Melo trade: makes Bosh deal way worse than Carter deal

[Apollo]

I agree its a double standard, but Colangelo represents more than just himself and his own opinion. He is the face of an entire organization, and comments like that could contribute to a negative perception by players throughout the league of the team specifically and playing in Toronto generally. If the goal is to make Toronto a perennial contender, the front office has to make this atmosphere more welcoming to elite level talent, not less. Comments like that (even if true) don't help in the long term, and could only be interpreted as Colangelo trying to diminish criticism of him by the Toronto media. He should have had a thicker skin, been the bigger man, so that all of Toronto doesn't come across as small town, whiny, haters (hello Cleveland)

I understand what you're saying but I don't think his comments hurt his image at all. Prime example, Melo made sure last month to differentiate himself from Bosh, suggesting that he's keeping it real with the Nuggets and not misleading
them. "I'm not Chris Bosh" - Carmelo Anthony

[madeupid25]

I think the worst fuck up is us not getting Pietrus and Gortat for Turkoglu.

Ya, I don't think that would have been possible. Turk's contract last summer was compared to Arenas' in how hard it would be to move. Orlando had to be convinced by a string of early losses that they needed to make a move to stay competitive with Boston and Miami. Phoenix also made a huge error in thinking that Turk could in any way help compensate offensively for the loss of Stoudemire. That was a deal that arose from each team's desperation to make a move. Orlando was desperate to remain competitive (and avoid eventually joining Cleveland, Toronto, and Denver in losing their all star player, which is now more likely than ever), and Phoenix was desperate to dump Turk's contract. Unless Orlando gets back to the NBA finals (unlikely), I think this was a losing gamble. Rashard Lewis' deal has less years on it than Arenas, and the combination of Turk and Arenas contracts puts the Magic in the worst cap situation in the NBA going into a possible lockout. Phoenix made a pretty smart move, especially if they didn't intend to resign J Rich. Carter's deal next year is only partially guaranteed, so he won't cost them much. The next thing Phoenix should do, is deal Nash, and kick start a rebuild, since their owner is a cheap SOB, I wouldn't be surprised if he's gone by next summer.

[golden]

First of all, Bosh never led on anybody to believe he was going to re-up with Toronto as a preferred destination. He repeatedly stated that he was keeping his all his options open, and that the Raptors were one of the teams he would consider. Secondly, pretty much everybody in the basketball world was convinced that Bosh would not choose Toronto. Even a full year before his free agent year, they were having polls and such, and most people were convinced he was going to NY or Miami.

Therefore, it is valid to suggest that BC mis-read the situaion and was betting the future on a scenario that had very low probability. BC was actually going against the grain of popular opinion on what most people predicted would happen. They were right and BC was wrong.

Check out these articles from 2009....

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/s...s09-BoshFuture

http://stephenablog.typepad.com/step...02/boshed.html

[mcHAPPY]

I think the worst fuck up is us not getting Pietrus and Gortat for Turkoglu.

Turk is playing great for ORL (bastard!) but when that trade went down, ORL made the trade to get Richardson. PHX said you only get Richardson if you take Turk.

[madeupid25]

I was totally down with Colangelo throwing Bosh under the bus. Bosh deserved it. Players do it all the time to their former teams and most people shake their head and feel sorry for the guy for having to go through his own described living multimillion dollar luxurious hell. As soon as a "Suit" does it to a former player though it's uncalled for, immature and unprofessional. How dare that Suit suggest that player lied to him even though that player did lie to him. How dare that Suit suggest that player phoned it in even if it looked like he phoned it in. How dare that Suit stand up for his club like that when the dust has settled and diplomacy no longer helps his club improve.

I agree its a double standard, but Colangelo represents more than just himself and his own opinion. He is the face of an entire organization, and comments like that could contribute to a negative perception by players throughout the league of the team specifically and playing in Toronto generally. If the goal is to make Toronto a perennial contender, the front office has to make this atmosphere more welcoming to elite level talent, not less. Comments like that (even if true) don't help in the long term, and could only be interpreted as Colangelo trying to diminish criticism of him by the Toronto media. He should have had a thicker skin, been the bigger man, so that all of Toronto doesn't come across as small town, whiny, haters (hello Cleveland)

[JoePanini]

I think the worst fuck up is us not getting Pietrus and Gortat for Turkoglu.

[Apollo]

Other than BC's comments about Bosh (which I recently read referred to as Dan Gilbert lite - which I feel is a pretty apt description) which came off as petty and vindictive (accurate though they may have been), I have been pretty satisfied with his performance since the rebuild strategy came to fruition. 2 years of solid drafting, dealing for Julian Wright, loved the Bayless trade etc. I think that drafting Bargnani, when he already had Bosh (in a terrible draft year) was a mistake, and the TJ / JO / Marion / Turk saga was bad, but as I said his recent performace has been decent. I have previously called for Colangelo's replacement before, but at this time, I would prob extend him for at least two more years and see where he takes this.

I was totally down with Colangelo throwing Bosh under the bus. Bosh deserved it. Players do it all the time to their former teams and most people shake their head and feel sorry for the guy for having to go through his own described living multimillion dollar luxurious hell. As soon as a "Suit" does it to a former player though it's uncalled for, immature and unprofessional. How dare that Suit suggest that player lied to him even though that player did lie to him. How dare that Suit suggest that player phoned it in even if it looked like he phoned it in. How dare that Suit stand up for his club like that when the dust has settled and diplomacy no longer helps his club improve.

