Game #64 Raptors (46-17) @ Pistons (29-31); Sunday Mar. 3rd at 6pm EDT on TSN4

[Ebonhawke]

It's GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAME Day!
Honey, can we eat early....or late .... I got something I need to do from 6-8:00

Pizza and wings in front of the TV

[3inthekeon]

I'm not taking the Pistons as lightly as some here. They're now 8-2 over their last 10. This is from the last Athletic power rankings, prior to their wins over Indy and Cavs and their loss in San Antonio.

They’ve won six of their previous games and their schedule is set up to be very advantageous the rest of the season. That’s especially the case when you look at Brooklyn having the fifth toughest schedule remaining. During this stretch, the Pistons’ “big three” is clicking like Stan Van Gundy envisioned when he made the Blake Griffin trade last season. Here’s how Griffin, Andre Drummond, and Reggie Jackson have been during the last seven games:

Griffin: 24.3 points, 6.3 rebounds, 5.3 assists, +17.9 points per 100 possessions
Drummond: 23.4 points, 16.7 rebounds, 2.3 steals, 2.4 blocks, +23.8 points per 100 possessions
Jackson: 18.9 points, 5.1 assists, 50.0/45.0/92.3 shooting splits, +18.0 points per 100 possessions

[G__Deane]

Detroit destroyed the Cavs 129-92 last night. Time to bring them crashing back to earth tonight ....

[Jclaw]

This isn’t a definitive argument about anything but it’s an interesting insight on the state of roster building right now

Don’t tell anyone. People would think being smart is the advantage, and that losing on purpose creates a rut that teams can’t get out of... and that you lose your job before see it through. The majority of teams in lottery have new guys in-charge in last few yrs...or will. https://t.co/V2rUcMtzXw

— Chris Vernon (@ChrisVernonShow) March 2, 2019

[planetmars]

This isn’t a definitive argument about anything but it’s an interesting insight on the state of roster building right now

Being in the lottery is important if you need to rebuild. Lottery tickets and prospects are useful even if you don't hang on to them. BC's core were all lottery picks (DeMar, JV, Ross). Lowry was traded for a lottery pick. So I wouldn't say tanking is not a useful way to get better. It's how you use the lottery to get better that's important.

Masai got a lottery pick in the Barg trade as it looked like he was rebuilding when he got here. He ended up shipping that pick (Poeltl) with DeMar to get Kawhi. He shipped Ross for Ibaka. Got Gasol for JV.

Plus a rookie contract is a very good resource to have from a financial perspective.. especially if they are good. A rookie contract is typically a below market deal. That opens up the cap space to make beneficial moves for the organization (whether that is more cap space in free agency, or just having cap space to make lop sided trades for teams starving for cap space).

[consmap]

I missed the last two games and we won both. Should I watch this one?

[planetmars]

Is this Lebron giving up?

LeBron activating 2011 NBA Finals mode on this play pic.twitter.com/UmQlYMef1P

— NOTSportsCenter (@NOTSportsCenter) March 3, 2019

[Superjudge]

Lovin it Maury. It's in the bag!!

Who used to do these in the past, they used to be actually impressive, now they suck.

[RaptorsVictim]

I missed the last two games and we won both. Should I watch this one?

Let us see if you just listen to the game, what will happen ?

[MixxAOR]

This isn’t a definitive argument about anything but it’s an interesting insight on the state of roster building right now

Don’t tell anyone. People would think being smart is the advantage, and that losing on purpose creates a rut that teams can’t get out of... and that you lose your job before see it through. The majority of teams in lottery have new guys in-charge in last few yrs...or will. https://t.co/V2rUcMtzXw

— Chris Vernon (@ChrisVernonShow) March 2, 2019

Tanking devours its children

[KeonClark]

Being in the lottery is important if you need to rebuild. Lottery tickets and prospects are useful even if you don't hang on to them. BC's core were all lottery picks (DeMar, JV, Ross). Lowry was traded for a lottery pick. So I wouldn't say tanking is not a useful way to get better. It's how you use the lottery to get better that's important.

Masai got a lottery pick in the Barg trade as it looked like he was rebuilding when he got here. He ended up shipping that pick (Poeltl) with DeMar to get Kawhi. He shipped Ross for Ibaka. Got Gasol for JV.

Plus a rookie contract is a very good resource to have from a financial perspective.. especially if they are good. A rookie contract is typically a below market deal. That opens up the cap space to make beneficial moves for the organization (whether that is more cap space in free agency, or just having cap space to make lop sided trades for teams starving for cap space).

Sure, lottery picks are useful, but what you're describing is more good scouting and good intelligence than needing the picks. The Lowry pick was a good TRADE. The poeltl and demar was a good TRADE, not like Poeltl was some stud. Ross for Ibaka was a good TRADE. I THINK Gasol was a good trade...

