awful, but he's a significant step down from Gasol.

Last year:

Starters with Serge: 547 MP, +9 net rating
Starters with Gasol: 161 MP, +14 net rating
Starters with JV: 140 MP, +21 net rating

The starters had three all star calibre players and one of the top 3+D players in the league. But they were far better with both Gasol and JV than with Serge. This year we have no Leonard to make up for Serge's mediocrity. And worth noting what happened to Serge's numbers when Nurse couldn't pick and choose his matchups and he had to deal with the bigger starting C's out there:

Starters with Serge between Dec 14th to Feb 7th: 134 MP, -3 net rating (this is even filtering out the time Lowry missed as it's the same starter lineup as above)

As for making the 2nd seed, the Raptors were 2nd seed with Scola starting and he sure wasn't a starting quality PF.

The Raptors can survive with Serge starting at C. But they are pretty definitively worse playing him as their starting C when they have Gasol just sitting there.

[LJ2]

Well, a) Serge can't handle starting bigs. He's a bench player through and through.

And b) if you are going to rest Gasol, give him the night off. Why waste his minutes in bench units that struggle to shoot and lose games because you're getting caved in with Serge playing against starting bigs? If you are going to throw games for rest, just sit Gasol and Lowry and give yourself a preview of the future with FVV, OG and Siakam being asked to carry the team and see if younger pieces like Boucher, Davis, Thomas can fill in and take on bigger roles in the rotation for a night.

Is Serge that awful against starting bigs? He was our starter from when we traded JV up until near the playoffs if I'm remembering correctly (admittedly I'm foggy there). We still managed to get the second seed.

[bertarapsfan]

It doesnt seem like we are going to use platooning centers either. I guess most of the teams we faced so far started traditional centers aside from brook who marc already played 6 games against in playoffs

[DanH]

I doubt it happens, but I wonder if Nurse would try it at some point in the season to rest Gasol for the playoffs. Let Serge handle the starting bigs for a little while. Gasol to his credit seems to be in good shape, but he hasn't event taken a break from the summer games.

Well, a) Serge can't handle starting bigs. He's a bench player through and through.

And b) if you are going to rest Gasol, give him the night off. Why waste his minutes in bench units that struggle to shoot and lose games because you're getting caved in with Serge playing against starting bigs? If you are going to throw games for rest, just sit Gasol and Lowry and give yourself a preview of the future with FVV, OG and Siakam being asked to carry the team and see if younger pieces like Boucher, Davis, Thomas can fill in and take on bigger roles in the rotation for a night.

[LJ2]

[QUOTE=DanH;n1319959]

I doubt it happens, but I wonder if Nurse would try it at some point in the season to rest Gasol for the playoffs. Let Serge handle the starting bigs for a little while. Gasol to his credit seems to be in good shape, but he hasn't event taken a break from the summer games.

[KeonClark]

So long he keeps dragging his ass to a team-best +13 net rating, I don't think it's going to work.

I'm on team DanH/Marc Gasol. Dude helps wins possessions, he's the Lowry of centers.

[jacobdr4]

I think Marc just wants to come off the bench and will drag his ass until Nurse replaces him with Serge in the starting line up

Marc doesn’t make any sense with the bench. We need his passing in the starting lineup and Serge’s willingness to shoot with the bench.

[DanH]

I think Marc just wants to come off the bench and will drag his ass until Nurse replaces him with Serge in the starting line up

So long he keeps dragging his ass to a team-best +13 net rating, I don't think it's going to work.

[LJ2]

I think Marc just wants to come off the bench and will drag his ass until Nurse replaces him with Serge in the starting line up

[Puffer]

The Kings game was a nice turnaround for Marc. I would say he is on the right path in terms of figuring out what he has to do and how he has to play. As was mentioned in an article I read in the Morning Coffee segment, other players are figuring out how to play with Marc. They have a better idea of when to cut, how to move after a pass and are making themselves available. Both to free themselves up for a pass from Marc and to free themselves for the pass that comes after a pass from Marc to someone on the other side of the court.

