Colangelo's Job Safe Long Term? (New article referenced in post #115)

[MangoKid]

But I don't understand why Kevin Pritchard is always the defacto, go to GM for hire. As I said earlier in this post, a few before you suggested him; there is a reason why he was fired, and has NOT even been offered a job yet.

He's not that good of an evaluator. He drafted Oden over Durant for Christ's sake.
Tried to block the league from signing Darius Miles.. which was ILLEGAL.
Traded ALL-STAR Zach Randolph for Steve Francis, and Channing Frye.
Used a trade exception for James Jones.
Besides trading for BRoy, which is turning out to only be an OKAY deal; what has he done?

Let's not forget that he gave BRoy that contract even though he knew his knees were hamburger.

[sleepz]

Oh, right, because Bargnani, Davis and DeRozan weren't drafted by Colangelo.

What's your point? Is this the budding nucleus of a championship team?
The Raps are a team that is missing their best player and considering we had a #1 pick not too long ago I would have hoped that we would have had more talent than we currently do.

I tihnk those players are good but to me there is only upside with DeRozan and Davis and even then I can't say any of those players will be stars, especially the way we develop players to score but don't worry about defending.

[sleepz]

I guess if that's what you do with your life, that's what you do.




So Bosh never complained that he needed someone to protect him in the middle? Fuck, the guy's still complaining about it in South Beach. So Colangelo went out and got Jermaine O'Neal. Colangelo signed Jarrett Jack - one of Bosh's best friends. Bosh even made calls to Hedo in the summer of 2009 to get him to join the Raptors. So to say that Colangelo didn't bend over backwards to help Bosh is foolish.




You praise Cho, in an earlier post, but he hasn't done anything as of yet.



Right, so Durant was a RFA and he'd get the most money with OKC, so he re-ups. Westbrook will follow suit, but it's easy to have a franchise player land in your lap and to go with it. OKC's franchise is built upon 3 top-5 picks. Not so hard too hard to equate success when you put it like that. Like I've said before, let's see how good of a GM Presti is in 5-6 years when Durant and Westbrook are UFAs and is being enticed by places like New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, Miami - hell, anywhere than OKC. There's nothing to do there. It isn't exactly a "spot" on the NBA circuit. Both guys are not getting any real exposure there. I wouldn't call OKC's management stable. Shit, they just upped and left Seattle a few years ago. Should the well run dry in Oklahoma City, who's to say Bennett won't pack up and leave for Kansas City?
As for Portland, let's see what happens next season before heaping praise on their organization and saying they're in much better position. Oden's constantly injured, Przybilla's a FA as is Camby. Miller is a potential FA, Fernandez wants out of Portland. This coming off-season for the Blazers is going to be a big one.

As for the TPE - there is still the draft to use to to get a pick out of a team who might want to dump a contract. It's good until July 13th. But hey, can't see the big picture, eh big guy?



There are 29 other teams in the NBA who would love to have DeRozan or Bargnani right now. There are teams that would love a pure PG like Calderon. There are a lot of teams that would love a guy like Amir Johnson off of the bench. Keep drinking the haterade, brother. Drink it by the gallon.

Bosh complained about not having a swing man and if he did want some help in the middle drafting Bargnani was the remedy. lol

Call me a hater or whatever you want. The 29 teams that would love to have Bargnani or DeRozan wouldn't give up anything significasnt to get them and they would most likely be coming off the pine.

[Apollo]

But I don't understand why Kevin Pritchard is always the defacto, go to GM for hire. As I said earlier in this post, a few before you suggested him; there is a reason why he was fired, and has NOT even been offered a job yet.

He's not that good of an evaluator. He drafted Oden over Durant for Christ's sake.
Tried to block the league from signing Darius Miles.. which was ILLEGAL.
Traded ALL-STAR Zach Randolph for Steve Francis, and Channing Frye.
Used a trade exception for James Jones.
Besides trading for BRoy, which is turning out to only be an OKAY deal; what has he done?

I know why he was fired. I created a whole thread for it on the NBA board. How do you know what he's been offered or what he's been looking at? There is nothing shameful about losing out to Billy King for the Nets job.

Oden was the consensus number one pick. It's not fair to criticize him for that one using 20/20 hindsight. The Miles thing was a ploy to save the Blazers a lot of money and he did nothing illegal. The league blocked him and that was that. I'm sure Blazers fans were outraged that he wanted to stop Miles from continuing to get paid huge sums of money for doing nothing. If the Miles saga went down in Toronto the man would be public enemy #1. He traded headcase Zach Randolph to get rid of him and it was applauded because everyone at the time thought he was untradeable given his lack of character, effort and the sheer size of his contract. He got in trouble with the law, was lazy, out of shape and a cancer on the court in the dressing room. A total jackass. Channing Frye is a solid player. The trade wasn't about improving talent, it was addition by subtraction for a rebuilding team who did not want bad influences in the dressing room on those young and highly impressionable kids. He drafted Aldridge and Roy. Traded for Batum on draft day. Got Rudy Fernandez for peanuts. Flipped Jerryd Bayless in a trade involving Jarret Jack. Signed both Andre Miller and Marcus Camby. The Raptors haven't had a guy playing point or center who are as good as those two in the past decade by the way...