Warriors don't get enough credit for their drafting. And the trades they didn't make. Remember when they turned down Thompson for Love? How many more trades that like that have we not even heard of? Yes, alas, what each of these top 5 teams have in common is their ability to find franchise players outside of the top 5 or top 10, and elite level trading. Heck, Masai's imprints are still on the Nuggets, when you trace the lineage back.

Tanking is overrated. The "genius" Hinkie basically sold off every possible decent asset, got as bad as possible, then basically would only draft highest ceiling available or euro stash guys. Wow what a genius . 4 years of absolute brutal pain to become the Easts 4th seed. Hooray.

[golden]

This isn’t a definitive argument about anything but it’s an interesting insight on the state of roster building right now

Don’t tell anyone. People would think being smart is the advantage, and that losing on purpose creates a rut that teams can’t get out of... and that you lose your job before see it through. The majority of teams in lottery have new guys in-charge in last few yrs...or will. https://t.co/V2rUcMtzXw

— Chris Vernon (@ChrisVernonShow) March 2, 2019

It is the definitive argument. Losing on purpose (aka "tanking") is a desperate last-ditch strategy employed by bad ownership and sub-par front offices who are bad at talent evaluation and building winning cultures. Getting a top 5 pick can't fix the bad ownership and sub-par front offices. Clippers are another team that's probably going to rise up without tanking, after changing their ownership and revamping their front-office.

[DogeLover1234]

This isn’t a definitive argument about anything but it’s an interesting insight on the state of roster building right now

Don’t tell anyone. People would think being smart is the advantage, and that losing on purpose creates a rut that teams can’t get out of... and that you lose your job before see it through. The majority of teams in lottery have new guys in-charge in last few yrs...or will. https://t.co/V2rUcMtzXw

— Chris Vernon (@ChrisVernonShow) March 2, 2019

I mean the Bucks did draft Jabari Parker second overall and GSW did tank to keep their pick which ended up being Harrison Barnes. Still, I think the point should be that there are multiple ways to build a contender, and the management staff, development team, luck, culture etc. matters more than the actual team building plan.

[inthepaint]

Sure, lottery picks are useful, but what you're describing is more good scouting and good intelligence than needing the picks. The Lowry pick was a good TRADE. The poeltl and demar was a good TRADE, not like Poeltl was some stud. Ross for Ibaka was a good TRADE. I THINK Gasol was a good trade...

Warriors don't get enough credit for their drafting. And the trades they didn't make. Remember when they turned down Thompson for Love? How many more trades that like that have we not even heard of? Yes, alas, what each of these top 5 teams have in common is their ability to find franchise players outside of the top 5 or top 10, and elite level trading. Heck, Masai's imprints are still on the Nuggets, when you trace the lineage back.

Tanking is overrated. The "genius" Hinkie basically sold off every possible decent asset, got as bad as possible, then basically would only draft highest ceiling available or euro stash guys. Wow what a genius . 4 years of absolute brutal pain to become the Easts 4th seed. Hooray.

Yeah the true litmus test for tanking will be Philly. They did the clean, proper "tank". If they win a championship in the next 5 years as a direct result of the tank, then I'll be a convert and believe it's an effective strategy. If not, then to me it's confirmation it's an overrated strategy. Fultz already looking like a bust, we'll see if Simmons/Embiid (or players they get by potentially moving said players) will get them a ring.

[golden]

Yeah the true litmus test for tanking will be Philly. They did the clean, proper "tank". If they win a championship in the next 5 years as a direct result of the tank, then I'll be a convert and believe it's an effective strategy. If not, then to me it's confirmation it's an overrated strategy. Fultz already looking like a bust, we'll see if Simmons/Embiid (or players they get by potentially moving said players) will get them a ring.

I would actually give a few kudos to Hinkie and call him the exception to tanking. He actually had a strategy and the cajones to execute that extreme strategy for as long as it took - damn the torpedoes. Hinkie's main thesis was to accumulate and burn through as many picks as possible to evaluate as quickly as possible and find that transcendent guy (which he did... Embiid). Problem was he was treating players like cattle in a business where people skills and relationships matter and also making a mockery of the draft process, which is why the NBA intervened and forced the Colangelo family onto them. Hinkie had the plan and the cajones, but ownership ultimately couldn't withstand the pressure from the NBA and the court of public opinion.

That said, Philly winning doesn't mean that tanking works because the T-Wolves executed even a better tank. They acquired back-to-back #1 picks who were ROYs (Wiggins, Towns) plus high potential lottery talent (Dunn, Lavine) and should have also had Markkanen. Again, same issue: ownership panicked because the losing culture was becoming ingrained and brought in Butler.