[Puffer]

I think Gasol is missing Danny and Kawhi, and is working hard to implement Nurses preferred approach, as they worked on it in the preseason. He as much as said this in an interview. I think in another ten games, it is not an issue. By then the guys that are playing together will have worked things out. Just my opinion, but Gasol is a high bball IQ player. He has had tremendous success personally and working with teammates in the past. They will sort this out as a team, with the help of Nurse and staff.

[inthepaint]

Gasol will receive the ball at the top of the arc (or a step inside the line) and, while wide open, turn and swing the ball to a teammate who has a defender in close proximity. Gasol needs to turn and shoot far more of those shots to pull defenders out to him. Also, he hit 44% from deep with this team last year - shoot those shots!

Yep. In Memphis he used to set those high screens (usually to Conley) closer to the elbow, then "roll out"/pop back to the 3pt line. When the defender would follow Gasol on a switch, Conley would drop a floater on the lane. When they tried to contain Conley, he would pass it to Gasol on the 3pt line, and he would either shoot without hesitation, or if another wing defender would come flying at him to contest, he would hit a cutter or another open big in the paint. That action kept Memphis going for years and got them a lot of buckets.

I notice the screens he's been setting here are far out and really high, so even though it gets our ballhandler in, when he (the ballhandler) gets near the paint he's got his defender AND Gasol's defender waiting for him, so they continue to dribble, running the clock down and putting little to no stress on the opposing defence.

[S.R.]

Yeah, it's those high leverage make-or-break moments when the opposition amps up the defense to get the knockout punch or stay in the fight. I mean Gasol is swinging the ball so fast that he's actually achieving the opposite of what he's trying to accomplish, which is to catch the defense off-guard and make scoring easier for his teammates. Those pretty looking touch passes are so predictable now that defenders can roam off him with impunity. The opposition has figured out how to use Gasol's strength against us.

Gasol will receive the ball at the top of the arc (or a step inside the line) and, while wide open, turn and swing the ball to a teammate who has a defender in close proximity. Gasol needs to turn and shoot far more of those shots to pull defenders out to him. Also, he hit 44% from deep with this team last year - shoot those shots!

[DanH]

Yeah, it's those high leverage make-or-break moments when the opposition amps up the defense to get the knockout punch or stay in the fight. I mean Gasol is swinging the ball so fast that he's actually achieving the opposite of what he's trying to accomplish, which is to catch the defense off-guard and make scoring easier for his teammates. Those pretty looking touch passes are so predictable now that defenders can roam off him with impunity. The opposition has figured out how to use Gasol's strength against us.

It's very early in the season, so not a lot of clutch minutes yet. Super small samples here, hard to project forward. But in terms of talking about how the offence has functioned so far, in the few clutch minutes they have actually played?

Player | Clutch Minutes | ORTG | DRTG
Gasol: 15 MP, 130 ORTG, 86 DRTG
Ibaka: 6 MP, 22 ORTG, 109 DRTG

Impossible to project those tiny samples, but the clutch minutes they have played with Gasol they have scored with ease.

[DanH]

Just curious, are you able to tell with whom Gasol is typically sharing the floor with when this high-end net rating is generated? Like, is he typically beside high scoring guys like Siakam and Lowry, or is that happening when he shares the floor with guys like Davis & Norm as well?

I was also curious to see what the team net rating would be when Ibaka is playing with the same guys Gasol typically plays with. Probably hard to tell this early in the season because the samples are so small, but I'd be nice to be able to compare apples to apples.

Samples are small, but yes, I checked all that before posting the numbers so that I wouldn't be presenting some teammate effect. Same story when only looking at "starter" minutes.

Lowry-Siakam-Gasol: 119 MP, 111 ORTG, 98 DRTG
Lowry-Siakam-Ibaka: 58 MP, 92 ORTG, 95 DRTG
Starters with Gasol: 102 MP, 116 ORTG, 98 DRTG
Starters with Ibaka: 18 MP, 68 ORTG, 98 DRTG