[madeupid25]

Well, the Wolves got him for basically nothing, so I think it makes sense that if Toronto wanted him (in the Bosh deal), he would have been sent here. Bargnani and Beasley could put up crazy points but would also give up a lot as well. Beasley's off court issues obviously made him undesirable to the Raps front office, even given potential.

[mcHAPPY]

He should've taken a year of Beasley and then traded him for something.

Again, another much discussed subject.

The chances of Beasley being a bust were much greater than his chances of doing what he is doing. The talent was always there, the head wasn't.

BC and many other GM's passed on the guy. The fact a second overall pick was traded 2 years removed from the draft for a second round pick speaks volumes.

With that said, congrats to Beasley for putting it together and congrats to Kahn for having the gamble pay off (the gamble was team chemistry, personal problems, $6M dollars in salary, and a second round draft pick).

[madeupid25]

Melo isn't colluding with other stars in some sort of basketball coup.

Not sure about that... Melo shares representation with (CP3 one year left on his contract) I think the Nets are only planning on Billups filling the void until they can get Chris Paul's name on a contract. I wouldn't be surprised if Rose and William Wesley have mentioned that to Melo.

Colangelo got all he could of what Miami had left.

Agreed. I had meant to mention on my last comment that after BC had allowed the situation to play out he did get the best return that he could. (Even if part of that had been assets he already gave up when Pat Riley swindled BC in to 2010 cap flexability to swap JO for Marion)

Other than BC's comments about Bosh (which I recently read referred to as Dan Gilbert lite - which I feel is a pretty apt description) which came off as petty and vindictive (accurate though they may have been), I have been pretty satisfied with his performance since the rebuild strategy came to fruition. 2 years of solid drafting, dealing for Julian Wright, loved the Bayless trade etc. I think that drafting Bargnani, when he already had Bosh (in a terrible draft year) was a mistake, and the TJ / JO / Marion / Turk saga was bad, but as I said his recent performace has been decent. I have previously called for Colangelo's replacement before, but at this time, I would prob extend him for at least two more years and see where he takes this.

[mcHAPPY]

A year ago at this time, playoffs or no, did any of you guys seriously think Bosh was going to resign in Toronto?

Actually, yes. Bosh had resigned once before. He made repeated comments about wanting to be with a winning franchise (after a slow start, they certainly were doing that). He also made numerous comments about wanting to be 'the man' of a franchise.

[Apollo]

Do we have a source confirming without a doubt that they offered Beasley? Someone from the Heat's or Raptors' inner circle?

[Brain Colangelo]

Colangelo got all he could of what Miami had left.

He should've taken a year of Beasley and then traded him for something.

[Apollo]

Are you guys hearing the return the Nuggets are going to get for Melo?

Devin Harris
Derrick Favors
2 1st round picks

The way BC/Bosh handled this seriously fucked up and cost the Raps organization some assets.

What can you say about Bosh? He is a pansy he was only signing where LBJ/Wade were - whatever he is what he is, a glorified role player.

But its BCs job to handle the Raps assets. He should have traded him a year earlier instead of making a run for mediocrity with Hedo. Even without Bosh signing with the team he is traded to, Raps would have got a 1st rounder or a very good young player out of it.

Losing the "Bosh asset" for the TPE is way worse than the VC deal people!!!!!

That trade sounds nice for the Nuggets but it doesn't even remotely make the Bosh deal look like the Carter deal. First off the Carter deal involved two scrubs, a guy who publicly threatened not to show if he were traded to Toronto and some crappy picks. The Bosh deal gave the Raptor free money to use how they saw fit. No horrible Zo buyouts required, no listening to Eric Williams bitch about not getting PT and how much he hates Toronto and no watching Aaron Williams do little of anything. Second, Carter was locked into many years but Bosh was a free agent. The Raptors didn't have any leverage with Bosh but still came out with something. Moving on, Melo is a far superior player to Chris Bosh. The Nuggets deserve more from him than what the Raptors got for Bosh. Finally, the Nuggets are in a much better situation than the Raptors were. Melo isn't colluding with other stars in some sort of basketball coup. He wants to play in a bigger market and his decision isn't hinging on two other much bigger stars, he's the biggest star on the market this summer. He decides how the dominos fall. Teams talking to the Nuggets aren't gutted like the Heat were. Colangelo got all he could of what Miami had left. He could have pulled the trigger last season but who's to say teams were offering more than he got in the summer? Bosh was not willing to show his cards and so who's going to sell the farm for a non-committal superego? We'll never know.

One more thing. Do you remember the roster the season after Carter was traded? It was f'in horrible. Zo was eating Raptors cap to play in Miami. Eric Williams was a cancer in the locker room and Aaron Williams a worthless player on a worthless team. This Raptors team is far better than that Raptors team. Things could be a lot worse.

[madeupid25]

lol RUUU and I wrote almost the same thing at the same time... to follow up on that, I think if you asked any GM in any sport, would they trade their star player in the midst of a playoff run, even given the risk that he might walk at the end of the season - 100% of them would say no. Teams don't want to lose out playoff revenue (I know 2 games big deal), and the
'prestige' of being a playoff team. I do think there is a fair comparison here between Denver and Toronto. Both players drafted in the same year, and (were) the best players on their respective teams. The CBA situation has limited Melo's options in a way that didnt happen for Bosh (and LBJ, Wade, Amare etc.) Our team probably would have been better off if BC had of pulled the trigger on a deal back in the summer of '09, and blown up the roster back then. We would be one year further into a rebuild, and hopefully would have been closer to becoming a competitive team. However, most GM's halfway through their contract, having had their original gameplan (building around Bosh) fall flat on its face, wouldnt have the stones (brains) to pull off that kind of deal.