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Core + 2 = Winning Team?

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  • pesterm1
    replied
    pran wrote: View Post
    out of curiosity, who would flip bargnani for a 10-15th pick? where we can draft a big man
    no way... 10-15 in a weak draft. we may end up with a total bust. for a 3-7 pick plus something else then possibly. its just as important to not under walue as it is not to over value.

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  • pesterm1
    replied
    pran wrote: View Post
    a few things i have noticed:

    -calderon is weak defensively, but still better than last season, he is an excellent ball distributor though, and is very flexible in his role we can definitely afford to keep him for a couple more years, no matter which direction this team is headed, he is not the long term solution though. He is more the "Bibby" of the raptors than anything
    -Bargnani has shown no improvement defensively imo, I would be happy to see him traded for a draft pick where we can get a prospect centre.
    -Derozan is bad defensively, he needs to work on this more than anything this off-season, then next season we will see if he is part of the solution, if not he also needs to go. He has all the physical tools, lets see what he does
    -I hope we draft barnes, a lot of scouting reports say he has the potential to be a lock-down defender
    -Don't look for Ed to put on any bulk, its highly unlikely, I see him more as a PF....a really good PF.
    -There is no Guarantee that Kanter will be good defensively as scouting reports have said he is slow to rotate....but as he is so young im willing to give him a chance.
    Why is it unliekly that Ed bulks up? id say thats number one on his list this summer. the added muscle alone would do wonders for his game.

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  • pesterm1
    replied
    Balls of Steel wrote: View Post
    Matt, dunno if it's workable but Bargs for Josh Smith and parts would be good right (or sign and trade)? I mean they want a true center (I know that Bargs isn't) but paired with Horford, they still form one heck of a tandem. As for J-Smove, he would be very nice alongside Davis. What a pair!!!

    PS> I woke up wet too!
    Josh smith is the exact player the raptors are trying trying to be. the supser athletic, high flying, player. he would be a HUGE crowd favorite here...opps, just wet the sheets.

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  • Balls of Steel
    replied
    pran wrote: View Post
    out of curiosity, who would flip bargnani for a 10-15th pick? where we can draft a big man
    I think he can go higher than that. Say, 8? I'm splitting hair here.

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  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    GarbageTime wrote: View Post
    Maybe a bit harsh but his play since he was given an opportunity to start has proven what he is. I really don't want this team to take a chance on a guy that played well for a short stint, and then disappeared when given an opportunity (plus a guy who doesn't even shoot threes yet still shoots a bad fg% is just as unattractive a player as exists in this league). This team has too many players that are good at 1 or 2 things (and usually marginal things). It needs more well rounded and efficient players.

    Right now the only well rounded and efficient player is Amir. There's a long way to go.
    Sorry, if I came across as questioning your previous post. I am 100% in agreement. I wouldn't touch Fiddy, er, Stuckey with a 10 foot pole.

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  • pran
    replied
    out of curiosity, who would flip bargnani for a 10-15th pick? where we can draft a big man

    Leave a comment:


  • GarbageTime
    replied
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Harsh but an understandable reaction. He has fallen very far in many people's eyes. It was his play during a Billups hamstring injury that ultimately helped make the decision to trade Chauncey - that and Hamilton's extension.
    Maybe a bit harsh but his play since he was given an opportunity to start has proven what he is. I really don't want this team to take a chance on a guy that played well for a short stint, and then disappeared when given an opportunity (plus a guy who doesn't even shoot threes yet still shoots a bad fg% is just as unattractive a player as exists in this league). This team has too many players that are good at 1 or 2 things (and usually marginal things). It needs more well rounded and efficient players.

    Right now the only well rounded and efficient player is Amir. There's a long way to go.

    Leave a comment:


  • malefax
    replied
    A thousand times no to stuckey. I think Calderon is as good as the Raptors are likely to get at PG unless they win the lottery and draft Irving. I'm fine with that: Calderon can be a starter on a winning team. The big question is what BC will do with his gobs of free agency cash this summer (and what the new collective bargaining agreement will look like).

