Comparing last years Raps to this years team by position there isn't a huge drop off unless you think Bosh makes a difference of 10-20 wins.
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b/r: "Raptors Will Challenge the NBA's Worst All-Time Record"
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Apollo wrote: View PostI think Bosh is at least a 10 game difference maker. Their win percentage went down significantly with him out and that was padded by some very weak opponents. They couldn't beat anyone who had a competitive team.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/...johnsam01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/.../boshch01.html
Johnson and Bargani had a better calculated won loss record than Bosh and Bargnani that is a fact not an "I think"
Here are the top five in minutes Bargnani - Johnson Units Calculated W - L Records
8 – 4
10 – 4
7 – 4
7 – 5
9 – 5
Here are the top five in minutes Bosh – Bargnani five man units Calculated W-L Records
9 – 20
15 – 16
12 – 13
9 – 2
10 – 6
http://nba-25-15.blogspot.com/2010/0...breakdown.html
Yea you can say that Bosh played mostly against starters and Johnson mostly against a mixture of starters and bench players but there is no proof that Johnson's numbers won't be even better as a starter than as a bench player. They were in the five games that he started in 09-10 two of which were against playoff teams.
It is like the baseball player who actually hits better in the majors than the minors for a number reasons no need to go into them here.
Your comment is not based upon any fact whatsoever but only an opinion. Having said that I respect your opinion but on this issue the facts indicate that most likely your opinion will be proven wrong. #pause.Avatar: Riverboat Coffee House 134 Yorkville Ave. billboard of upcoming entertainers - Circa 1960s
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“As a captain, I played furiously. I drew a lot of fouls, but I brought everything I had to every practice and to every game. I left everything on the court because I simply wanted the team to win”
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Can your stats factor in that Amir has been a minor role player his entire career where as Bosh has made many all-star games and gets doubled a lot? Let me know what you think.
Also, if you're going for accuracy, wouldn't it be best to compare their last season together? How does that look?Last edited by Apollo; Sun Jul 18, 2010, 10:18 PM.
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I swear people are idiots! Some of you guys wouldn't know talent if it slapped you in the mouth, which im hoping happens to some of you. I don't know who the hell you guys think Chris Bosh is, but he's not a freaking legendary elite player. Bargnani has a change to be better than him! If you actually watched Andrea at the end of last season you saw a different player a more aggressive one. And Hedo?? really Hedo? Hedon't didn't do shit for us last year but lose of games. We're more athletic. Better shooting(with Barbs and Kleiza) And probably have more talent than last year. Fkkk Chris Bosh and Hedon't! Some of you fans need to get off their nuts and stop bitching about how horrible this team is gonna be before they step on the court! Who though OK city was gonna be good? and the Bucks? Exactly! What did they have? a big young scorer(Bargs) a steady point guard(Jarrett Jack) and role players ( Kleiza, Barbs, Demar, Sonny, Amir) Stfu guys and let the men play!
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your mom wrote: View PostIm not understanding why the raptors couldnt be better than they were last season. Its been stated constantly that bosh was no leader off the court, which basically translates to replacing 22 and 12 next season. With the offence finally free from the shackles of having to dump it to him every possesssion next season, do you really think that bargnani, derozan and amir/sonny cant step it up a few points and plug the hole completely? Along with that we have an improved D and players that actually try. Im predicting 40-45 wins next season and and the 8th spot, with a beatdown by the Heat in 4 games.
Bosh may not have been a leader, but you don't simply replace a perennial All-Star as good as Bosh is by doing a little basic math. Basketball is more than numbers and math.Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
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Buddahfan wrote: View PostJohnson has a higher career WS/48 than Bosh. .159 vs .158 That is a fact not an "I think"
http://www.basketball-reference.com/...johnsam01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/.../boshch01.html
Johnson and Bargani had a better calculated won loss record than Bosh and Bargnani that is a fact not an "I think"
Here are the top five in minutes Bargnani - Johnson Units Calculated W - L Records
8 – 4
10 – 4
7 – 4
7 – 5
9 – 5
Here are the top five in minutes Bosh – Bargnani five man units Calculated W-L Records
9 – 20
15 – 16
12 – 13
9 – 2
10 – 6
http://nba-25-15.blogspot.com/2010/0...breakdown.html
Yea you can say that Bosh played mostly against starters and Johnson mostly against a mixture of starters and bench players but there is no proof that Johnson's numbers won't be even better as a starter than as a bench player. They were in the five games that he started in 09-10 two of which were against playoff teams.
It is like the baseball player who actually hits better in the majors than the minors for a number reasons no need to go into them here.
Your comment is not based upon any fact whatsoever but only an opinion. Having said that I respect your opinion but on this issue the facts indicate that most likely your opinion will be proven wrong. #pause.
i know, i know, there's a (small) sample of games in which he stepped up in bosh's absence - but no statistician would take that small a sample size & use it to extrapolate what he'll do over the course of an entire season. i think we're all very hopeful that he can, just skeptical. prove us wrong, amir...prove us wrong.TRUE LOVE - Sometimes you know it the instant you see it across the bar.
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Tim W. wrote: View PostYou're vastly underestimating Bosh's effect on the court. True, Bosh wasn't much of a leader, but it's not simply a matter of "replacing" his scoring and rebounding. It doesn't work that way. It's not simply a case of players increasing their scoring slightly to make up the difference. It's about situations and when you get baskets. When the defense clamps down, who is going to be able to make the difficult basket? Who is going to create the double teams and distract the defense to allow others to get open looks? Who is going to manufacture points when the shots aren't falling? Who is going to score in the last 2 minutes of a close game? For all of Bosh's failures, he was usually the main reason the Raptors would end up with a win at the end of games. And there's a big difference between role players stepping up on occasion, as they do during the season, to doing it consistently. That's the difference between a role player and an All- Star.
Bosh may not have been a leader, but you don't simply replace a perennial All-Star as good as Bosh is by doing a little basic math. Basketball is more than numbers and math.
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If you're saying Bosh was the reason the Raptors won at the end of games then you have to admit he was also the reason they lost at the end of games.
With a more balanced attack and an emphasis on D the last two minutes are sure to look different than with Bosh constantly demanding the ball.
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Tim W.;30669[B wrote:]IT'S THE BLEACHER REPORT!![/B]
I don't think the Raptors are going to be horribly bad. They do have some talent, they are a very athletic team and they're going to win a few games just by getting out and running. I'd guess somewhere between 20 and 30 games, which is a far cry from vying for the worst record of all time.
there all fans.If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?
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j bean wrote: View PostIf you're saying Bosh was the reason the Raptors won at the end of games then you have to admit he was also the reason they lost at the end of games.
With a more balanced attack and an emphasis on D the last two minutes are sure to look different than with Bosh constantly demanding the ball.
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j bean wrote: View PostIf you're saying Bosh was the reason the Raptors won at the end of games then you have to admit he was also the reason they lost at the end of games.
With a more balanced attack and an emphasis on D the last two minutes are sure to look different than with Bosh constantly demanding the ball.Read my blog, The Picket Fence. Guaranteed to make you think or your money back!
Follow me on Twitter.
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