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The Lockout & the Raptors: Players approve CBA, Owners too! (1944)

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  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    Bendit wrote: View Post
    This is becoming like a house sale offer process. imo the decertification threat is posturing to squeeze the most. There is a about a 45 day wait before actual decertification occurs.
    The players are really calculating whether they want to miss another cheque.

    Did anyone follow that NBA Twitter dog&pony show. It's ridiculous that the complexities of a 4.5 billion dollar business disagreement are being discussed and information on its details disseminated in a social media forum restricting one to 140 words and is best used either for gossip or surreptitious comment by anon users trying to foment a revolution. And the process was like shooting fish in a barrel by Stern and his steno.
    I would agree with the analogy. The league is the one selling the house but the mortgage is paid off and they aren't in a rush to sell. The players who are buying the house have no leverage other than to walk away but they need a place to live because their house is sold and closing in 3 weeks.

    The TwitterView was good intentioned I think but it did not have the desired effects. I found the media who covered it to be like the characters in the movie "Mean Girls". Wallace at ESPN sent out a tweet with something to the effect of I can't believe the comments from media covering this, this is not our fight.

    Leave a comment:


  • Joey
    replied
    Bendit wrote: View Post
    This is becoming like a house sale offer process.
    Soo kinda like .. Negotiating? Indeed. haha

    Of course the Threat of Decertification is posturing.
    But when you're up against the entity that is The NBA, you must utililize all cards in the deck.

    But as Larry Coon points out, if the players wanted to play the same game that the NBA is currently playing, this process would be a LOT uglier.



    And I also, was wholey disheartened by the amount of 'Twitter' present within the Negotiations.
    Its ridiculous.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bendit
    replied
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Larry Coon raises a good point:

    I think the owners should look at any proposed changes and ask themselves, "Is it worth a season?"

    If so, fine.

    But I can't see anything worth that.
    This is becoming like a house sale offer process. imo the decertification threat is posturing to squeeze the most. There is a about a 45 day wait before actual decertification occurs.
    The players are really calculating whether they want to miss another cheque.

    Did anyone follow that NBA Twitter dog&pony show. It's ridiculous that the complexities of a 4.5 billion dollar business disagreement are being discussed and information on its details disseminated in a social media forum restricting one to 140 words and is best used either for gossip or surreptitious comment by anon users trying to foment a revolution. And the process was like shooting fish in a barrel by Stern and his steno.

    Leave a comment:


  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    Larry Coon raises a good point:



    LarryCoon ...we'll reset our proposal to 57%, file a decertification petition, kill the season, and see you in court." Who do you think blinks? 5 minutes ago · reply · retweet · favorite

    LarryCoon On league's "no tweaks" stance -- it's equally valid for players to say "This is OUR take-it-or-leave-it. Anything other than a 'yes' and

    I think the owners should look at any proposed changes and ask themselves, "Is it worth a season?"

    If so, fine.

    But I can't see anything worth that.

    Leave a comment:


  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    jimmie wrote: View Post
    ps-- Anyone know why the acronym for "shaking my head" gets censored on here???
    The acronym was abused by a former poster who has since been banned. Look through the comments from a year to a year-and-a-half ago and you'll see why. In hindsight it is pretty funny.

    Leave a comment:


  • jimmie
    replied
    ps-- Anyone know why the acronym for "shaking my head" gets censored on here???

    Leave a comment:


  • jimmie
    replied
    @daldridgetnt: "Awaiting @TheNBPA meeting in NYC this morning. Ran into player on the way. He said he still hadn't heard from his team's player rep. ***."
    ***, indeed. Etan Thomas, and the rest of the NBPA executive, should be embarassed. The players should be outraged. The agents are filling in the info gaps for the players, and that's not a good thing.

    Maybe they *should* decertify, because this union is NOT currently serving them very well.

    Leave a comment:


  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baske...11-11-2011.pdf


    There is the actual proposal from USAToday.

    It does not get more concrete than this.


    *EDIT*

    New luxury tax rules do not kick in until year 3 of deal but the 4 of 5 years rule starts accumulating in '11-12.

    Carmelo Rule:
    Extension-and-trades prohibited. If a player signs a contract extension, then the team is prohibited from trading the player for a period of six months following the date of the extension. If a team acquires a player in a trade, then the team is prohibited from signing the player to a contract extension for a period of six months following the date of the trade.

    Big Z Rule:
    Waiting period for trading team to re-sign traded player who is waived by recipient team is extended until the earlier of (i) one year from the date of the trade, or (ii) the July 1 following the last season of player’s contract.