    Leave a comment:


  • JoePanini
    replied
    Tim W. wrote: View Post
    That's the issue ANY time you make a trade. One thing that bugs me is the counter that some people have against trading Bargnani is that they don't want to trade him without getting something of value back. OF COURSE, you want to get value back. That's the point of ANY trade. He's not Turkoglu, an aging, underperforming, overpaid, overweight malcontent. And Colangelo was still able to get Barbosa back for him. For all of Bargnani's faults, he's still a young, high scoring center that creates matchup problems with his game. I, personally, don't think his game is conducive to winning consistently, but the number of bad defensive players getting money thrown at them by mediocre and bad teams shows that there would be a market for him. What? I don't know exactly, but I'm not in charge of any teams, out there, so I can't say what the market would be for ANY player. I can only guess. And in the end, it only matters what those GMs think.
    Very true. Well I think we could get a guy like Gerald Wallace. The Bobcats got a bunch of scrubs for him... But Bargnani is an odd case, he is very talented, has a decent contract but is a horrid defender and rebounder. So no team really knows if they want him. A player which is decent at most fundamentals is a lot easier to trade for, because there is way less risk.

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  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    GarbageTime wrote: View Post
    Again right on the money Tim. The thought of Stuckey makes me puke a bit in my mouth.
    Harsh but an understandable reaction. He has fallen very far in many people's eyes. It was his play during a Billups hamstring injury that ultimately helped make the decision to trade Chauncey - that and Hamilton's extension.

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  • GarbageTime
    replied
    Tim W. wrote: View Post
    Ugh! I've never understood Raptor fans' fascination with Stuckey. He's a PG who doesn't pass, shoots a low percentage and way too much, and he can't hit from 3, which is not something you want for a backcourt mate with DeRozon. He's a great slasher and a decent defender, but that's it.

    As for the original post, I see DeRozan, Davis and Amir as being the only core players I'd want to keep. I wouldn't mind keeping Calderon around if they don't draft Irving. James Johnson has shown enough talent I'd want to see how he turns out. The rest I'd trade in a second if it gives the Raptors something of value back.
    Again right on the money Tim. The thought of Stuckey makes me puke a bit in my mouth.

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  • Tim W.
    replied
    JoePanini wrote: View Post
    That is the main issue
    That's the issue ANY time you make a trade. One thing that bugs me is the counter that some people have against trading Bargnani is that they don't want to trade him without getting something of value back. OF COURSE, you want to get value back. That's the point of ANY trade. He's not Turkoglu, an aging, underperforming, overpaid, overweight malcontent. And Colangelo was still able to get Barbosa back for him. For all of Bargnani's faults, he's still a young, high scoring center that creates matchup problems with his game. I, personally, don't think his game is conducive to winning consistently, but the number of bad defensive players getting money thrown at them by mediocre and bad teams shows that there would be a market for him. What? I don't know exactly, but I'm not in charge of any teams, out there, so I can't say what the market would be for ANY player. I can only guess. And in the end, it only matters what those GMs think.

    Leave a comment:


  • Balls of Steel
    replied
    Tim W. wrote: View Post
    Ugh! I've never understood Raptor fans' fascination with Stuckey. He's a PG who doesn't pass, shoots a low percentage and way too much, and he can't hit from 3, which is not something you want for a backcourt mate with DeRozon. He's a great slasher and a decent defender, but that's it.

    As for the original post, I see DeRozan, Davis and Amir as being the only core players I'd want to keep. I wouldn't mind keeping Calderon around if they don't draft Irving. James Johnson has shown enough talent I'd want to see how he turns out. The rest I'd trade in a second if it gives the Raptors something of value back.
    +1000!

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  • JoePanini
    replied
    Tim W. wrote: View Post
    Ugh! I've never understood Raptor fans' fascination with Stuckey. He's a PG who doesn't pass, shoots a low percentage and way too much, and he can't hit from 3, which is not something you want for a backcourt mate with DeRozon. He's a great slasher and a decent defender, but that's it.

    As for the original post, I see DeRozan, Davis and Amir as being the only core players I'd want to keep. I wouldn't mind keeping Calderon around if they don't draft Irving. James Johnson has shown enough talent I'd want to see how he turns out. The rest I'd trade in a second if it gives the Raptors something of value back.
    That is the main issue

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  • Tim W.
    replied
    tbihis wrote: View Post
    What do you guys think of Rodney Stuckey?
    He's an FA next year and i think he'll be a good fit with the Raps.
    Big guard who can defend the perimeter, slasher.
    Ugh! I've never understood Raptor fans' fascination with Stuckey. He's a PG who doesn't pass, shoots a low percentage and way too much, and he can't hit from 3, which is not something you want for a backcourt mate with DeRozon. He's a great slasher and a decent defender, but that's it.

    As for the original post, I see DeRozan, Davis and Amir as being the only core players I'd want to keep. I wouldn't mind keeping Calderon around if they don't draft Irving. James Johnson has shown enough talent I'd want to see how he turns out. The rest I'd trade in a second if it gives the Raptors something of value back.

    Leave a comment:

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