Most GMs who get fired take a hiatus for a little bit before coming back. It's common. Most GMs get axed at one point or another. Even a lot of the greats. Like I said, Glen Grunwald has a better track record in Toronto that Colangelo and he's never got another GM position again.

[Edgar]

Just going to throw this out there. Glen Grunwald accomplished more than Bryan Colangelo has in Toronto.

Depending on your position - yes. But it's much easier to look good when you're spending into oblivion. By the time Grunwald left we were a horrible team that had a huge payroll compared to roster talent and very few movable assets - Same thing with Babcock (although his biggest issues were drafting and lack of creativity with his assets) and Jalen Rose. Poor Wayne Embry had to clean up that mess enough to make the team marketable to any incoming GM. Wayne Embry is the closest thing to a perfect GM mold for a rebuilding team. Does his job well and refuses to make short-sighted moves based on the players/Media/Fanbase...

I think Colangelo and his team has their faults but is by far the most creative in the league. They've pulled off trades that are barely-legal, seemingly financially impossible and have proven that they can transform expendable assets into exactly what they want...

[MangoKid]

What's your point?

What's my point?

Who has Colangelo drafted for the Raps? lol

Looks like I just gave it to you above.

Is this the budding nucleus of a championship team?

You gotta start somewhere. You gotta accumulate assets somehow and if they're not gonna help us, they can be packaged for assets that could help us.

The Raps are a team that is missing their best player and considering we had a #1 pick not too long ago I would have hoped that we would have had more talent than we currently do.

Considering the draft was devoid of a clear cut #1 pick in the draft, I believe we selected a very good player.

I tihnk those players are good but to me there is only upside with DeRozan and Davis and even then I can't say any of those players will be stars, especially the way we develop players to score but don't worry about defending.

It's still way too early to write off Bargnani. His game is still evolving. But you're a half-empty kind of guy, so I wouldn't expect anything less.

[MangoKid]

Bosh complained about not having a swing man and if he did want some help in the middle drafting Bargnani was the remedy. lol

Bosh complained about not having a centre - so Colangelo goes out to acquire O'Neal. Bosh complains about not having a swingman, so Colangelo throws 8 million a year at Ariza only for him to reject it to sign a lesser deal with Houston. Who was the next best swingman on the list? Hedo.

Call me a hater or whatever you want. The 29 teams that would love to have Bargnani or DeRozan wouldn't give up anything significasnt to get them and they would most likely be coming off the pine.

Well, you're the expert.

[Tim W.]

I probably shouldn't be telling you all this, because we don't want anything getting out to the media (so please don't tell anyone), but MLSE has tapped me as the next GM for the Raptors. They're going to release Colangelo as soon as the season is over and hire me.

On a side note, if Peter Vescey wrote it, you can pretty much bank on it.

[sleepz]

I guess if that's what you do with your life, that's what you do.




So Bosh never complained that he needed someone to protect him in the middle? Fuck, the guy's still complaining about it in South Beach. So Colangelo went out and got Jermaine O'Neal. Colangelo signed Jarrett Jack - one of Bosh's best friends. Bosh even made calls to Hedo in the summer of 2009 to get him to join the Raptors. So to say that Colangelo didn't bend over backwards to help Bosh is foolish.




You praise Cho, in an earlier post, but he hasn't done anything as of yet.



Right, so Durant was a RFA and he'd get the most money with OKC, so he re-ups. Westbrook will follow suit, but it's easy to have a franchise player land in your lap and to go with it. OKC's franchise is built upon 3 top-5 picks. Not so hard too hard to equate success when you put it like that. Like I've said before, let's see how good of a GM Presti is in 5-6 years when Durant and Westbrook are UFAs and is being enticed by places like New York, Chicago, Los Angeles, Miami - hell, anywhere than OKC. There's nothing to do there. It isn't exactly a "spot" on the NBA circuit. Both guys are not getting any real exposure there. I wouldn't call OKC's management stable. Shit, they just upped and left Seattle a few years ago. Should the well run dry in Oklahoma City, who's to say Bennett won't pack up and leave for Kansas City?
As for Portland, let's see what happens next season before heaping praise on their organization and saying they're in much better position. Oden's constantly injured, Przybilla's a FA as is Camby. Miller is a potential FA, Fernandez wants out of Portland. This coming off-season for the Blazers is going to be a big one.