    Cap holds are decreased - good for free agents and teams with cap room looking to resign their own players and other teams FA's.

    New trade rules for non-taxpayer: lesser of 150% + $100K or salaries being traded plus $5M.
    o Traded Player Exception increased for non-taxpayers such that the
    amount a non-taxpaying team has available to replace a traded
    player or players equals the lesser of (i) 150% of salaries of
    players being traded plus $100,000, or (ii) the salaries of players
    being traded plus $5M. (For purposes of this rule, team is a nontaxpayer
    if its post-trade team salary is below the Tax level.)

    Traded Player Exception for taxpayers equals 125% of the salaries
    of players being traded plus $100,000 (same as under 2005 CBA).
    Teams that go over the luxury tax 4 out of 5 years in the fourth year get $1 added to each $5M tax interval:
    Tax rates for teams that are taxpayers in at least 4 out of
    any 5 seasons (starting in 2011-12) increase by $1 at
    each increment (e.g., for team salary $5M-$10M above
    the Tax level, the Tax rate for a repeat taxpayer is $2.75-
    for-$1 instead of $1.75-for-$1).
    Sign and trade max length is 4 years and raises of 3.5% regardless of taxpayer or not.... in other words, Birds Rights not transferable (5 years and 6.5% raises).

    The Raps could put in a bid to get an amnestied player: say pick up 60% of contract, waiving team would pay remaining 40%.
    A modified waiver process would be utilized for players waived pursuant
    to the Amnesty rule, under which teams with Room under the Cap could
    submit competing offers to assume some but not all of the player’s
    remaining contract. If a player’s contract is claimed in this manner, the
    remaining portion of the player’s salary will continue to be paid by the
    team that waived him.
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Sun Nov 13, 2011, 09:17 PM.

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  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    Tim W. wrote: View Post
    The players have to learn the difference between restriction and incentive, among other things...
    http://www.wearingfilm.com/picketfen...-need-to-stfu/
    Nice article, Tim. Well written and well thought.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tim W.
    replied
    The players have to learn the difference between restriction and incentive, among other things...
    http://www.wearingfilm.com/picketfen...-need-to-stfu/

    Leave a comment:


  • Joey
    replied
    Bendit wrote: View Post
    No need for the NBAPA to. Stern will take calls from PA members.
    HAHAHA ... Zing!

    Leave a comment:


  • Bendit
    replied
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Via Twitter.com:





    The NBA is gone full steam ahead with clarifying, from their viewpoint, any misconceptions.

    It would be nice if the NBPA would do the same.

    No need for the NBAPA to. Stern will take calls from PA members.

    Leave a comment:


  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    Via Twitter.com:


    NBA NBA
    Have questions about the NBA's CBA proposal? Send them in to @NBA. David Stern & Adam Silver will be answering starting at 7pm/et.

    The NBA is gone full steam ahead with clarifying, from their viewpoint, any misconceptions.

    It would be nice if the NBPA would do the same.

    Leave a comment:


  • mcHAPPY
    replied
    stretch wrote: View Post
    What I get from this thread with all the numbers and quotes from twitter etc. is that most here want the players to simply rollover and cave so we can watch some hoops soon. I seriously don't mind taking a long break from NBA hoops because the owners have not bargained in good faith imo.
    And the players saying guaranteed contracts and a hard cap are blood issues which cannot be touched is bargaining in good faith?

    Realize the players position is they want to get paid maximum dollars in the location of their choice - which for the majority seem to be 4-5 cities.

    For the majority of fans in the league, the changes the league is pushing for are in the fans best interests along with the league.

    Take a look through the non-Twitter posts from 1523 onwards today. This deal is actually better for the 'middle class' of the league with each team having exemptions whether or not they are over the salary cap or the luxury tax. Since the median salary in the league is $2.33M and the smallest exemption is $2.5M, that seems like a pretty good deal.

    The biggest issue I can see the players left with is the 12% reduction to rookie deals and minimum contracts - which is also still open for negotiation from my understanding. *EDIT* actually it appears not to be open to negotiations as the 12% reduction corresponds to 12% drop in BRI for players.
    Last edited by mcHAPPY; Sun Nov 13, 2011, 05:28 PM.

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  • stretch
    replied
    What I get from this thread with all the numbers and quotes from twitter etc. is that most here want the players to simply rollover and cave so we can watch some hoops soon. I seriously don't mind taking a long break from NBA hoops because the owners have not bargained in good faith imo.

    Leave a comment:

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