As for the TPE - there is still the draft to use to to get a pick out of a team who might want to dump a contract. It's good until July 13th. But hey, can't see the big picture, eh big guy?



There are 29 other teams in the NBA who would love to have DeRozan or Bargnani right now. There are teams that would love a pure PG like Calderon. There are a lot of teams that would love a guy like Amir Johnson off of the bench. Keep drinking the haterade, brother. Drink it by the gallon.

I also didn't praise Cho. I gave an example of an assistant GM that was highly thought of throughout the league that was hired by another team. This was in response to the "who else can they hire" argument that is used to justify Colangelo staying here. Colangelo won't be here forever, and when he is gone they will hire a new GM. He's not irreplaceable and considering the results, the team he has assembled and future of the squad I don't see how anyone can say he's done a good job or deserves an extension. I'm not worried about who else can they hire, only can they hire someone to do a better job and looking at the past 5 years of this organization I definitely think they can.

[MangoKid]

I also didn't praise Cho. I gave an example of an assistant GM that was highly thought of throughout the league that was hired by another team. This was in response to the "who else can they hire" argument that is used to justify Colangelo staying here. Colangelo won't be here forever, and when he is gone they will hire a new GM. He's not irreplaceable and considering the results, the team he has assembled and future of the squad I don't see how anyone can say he's done a good job or deserves an extension. I'm not worried about who else can they hire, only can they hire someone to do a better job and looking at the past 5 years of this organization I definitely think they can.

This team has gone through hiring the inexperienced kind. Anyone is replacable in the sports business, but is it really smart to recycle GMs every few years? At least for this franchise? At this venture, I'd say no.

[sleepz]

What's my point?

Looks like I just gave it to you above.

You gotta start somewhere. You gotta accumulate assets somehow and if they're not gonna help us, they can be packaged for assets that could help us.


Considering the draft was devoid of a clear cut #1 pick in the draft, I believe we selected a very good player.


It's still way too early to write off Bargnani. His game is still evolving. But you're a half-empty kind of guy, so I wouldn't expect anything less.

You don't know what kind of guy I am so save the analysis of things you have no knowledge of.

You gotta start somewhere? He's not a newly hired GM. He's been here for quite some time so why is he starting now?

Packaging assets for others that can help us? Based on his track record with the Raptors why would anyone think he is the man for the job to achieve this?

I haven't written off Bargnani. I just know he's the player that he is. We shouldn't wait another 3 years to see if he will value the concept of team and do the things they need to do to win. I'm looking for complete players not one dimensional scorers. There is a place for them on every team don't get me wrong but it's hard for me to understand or justify someone taking 18+ shots a game but not giving it his all on the other end for his teams sake.

[sleepz]

Alright, so the Raptors made the playoffs twice under Colangelo's watch. How many times did they make it with Zeke again?



My thoughts exactly. Add in great finds like Anthony Parker, Jorge Garbajosa, Sonny Weems, JaMario Moon, Julian Wright and Amir Johnson without giving up much in assets.

So it was Colangelo's accomplishments that they made the playoffs those years or the players and the coaching staff that achieved this?

If they made the playoffs 2 years under a particualr coach wouldn't it be logical from a GM's perspective to retain said coach who took you to the playoffs and was given COY?

[TheGloveinRapsUniform]

Only the stability of losing, and ensuring there will be 6 new players on the roster every year.

Where and when has there ever been stability in Colangelo's reign as the GM of the Raptors?

youve awaken the dragon! hahaha we've been wondering where youve gone sleepz. BC threads always hits a nerve! hahaha

[sleepz]

Bosh complained about not having a centre - so Colangelo goes out to acquire O'Neal. Bosh complains about not having a swingman, so Colangelo throws 8 million a year at Ariza only for him to reject it to sign a lesser deal with Houston. Who was the next best swingman on the list? Hedo.



Well, you're the expert.

So the Ariza attempted signing was the swingman solution? Great solution there as I'm sure the Hornets or Rockets will attest to.

The GM was being held captive by 1 players wishes?lol

I'm no expert but I know results when I see them and I haven't seen too many under Colangelo's tenure.

[sleepz]

youve awaken the dragon! hahaha we've been wondering where youve gone sleepz. BC threads always hits a nerve! hahaha

LOL, always, especially when the argument gets made that they should keep him cuz who else would they hire.

Boggles the mind. There are many good GM's in the league currently that I'm sure when they were intially hired not too many people knew about them but when they actually got on the job and built solid teams they became known.

I don't buy into the who will they hire argument, or who else will come here nonsense.